Broken Shakespear

See I would consider Killing Joke a Graphic Novel and not a TPB. It is all new material and a self-contained story. A TPB is just a reprint of previous material. I personally think that 99% of TPB will never be worth more than cover price, and will likely be worth much less. Next up would be hardcover trades. Here I would say that 95% will never be worth more than cover price, but their value will hold up a little better than TPB. Omnibus collections and such will hold their value, or perhaps increase slightly because they typically have such low print runs because of their high price.

I would also just like to add this. On the books I returned, it wasn't a matter of my grading standards being higher than Lone Stars. I've read Lone Star's grading standards several times. I know exactly what it is. I realize that it states any book that is a 9.0 and up can be used to fill an order for a NM book. The problem that I have is that of the books I returned, they were almost all clear cut misgrades, using Lone Star's published grading standards. For example, half of the "NM" books that I returned had a tear in the front or back cover, ranging from 1/4" tear to a 1" tear. Lone Star's published standards clearly state: http://www.mycomicshop.com/help/grading "Tears: None. " Then I also get a "NM" book with a pea sized piece of the cover torn out (half the comic code logo is gone). Again, the grading guide states: "Pieces Missing: No pieces missing except for tips of pages nicked during the production process. Note that we include "Marvel chipping" under this definition, a phenomenon well known to the collectors of early 1960's Marvel comics." So it isn't like my standard is so much higher than Lone Star's standard. It's that the books I needed to return don't even follow Lone Star's standard. So I order 80+ books and I need to return 15% of them because they are misgraded. Then BAM, I'm banned from shopping there because I returned too large a percent of one order (out of hundreds of orders I've placed over the years). Never mind that for 2007, I returned much less than 1% of what I ordered. And it isn't because my standards are too high. It is because somewhere, a grader checked a book in at too high a grade, or the order puller grabbed a FN or VF copy instead of a NM copy, or a NM book gets stored, suffers storage damage, and gets shipped anyway as a NM book. Basically, someone screwed up at Lone Star and filled 15% of my order with books that don't even measure up to Lone Stars published standards, and when I need to return those books, I get banned. So a LS employee(s) messes up somewhere and the customer gets banned. Then to add injury to insult, LS tries to take half of my comics without paying me for them. I think any reasonable person would be seriously miffed by that point... I just want to be clear that this is in no way a problem with my expectations, but entirely with the product LS choose to fill my order and the break down in customer service handling returns. Sincerely, Will Norris

No, I only type about 100 wpm usually, which does lend to allowing me to type lengthy posts. And I didn't have it out for them until the told me they were taking 100 for me. Then yes, that made it personal. Had they said they didn't want to do business and were cutting a check for the full amount of credit on file, or to spend my credit and then don't do business there any more, then fine. While it still wouldn't make business sense to me, that is their decision, and I'm not being harmed in any way. But to say they won't do business with me anymore, and then to say that because of their decision, they want to also take $100 worth of my comic books from me to boot, then yes, it becomes personal and I do have it out for someone who tries to steal from me. Lone Star may not view it as stealing, but I certainly do. I certainly wouldn't go into their store, take $200 worth of books and only leave $100 at the register, and then justify it by saying it is fair because I know they only paid $100 for them. Anyway, my final order shipped yesterday, so hopefully I will be getting it soon...

Broken Shakespeare banned or not banned? As far as I know, banned. I will say that whenever I have had a problem with something not working on the site, or just providing feedback on features I would like to see, like the ability to search for CGC books, the web team has always been very responsive in fixing the site, or letting me know that my feedback is being taken into consideration. I never had any problems from that end of the business. I had zero problems with Lone Star before Beth came along. After Beth took over, I had one problem initially ( a couple years ago), and Buddy called me to apologize and explain that Beth was new to the job, etc, which was no big deal and it was handled. Lately though, most of my problems with Lone Star have been communications issues with Beth. Since March/April, I routinely had to send 2-3 e-mails to Beth (send an e-mail, wait a week, send an e-mail, wait a week, send an e-mail and then finally get a response) to get any response. This wasn't just once, but 4-5 times this happened. And then I would get mixed communication, like Beth telling me Buddy looked at a book and decided it wasn't misgraded, and then Buddy telling me I didn't need to return the book (which was already returned and supposedly looked at by Buddy). So I don't know if Beth was mistaken, Buddy was mistaken, or if Beth was intentionally trying to blow smoke in hopes I would just go away by playing the "Buddy looked" card. If you want some feedback for the site, one of the things I recommend is allowing users to see a credit history. Beth sometimes acted like I shouldn't be writing to see if a credit had been issued (LS used to e-mail me to let me know it had been issued, but again lately, I have had to e-mail LS 2-3 times to find out) and I should be able to tell by looking at my total balance. With with trades going in and orders going out, it was sometimes impossible to tell if a $4 credit had been posted to my account, so I had to e-mail to ask. If a user could just look at their credit history, that would be handy for them.

