BassGMan

I'm not familiar with the Torpedo show, but absolutely, if someone is just looking to buy comics and does not care for the rest of the hoopla then I would not recommend ANY big con.

Getting tickets is very tough, but after having been to San Diego, ECCC, Wonder Con and (the old) Chicago Con, nothing can compare to SDCC. Yes there are long lines for those who choose to stand in them, say get into some popular panel or line up for an exclusive, but I never stand in any line longer than five minutes the entire 4 1/2 day event. Remember, standing in a line anywhere is something people choose to do. Stand in line to get into a 10:00 show open, or walk up at 10:20 and walk right in? Stand in line for hours trying to see some celebrity speak or just not go? Line up at the food stands during lunch time or go in between meals when there are no lines. Yes there are crowds there in some of the popular areas, but if you are going for comics or Artist's Alley, no lines and very little crowds, except maybe at some hot artist's table where 10-15 people are surrounding it. ECCC can also get extremely crowded in some areas of the show, not unlike SDCC, but I just avoid those areas during those times. Remember, people choose to stand in lines, and in most cases they are not ever forced to. Granted, you'll miss out on some events or items this way, but for me at least, I'll pass the big crowd and long lines for all the other things that are easily accessible. Just like navigating Seattle traffic or SDCC (and other) con events, if you time it right and are fine missing some hyped events and items, the entire thing will be easy and comfortable. I'm also not into horror stories, long lines and crowds, and there is no way I'd endure that in SDCC or anywhere, and I never do. Anyway, just some suggestions. A con experience is often what you make of it.

Have you ever thought about SDCC? I know that tickets are almost impossible, but I'm just about to go for the 27th year in a row and there is nothing like it. Granted I haven't been to all the big shows, but this show is the highlight of my year. People complain about long lines, but if you know how to navigate it there are virtually no lines.

Now THAT is an accurate review of Seattle. Though I'm not as thrilled with the con though. But yeah, the Artist's Alley is the real deal.

He was wrong. The ocean is literally within walking distance of the convention center where ECCC is held. Maybe a 20 minute walk to all the piers. However this is not the open ocean and you'd need to take a 10-15 minute drive from there to west Seattle to hit the nearest sandy beach, Alki. Technically this is called the Puget Sound, but it is part of the Pacific Ocean.

No, that is downtown of course. But I was talking about the city as a whole. Above you said Seattle is overrun with homeless. Not at all. There is a homeless problem for sure, as there is in many large US cities. The cost of living here is crazy. And despite homelessness being a big problem in select pockets of the city (which gets a lot of press), most of the city is beautiful and safe. North Seattle is my favorite part of the city, followed by west Seattle. For the most part I avoid downtown, really just because traffic and parking is nuts.

Not hardly. There are some areas in Seattle where the homeless have run rampant, but the other 95% of the city is looking great. And I'm not just talking downtown where it is more prevalent in some areas. Seattle is a big city and mostly suburban neighborhoods.

I live just outside of Seattle and have gone to ECCC every year. The normal big show I go to every year is SDCC, but I went to the Chicago con twice when I think it was just called the Chicago con or something of the sort (before it was C2E2). While that was not SDCC by any means, it was a great show. Don't listen to those who talk about all the homeless in Seattle. I grew up here, and while there are certainly areas where the homeless have overrun the area and there are tents set up along parts of I-5 (and under, among some other places), MOST of the city is beautiful. Traffic is a bit dicey in downtown Seattle, but it is a big city and to be expected. With that said, I would not recommend to anyone to travel to ECCC, and especially not over the Chicago show. With one exception. The artist's alley at ECCC is spectacular, even better than at SDCC. But as far as a good selection of comic book dealers it is pathetic. Mostly toys, novelties and the usual pop culture. I live 20 minutes away from the show, but I find that half a day is good enough for me and I've seen everything. So unless you really enjoy artist's alley, then don't bother.

I hadn't noticed these before. The two pairs (without PN) have sold between $950 and $6,000! More recently they have been in the $1,000 range. The first legit after market passes I've seen being offered.

DC. Literally three seconds in a Google search is all that took. I was hoping for Seattle though, being a local.

Not me! I didn't get anything. Looking for two full passes if any exhibitors have any extra to offer.

