Get Marwood & I

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Everything posted by Get Marwood & I

  1. Don't get me wrong, I usually avoid these things like the plague, especially as I don't sell here. And I'm not condoning anything. But I just caught sight of the last comment and couldn't help but laugh at its unexpected brutality.
  2. Nicely put. Quite often it's the attempt to avoid responsibility that is worse than the original event isn't it. And rarely does anything good come from having an ongoing online disagreement for the crowds to enjoy. Perhaps he kept escalating because he thought he had right on his side though. Either way, it looks like he's decided to leave the forum so it's a moo point as Joey would say. His final comment over in the now locked thread made me laugh though if I'm honest. I doubt Miraclemet will be taking him up on the kind offer.
  3. I agree. I think cover dates in isolation are a red herring in this exercise. If we want to form a meaningful list of the first books to be distributed in the UK perhaps we need to be guided by cover stamps principally (our 8's and 9's) backed by cover dates that are in the right ball-park to have them (and not obvious date outliers). Yes, October Batman made the first cut as he has a first cycle 9 stamp to back the recollections of those collectors experiences of the time. Boone October is out as he has a 6 stamp and, therefore, likely came over in a subsequent cycle shipment. We're getting there Albert...
  4. So maybe Adventure #265 and Superboy #76 are out there and those and our lone Batman 127 and Boone #1 Octobers were just late? It is, using Mike's Comic Newsstand's 'on sale dates' but it's a time consuming exercise and, whilst it has worked for me in other areas (see DC UKPV thread!), I wonder how helpful it would be here given the likely wide variance in timings of any fledgling US returns process. I may have a go anyway though Albert
  5. Here's an example of what I mean. On the CBPG UK regarding Superman #132 we have two references: The first is the inclusion in the list of First Distribution comics - note no picture, which is odd given the presence of the other mainstays (Flash, Batman, Wonder Woman, Green Lantern): The second reference is here, mentioning Batman #127 and Superman #132 as having small quantities: I've seen quite a few stamped Batman #127's in my online searches down the years, but not one Superman #132. There are 6 Superman 132's on eBay UK at present, of which one even states it's the first UK distributed book: But note it's not a stamped copy. Nor are any of the others. All the main UK online dealers have no copies or copies without stamps. I've carried a list of the alleged 'first UK distributed' DCs with me to fairs for some years now and have never seen one in the wild. So it makes you wonder if this issue did actually ever come over doesn't it? Maybe Duncan added it to the list because he reasoned that if Batman #127 was present.... Now I've been proven wrong many times and I'm sure I will be again, but if a copy does show - and it probably will now - what's the betting that it has a number 8 or 9? @Kevin.J - have you gone through your collection yet? Find us one mate
  6. He does look rather chilled, yes The more I look at it, the more I like it...
  7. I'm not sure I follow you Albert? Ignoring the 6's (as probably second cycle stamped books) we only have 8's and 9's tabled so far and each has a mix of cover dates covering 2-3 months. When you say 'October would have had a 7 stamp' why do you think that? The examples of the 8 stamp in my table are predominantly December cover dates. The 9's are predominantly Decembers and Januarys. Why do you think October needs to be in the mix? Is it because of Duncan's site references and the handful of actual October cover dated books that we've seen (of which Batman #127 is a 9 and the Boone #1's are probable second wave 6 stamps)? I note you say 'probably' - if you're recollection is correct and they were stamped, could they not have been stamped with an 8 or a 9? The only reason I challenge is that I have periodically looked for earlier examples than those posted on Duncan's site for many years and I have rarely seen anything stamped earlier than the four pictured examples below - and no Superboy 76 has ever materialised in my searches: The key point for me is identifying which was the first stamp, not cover date. If our theory of stamps matching sequential calendar shipment events is correct, then the first UK arrivals would be the 8's and their cover dates may be anything from October all the way to February 1960. So if a Flash 108 or a Showcase 22 did exist, the chances are their stamps would be an 8. What do you think? I haven't seen one yet myself. It's one of the things I'd like to drive out of this exercise though - a more expansive, evidence based list of the first known DC copies to arrive officially in the UK. Duncan's site shows four pictorial examples plus a list of other possible candidates (unless there is something else available on the site which you only get from being a member, which I'm not). Our table shows many more examples and also fine tunes them to a specific shipment - 8 or 9. There are two ways of looking at this I suppose - earliest stamped cover dates / issue numbers, or earliest numbered stamp regardless of cover date (being the 8, if our research here holds true). The fly in the overall ointment of course is the fact that any given stamped issue could be a late comer from a second cycle!
  8. From a 1974 fanzine - see Marvel 'Distribution Cons':
  9. That's a nice neat '14' in the H there: It's amazing how many times you see that when the comic doesn't have the number on the cover isn't it
  10. I looked at the other publishers who have 1958 / 1959 stamped books by the way - ACG and Archie - and concluded that I don't have enough examples to justify adding them in. A lot of the Archies are stamped with a 6 though, regardless of cover dates, so they either are second cycle bulk late comers, or they maybe make up the DC '6' compliment and make that stamp number the 'first ever' UK comic shipment lot. While we wait, does anyone have any thoughts on my 'number 8 was the first ever comic shipment' theory? Albert?