No, I didn't scan it because I didn't think I needed to scan it. The book had a black back cover with a 2" long color breaking crease in the lower right corner. It also had a ~1.5" color scrape on the front cover, about mid book, near the spine. Further it had multiple non-color breaking spine stresses (I counted them when describing the book to Lone Star, but don't have that e-mail in front of me, at least a half dozen). It also had multiple non-color breaking "thumbnail" creases (small crescent moon shaped creases caused by the cover bending over the readers thumbnail) on the front cover. It was a clear cut and dry misgrade, just like the book with half the comic code authority logo torn out from the subsequent order I received. Had I suspected Lone Star would implode over it, I would have scanned it.

But Jim, the point is that Lonestar was the one to halt any future business transactions, and essentially halve the amount of "comic money" he was owed. I doubt you would feel the same way if you had traded in some CGC books worth $1K+ GPA, and then Lonestar immediately booted you and offered a "my way or the highway" $500 cash offer for the books (which they'd already sold for $1500). If not, then send all your HG CGC picture frames over here and I'll pay you half-price for them. I understand Vince...but according to this guy he has had to return comics multiple times...so he knew what he was getting into when he continued doing business with them... And I've never heard trade credit translate 100% to cash...it's routine that it's 50%... Jim And you aren't reading what I am writing. I averaged a return of a couple of comics, out of hundreds, per year. And never any hassle with returns. The problems I am speaking of now, all happened with orders placed and received in the month of May. One month, not repeated problems like you are trying to make it sound. I had a problem with one order, returned the comic to have it resolved. While that book was in transit, I placed another order, which was then received with about 15% being misgraded. Again, it was 4 years of minimal to no problems, and then one month of problems. I didn't continue to do business depite repeated problems, like you are making out. If you bothered to read the thread, you would see I made this clear twice before...

That's not the point. I'm not saying 50% cash vs. trade is wrong. My problem is that I only sent them the books because they agreed to the trade credit. I would not have sent them at all at the cash price. Then after they received the books and even sold some of them, THEY decided to just pay me cash at 50% the value of trade, regardless of how I felt about it. Again, do you think this scenario is fair. You send a dealer a ASM #1 and he is supposed to trade you $5000 worth of his books for it. But then once he receives it, he changes his mind and just mails you a check for $2500 and tells you to go away. Are you honestly sitting here arguing that is a fair business tactic?