Keep in mind that every line at SDCC is completely voluntary. People often gripe about the lines, but they choose to be in them. My general rule is that if a line is going to take more than 15 minutes for anything, I won't stand in line. Yes that means I miss out on some panels and exclusives, but I'd rather have that time than give it up to see a panel, get an autograph or buy a toy. There was one exception this year. I knew the Hall H presentation of Better Call Saul was not filling up so I decided I'd go to that one. Once there I saw that line to get in wasn't bad at all, but now in Hall H they are using metal detectors and bags are searched just like at the airport. So I dealt with that slow 30 minute line by choice. Next to that the longest line I stood in was 10 minutes for some great fish tacos in the flag pavilion. Some of the other panels fill up and some don't. Yes, most of the popular TV shows fill up but not all. Better Call Saul was only half filled, and my guess is that even though it is a great show, it is probably not prime viewing for an SDCC crowd. In years past I have gone to plenty of Room 20 TV show presentations and with some I walked right in, others I saw a huge line and heard it was filling up, so I passed. There is always something to do or see when you can't see a panel you were interested in. Also, no line at all to get into the show as long as you arrive 20-30 minutes after the open. EVERY LINE at SDCC is completely voluntary.

I just finished my 26th year in a row and I love every day of every year I go. I am also not a big spender. Heck, SDCC to me is really just 4 1/2 days full of cheap impulse buying. I spent more money on T-shirts than anything! Plus a few more silly things for fun. For comics, no way. Outside of buying some cool TPBs or HCs at 50% off cover, or full price at some of the tables like Drawn & Quarterly and Fantagraphics for books that just looked really cool, I'm not buying any actual comics, new or back issues of any kind. The selection is not that great and prices are often terrible. If these dealers price high in order to haggle, sorry I'm just not going to do it. Most of the prices for anything I see are ridiculous, so I keep walking. I did go to a golden age Wonder Woman panel that was fantastic. More about the backstory at the office than the character. So anyways, after that I headed downstairs to look into maybe buying a GA WW book from the period I was after. No way. Terrible selection and terrible prices. In the airport on the way home I bought one on Ebay, fantastic CGC graded book and great price, and earlier today I bought another on Ebay. So no, I would not suggest going to SDCC if you want to buy comics, or at least not anything pricey. You go for everything else that has nothing to do with money. I love Las Vegas too, but I am not a gambler. It is everything else to see and do. I would highly recommend going to SDCC, but you certainly do not need to go to spend money. Just go for fun, but sure, have some cash to take advantage of all the fun things you'll see there that you just have to have, and those things you always wanted that you never knew existed before. Sorry SDCC comic dealers out there, but most of you guys price too high, and that is fine for some buyers, but unless I see a fair price clearly posted on the books you are selling, I'll keep walkin'.

I can see why there was a problem with this lottery system, and why that in some cases it will save people time, but in other cases it makes the system worse. I see two people above signed up for things they really didn't even want. I imagine some people just signed up for everything to take a shot. And then when winning something they don't even want, then not even showing up to claim it, which is taking a chance away from someone who does really want the item. My guess is there will be a ton of no-shows from people who signed up for something they didn't want. We'll see how it goes. I'm sure the dealers will not have any problem figuring out another way to sell off what was being held out for those who won items they never intended to buy, but some fans who were genuinely interested in an item will have lost a chance due to others who signed up and won but were not even serious.

Oh I hear ya'. I like the new system too, and it is better than waiting only to possibly be disappointed when something sells out before you can buy one. With that said, I still expect a madhouse of buyers for each time slot. While this is a better system than before, it would need to be something mighty special for me to want to deal with the chaos even if I did win a time slot. If it goes more smoothly than I expect I'll give it a shot next year. Although I do miss out on a few events and items by not waiting or scrambling through crowds, it does make for a more pleasant con overall.

Are you guys excited? I sure am. It has been very quiet around here. I was however a bit disappointed with the programming this year. Very little that interested me and much fewer big events than in past years. Also nothing that I found interesting in the new exclusives and autographs lottery system that is new this year. Not that I wouldn't buy some cool exclusives, but even if winning a certain time slot to go in and buy an exclusive or get some autos, it is still going to be crazy with everyone piling in at those specific times. As usual, I make it a policy to never stand in line for more than 10 minutes anywhere at SDCC, which is quite easy to do.