Just speculation,but it wouldn't surprise me if a few people caught on to the fact that they were so liberal on accepting buyers complaints about overgraded books. Telling the buyer just keep the book and we'll credit you is a policy ripe for exploitation.I'm not surprised the guy is no longer in his job.While it might sound foolish to spend $2.76 for a 50 cent item,1) it doesn't really since they are crediting it towards overpriced books,and 2) it cuts down on fraud. You never did answer my question,so I'll ask you again- Couldn't you have done much better with $100 cash to spend at any convention than with $200 in credit towards over-priced books? I doubt I could have done better with $100. First, the nearest location to me that has conventions is $100 in gas away (rountrip), so that right there means I would have got nothing with the $100. But if you overlook that aspect of it, I got a Brave and the Bold 57 (CGC 8.0) for $119, and the GPA average on that book is about $100. I also got a Justice League of America #37 (CGC 8.5) for $76, and I think the GPA on that is about $85-$90. I also got three modern CGC 9.8's, one a WWT variant, with the remaining credit plus $6-$8 more. I don't think you will find a dealer at a convention willing to sell the two Silver Age CGC's for $100, at least I have never run into such a dealer. I think both those books would easily run you $165-$175 at any convention (which I did overpay a little, at $195). With $100, I could have purchased one book, but not both. Then I got the three 9.8's to boot. I doubt I could have found the two SIlver Age books raw for $100. Now, I will say that some of their books are WAY overpriced, and you might do better at a convention. For example, they have an All-FLash #16 or 17 (I forget) in CGC 6.0 and they want like $289 for it. I have seen that same book about a year ago, in the same 6.0 CGC slab, with a $175 asking price at a con. Still if I had $300 in trade credit or $175 in cash, it would mean I get the same book either way around. Their Golden Age books are way overpriced, and I would say you could do the same at a con with cash, as you could at their store with credit. However, I did GPA this book, and it had recently (I think in March), sold for $265-$270, so maybe the market is catching up to the inflated price at LS. Moderns and Silver Age are a different story. I also don't really agree with your point about people taking advantage of a liberal return policy. I don't think alot of people would go through the trouble of scanning books and pointing out the misgrades, just to get a misgraded $1.50 book for free. They weren't telling me to keep $25 misgraded items. It was for $1-$3 misgraded items, when I provided a scan showing the defects. And it wasn't like I did it every order. It was a couple times a year.

I think another part of the problem is that Lone Star hired an Internet Sales Manager that can't grade comics! With the previous manager, I could send a scan of the misgraded item, say, see the giant color breaking crease on this book that is supposed to be NM. Then he would say, "well, that book was just $1.60, and with that crease it would just go in the quarter bin if it came back. Not worth the $2-$3 to send it back. I'll just credit your account for the purchase price, don't worry about sending that rag back, and you can order another copy on the next order. Sorry for the mix up." Then he left and Buddy hired Beth to take over. She can't grade and requires that every return, even if the book was a $1, to be sent back so senior graders can examine it and determine if it was misgraded. So it ends up costing them $2.76 in return shipping to get back a $1 misgraded item worth $.25. I can understand sending back a $50 NM book, that if it is really a fine, might still be worth $20. But when it is a $1.50 NM, that if it is really a fine is worth $.25, why bother?

I have dealt with Buddy many times with no problems whatsoever. The problem is the "collector" who buys hundreds of books hoping that the dealer undergrades some of them which he keeps and then returns the "overgraded". Never mind the old scam of trading a pile of spoon and taking a few key books with the credit. The customer is always right. The "collector" trying to twist the system to stick it to the store owner is not. I am sure that Buddy has another side to this story. Yeah, I was getting key books like Superman: Man of Steel Annual #4, Marvel Team-Up #88, Spectacular Spiderman #50, and many more key books just like these... And is it even a scam if you trade them 100 books for $.50 each, and take a single $50 book with the credit? You act like it is a scam, but what is the difference. If the dealer couldn't sell the $.50 books, they wouldn't be on their buy list. So they buy them for $.50 and sell them for $1.50 and triple their money. What's it matter what you take with the trade credit? That isn't a scam. Now, if you were buying 100 books. Picking through them at taking 10 and sending the other 90 back as misgraded, then you might have a point. But the opposite is the case here. I ordered 90 books and sent back 13. Do you really believe he sent 77 undergraded books?

For those that might have missed it, this issue has been resolved. After another e-mail, Lone Star agreed to let me use the full credit on a one time purchase, of CGC graded items only, since CGC items are non-returnable for grading disputes. After the order is filled, we are done doing business. So I pretty much avoided getting the shaft. Two of the books I ordered, were ones I had planned on ordering anyway. I still had some leftover credit, so I bought three books I would normally not have bought, just so I would have something to show from the credit This was a much better solution than loosing the $100, as I at least have something to show for it. I'm still just shocked that they would toss aside a 4 year business relationship that made them thousands of dollars, over a couple of dollars in return shipping credit.

There is no right or wrong in a situation like this - it's all up to the OP on what he does. If I got mugged for $100, I wouldn't care about the dollar amount, I'd pursue legal (and possibly illegal) remedies til my dying breath, just so that the perp thought twice before trying it on anyone else. That's just me - I'm like the Energizer Bunny when I get rooked. Others are more easy-going, but it really comes down to doing what you need to, to sleep soundly at night. If having money stolen from you is going to bother you, then do something about it. If not, then move along. Pretty weak analogy. Just admit like everyone else you pick your fights. I'm sure your government is boning you in some manner and you're taking it just like we are. Come on... you have to take the government boning, because there is no one person to go after. You need a nuke...

....or make the time to answer that phone call. I look at it this way.. I contacted Buddy by e-mail. He responded and said that he would rather handle the dispute via phone vs. e-mail. I replied back that I would rather handle it via e-mail, and gave him a few reasons why (family, time, convience, etc.). I also like having the paper trail and record that e-mails provide. So if a problem isn't resolved, I can refer back to what was said and when, with no doubts. So he wanted phone, and I, the customer wanted e-mail. Does that make me in the wrong in any way? Both are forms of communication, and I did indicate that I wanted to communicate with them about the issue, and was always willing to communicate.

If you look at the bigger picture that was his business relationship with this company that turned on him it was thousands of dollars. Even as a business you have to look at the whole monetary relationship every now and then and make a reassessment. In this case mycomicshop.com made a one and we need to make it known to them , by email, if they are too stupid to come to this forum. Yeah, I can't begin to fathom how he built a business as big as Lone Star, with this kind of business sense. I know that if I had someone who was selling me $1200 of books a year for credit (no money out of my pocket). And then I was selling those books for a 30% profit (and covering the 10-20% overhead) ($360 profit), and then he in turn, was buying another $1200 in product from me with the credit. Thus yielding me another $360 in profit on those sales. So I have now made $720 because of this customer. Even if they return a batch of books every month for misgrade, and I have to eat $5 a month in return shipping, I would gladly still have them as a customer because I would still be making $660 in profit from them, ALL WITH NO MONEY OUT OF MY POCKET! I was a cash cow for them. I didn't really t rack how much I traded very well, but I think it would be safe to say it was $1200-$2000 per year in trade credit. Again, it just blows my mind that he can have a succesful business with this approach. Maybe if you were a customer who placed one order a year for $3, and every time returned your item and wanted a $3 shipping credit. Maybe if a customer is doing this chronically and you are losing money. Maybe then you ask them to go elsewhere. But not when they are a cash cow... A few comments. One, I think their position with you was not good business but based on their buy/trade structure, it is logical (they give half of trade value in cash) and only a rip off in that they are restricting your options. I would also take the $ because all of their CGC books are at twice GPA, so their new offer actually sucks. Two, Moondog is right (and JC is just being a provoking dikk again). Take the $ and move on. Particularly in light of the fact that the cash option seems as good or better than the trade option, it is not worth the aggravation. Your bringing this matter to the boards gets you the measure of revenge you should need, as a bunch of people are now put off by Lone Stuff. Getting a lawyer on principle is foolish and a total waste of time, especially if we're talking Texas. You'll just be more pissed after a year. Again, I never said I wanted a lawyer. I just asked if any lawyers on these boards could provide insight into the correct steps to take. Small claims court is per se. And their prices weren't bad on the books I did get. One book was GPA +15%. The other was GPA 12 month average almost to the dollar. The last three books were all moderns and 9.8's, with one being $12.50, one $15 (a WWT variant cover), and the other $22.50 (which was about GPA + 20%), and two were the cost of slabbing or less. I stand corrected. I looked at 4 books I would want (GA stuff I collect) and saw everything 2X GPA. Did not look at enough stuff I guess. Ahh... now I see where you are coming from. GA stuff is more pricey, especially above 6.0. I looked at an All-Flash 6.0 book as a potential purchase to settle this dispute and it GPA'd around $180, and they were asking about $265. The price multiplier is even more at 7 and 8 grades.

Yep, still don't have my Comic Supply order... Thanks for reminding me that I need to follow up with them again, since they told me 2.5 weeks ago that my order would ship by the end of the week, and it still hasn't shipped...