I don't know Stu, or you, so I am just winging it in that respect. Although I don't know the exact situation in what you are dealing with, with your 150 books, I do know, based on my experience, how it is having been through the process many, many times standing in line with others waiting to get books signed. If there is some new system where you make appointments for an allotted amount of time, and others with one or just a few books are not waiting behind someone with 20, 50 or 150 books, then fine. but if lines are like I remember them, then yeah, those guys that try to get dozens and dozens of books signed while others wait, I believe are being rude and selfish. Terrible may be too strong of a word to use, it is not evil, just rude. But maybe some other system is being used now, and if so I am unaware. Anyway, this is just one detail of many regarding this situation. I guess I am just trying to be neutral. I don't favor the fan over the creator. I can see how both the innocent fan and the creator can get the shaft in these scenarios.

RockMyAmadeus, while I give you very high marks for your debate skills, I still see, as WooYeah mentioned in this very thread (I see that mention was erased but is still captured in his quote above in your post), how you are playing with words and creating your own conclusions/arguments in order to make a point and swing "the jury" to your side. Are you an attorney? You have the skills of one. That is great for a debate, and if I was an attorney I may use the same skills. However, this is not a court of law and we are just talking comics, sigs, convention and artist policies in what I consider casual conversation. While I may not be putting in alot of time to perfectly state my words in a way that you cannot use against me, I think I am being pretty clear in my overall message. It is pretty simple really. Creators don't like being used by dealers in such a way as we have been discussing. Some don't care. Others take a stand. I support those who take a stand to avoid being taken advantage of. Heck, I'm fine with those who don't as well. Go ahead, take your 150 books to the next con and hopefully you can have them all signed. Good luck to ya'!

Dang, he was in Seattle? I totally missed that. I would have definitely been there, as I was much more the EC fan than I was the small time dealer trying to sell signed EC Comics. Yeah, it was 2000 when he signed all my books, and then I think 2005 when he started charging at SDCC. He died in 2014.

There are alot of different variables here for sure. And each one could be discussed, though what I am talking about are general policies, and how I understand and can agree with why some creators charge more for some services, based on perceived intent of the fan/dealer bringing in books for sigs. One thing for sure, I do feel bad for the fan that just wants his or her own book signed. Really this is probably the majority of the attendees standing in line waiting for a sig. But because there are certainly some that have taken advantage of these creators and used them in order to make a buck for themselves, I understand why some have adapted these polices. More power to them. Quick example using myself as the fan/dealer. Back in 2000 when Al Feldstein (of EC Comics fame) came to SDCC for appearances, he also was set up to do signatures a few times during the show. This had been advertised (EC reunion going on) so I knew to come prepared. I loaded up my suitcase with a ton of $2 EC reprints. I went through his line several times and each time had him sign 8-10 books, which he did gladly for free. I also had him sign a few originals! Anyway, with those reprints, I took them home and sold them on Ebay for $10-15 a pop. I also included a photo of him signing at the con to add to the authenticity. So we are not talking big bucks here, but making a few extra bucks on each book helped to feed my hobby. A few years later Feldstein came back for another signing and appearance at SDCC. This time he was charging $20 per signature. I still had the chance to talk with him for a bit but did not purchase a single signature from him. He shut my little operation down, as he should have. There are alot of guys out there like me, like I was back then. Gaming the system. Yes, I don't follow every aspect of the system and do not follow how much is realized for CGC's competitors signed slabbed books, but I do follow quite a lot and have been in this hobby for a long time, as a fan, con dealer, comic store owner, and small time Ebay dealer for almost 20 years. There is actually no emotion here with my opinions on the matter. I don't care personally as I'm not involved. I really don't care about sigs anymore as the cost and time to wait in line is not worth it for me (though it used to be). I am using all reason, fairness and an understanding of where both the creators are coming from, as well as the dealers trying to make a buck off a creator and the innocent fan. Regarding the one-sided profit comment I made, again you are missing the point. No doubt that these guys are making good money for charging for a sig. This is what they charge you with the understanding that they are charging a fan for a signature on a book, NOT what they are charging a dealer for a book to resale. Had it not been for these dealers gaming the system (like I did with my Feldstein example) then odds are you may not be charged that $20 to begin with, or at least you'd be charged less. Though I do not know for sure, I think there is a pretty good chance that some of these creators have jacked the signature prices up KNOWING that some of these people will sell their signed books, and this is one way for the creator to make a buck for himself too off of this practice. Yes, lots of variables. We can each rattle off all kinds of scenarios and personal examples. My whole point is just to say that I understand and can agree with the steps some of these creators have taken in order to not be taken advantage of. Good for them. Sorry for the fan that just wants a signed book for their personal collection. Geez, you brought 150 books to be signed by one (or maybe it was several) creators? That is terrible. And you find that to be OK? For something like a that maybe a private meeting on the side could be arranged. Even if you had all those books signed, what about all the little guys behind you that wanted their one book signed? I'll admit I was terrible a few times when I brought up a small pile to be signed by a creator in the past. Sometimes other fans even looked at me like what in the hell am I doing? Selfish is what I call that, and I've had selfish moments in the past too so I understand it.

You clearly don't get it. First off, not everyone that gets a book signed in order to sell is going to get it graded first. Some sell the book signed and ungraded. Many do. Second of all, though I agree that sometimes economically, considering the expense of the cost of grading, it is going to negate any profit on the book, but sometimes the seller most definitely will make a profit on the sig. What matters here is intent, not in the end run if the seller actually makes a few bucks or not. If you want a sig for yourself, that is why most of these creators are there. To meet their fans and give them a sig or memento. They are not there in order for you to use them to make money for yourself, and we both know that many absolutely do go at creators with multiple books, or whatever they can get away with, in order to then sell at a profit. Also, your first statement is ridiculous. Totally out of touch, unless you are just trying to be funny. The creators are paid to do a job, their cog in the wheel, then the other cogs (publishers, distributors, printers, etc) make their cut as well. They all use each other to make a living. They know that going in. Same if the book is self published. That is completely different than a one-sided profit that you are talking about (regardless of if this profit is ever actualized) by a fan going in to get a sig with the intention of selling it for a profit. In that case, a mutually beneficial deal where more is paid to the artist for a book that is intended for resale would be beneficial to both. THAT would be fair. These creators do not want to be taken advantage of and I don't blame them. I respect these policies by McFarlane and others.

I was unaware of that as I don't follow prices. But at least it is an option for those with an unauthorized signature.

I find nothing wrong with this practice as well. Creators do not want to be used to make other people money. McFarlane and similar know that if their signature is authenticated on a book, then the seller is going to make money on it. Some artists have a problem with this and I can understand why. They are being used to make someone else money. These artists will sign a book for you, but not a book for you to make money on selling to someone else. Others don't care, but I definitely understand the sentiment for those creators who feel this way. With that said, not sure if I can name CGC competitors here, but there is another respected grading service that will authenticate signatures in-house, without any witnessing. If you get your book signed legitimately, even without being witnessed, send it in to them and they'll have their professional signature authenticators verify and label the book accordingly.

Apparently wherever you marketed your show it seemed to work out, so mission accomplished, I was just surprised that as a regular con attendee that I did not see any advertising anywhere. Nor any media or fans talking about it. But if you were marketing to a different target audience than I had assumed, that would be why. You are however very wrong in that I would be disappointed in the amount of comic booths and illustrators. Though I'm here on a CGC board I buy very few comics these days and could care less about illustrators or artists anywhere. I go to the cons for fun and media/pop culture, not to buy comic books. Surely I'll attend one of your local Seattle area shows in the future if I hear about it at least a few days in advance.

Perhaps so. Glad you did well, but keep in mind alot of potential customers never even heard of this thing. I was shocked personally. ECCC was advertised everywhere and there was quite a bit of talk about it on social media. Granted that is a more established con and I don't expect equal coverage. With this? ONE person on my feed even mentioned it. ECCC dozens. Apparently you were able to get word out to enough people to do well, but there would have been even more demand, and likely sold out on all days had marketing and promo been better. I do realize that more promo is expensive and it is always a gamble with how much of the budget should be put into that.