  11. That's interesting Gary. It does seem to be the case at the moment that the number sequencing holds true for DC but less so for the other publishers. I wonder if the arrangement of US returns being imported to the UK was an 'agreed' sequential arrangement for DC only, and the other publisher books sort of came along for the ride if you like. Maybe the position for Marvel was only strict in relation to the solicitation of printed price UKPVs - a manifestly formal arrangement - but unstructured when it came to the importation of cents copies - they just came over 'as and when'. I've not studied the Marvel stamps in any depth at all as the focus of this thread was the 'early distribution' in 1959/1960 and, clearly, Marvel were only in the game in respect of their printed UKPV arrangement which started in May 1960 with cents stamped copies not appearing until much later. I'm intrigued to see what your spreadsheet shows.
  12. That is a good one. It looks like the Jokers' Nan in a tracksuit the morning after she's had a few. I would make that my avatar if I were you Blob. I like it
  13. Morning guys @01TheDude @Albert Tatlock I've added a summary page to my journal and name checked you both: Dude, apologies again for managing to forget your first input which was spot on as it turned out. Albert, thanks for pointing out my error and for having the grace to share the credit.
  14. Yes, I've just read those posts again and I find I can't recall even my own responses to them, let alone the original suggestions. I'm quite perplexed by this and not a little fed up by it if I'm honest. Sorry again.
  15. Marwood, I thank you for your kind comments on my contribution to the numbered T & P stamps, but the credit, I feel, is not entirely mine. I have glanced back at the postings in this thread before I became involved, and I now see that 01TheDude put forward basically the same suggestion as far back as page 6 of this thread, but as he had no data to hand at the time to back it up the idea was not developed. I think 01TheDude should get at least a share, if indeed not the lion's share, of the credit, don't you? Also, I cannot help but think that I was by not the only collector at the time to notice that the stamp number, with occasional hiccups, was creeping inexorably upwards Oh dear, how clumsy of me to miss that. I shall make amends in the morning Albert. My apologies Dude
  16. Thorpe & Porter UK Distribution Price Stamp Numbering Hello Reader Those of you who have been foolish enough to follow my pence threads over the years will know that I have often speculated as to why the UK distribution price stamps used by Thorpe & Porter in the early 1960's were numbered 1-9 like so: I've lost track of how many experts and collectors I have asked about it down the years and everyone was stumped. I undertook an exercise myself a year or so ago, captured I think in my DC UKPV thread, to see if I could detect any patterns (as I often do). It was unsuccessful because I was looking for the wrong thing, in the wrong way. Recently, two contributors to a thread I started about the early distribution of US comics to the UK finally cracked the code - @01TheDude first suggested it and then @Albert Tatlock, helped in no small measure I would assume by his extensive DC collection, confirmed what he and likely a few other collectors of the day had worked out. You can read all about it here, in my UK Distribution Review thread: Anyway, in short, it turns out that the numbers correlate with sequential - probably monthly - shipment arrival dates from the US to the UK. We know that the import ban on comics was lifted around mid-1959, so it is no surprise to see that our stamped US books started to arrive in the UK at the end of 1959 / beginning of 1960. Using the many images that I had already captured in relation to my distribution review, and a subsequent trawl of eBay and other online sources, I plotted all the DC comics I could find in line with the 1-9 stamp numbers and the pattern was indeed confirmed: Click to enlarge by the way The tables show us that the books arrive approximately monthly - as you would expect for a monthly comic medium - and that each shipment comprises a mix of issue sequential books not usually separated by more than one to three months by cover date (which makes sense when you consider the end to end process involved from the point that issues were returned as unsold in the US to their arrival in the UK). I'm not going to go into too much more detail here as I suspect that the vast majority of readers won't find this interesting. The small group that do will likely want to read the whole thread. So, in a final nutshell, this is what we believe was going on: With the import ban lifted, Thorpe & Porter made an arrangement with DC to have unsold books in the US sent to the UK US sellers removed unsold DC comics, perhaps once the replacement next issue arrived, and sent them to a central returns point The central point collated the US country-wide returns and shipped them to the UK, likely monthly Thorpe & Porter received them, stamped them (using the 1-9 stamps on a rolling cycle) and distributed them to the UK The evidence points to the stamp number 8 in the first cycle as being the likely 'first ever shipment' and it probably arrived in the UK for the books to go on sale around January 1960. You can read the detail in the thread, but the addition of the known 1958/1959 Charlton stamped examples, creates the following possible picture: As ever there are gaps and quirks all over the place - there always are in this wonderful period of comic history - but you'd have to be blind to not see the pattern behind the outliers. The discussion thread covers Marvel and the other publishers for whom we have T&P stamped examples in the UK. So, with an element or two left to be finessed, notably a definitive calendar date for the start month, the mystery of the Thorpe & Porter price stamp numbering has, to my mind, finally been solved. Well done to the Dude and Tatlock for making the breakthrough Cheers, Steve 24.10.20
  17. I looked at the other publishers who have 1958 / 1959 stamped books by the way - ACG and Archie - and concluded that I don't have enough examples to justify adding them in. A lot of the Archies are stamped with a 6 though, regardless of cover dates, so they either are second cycle bulk late comers, or they maybe make up the DC '6' compliment and make that stamp number the 'first ever' UK comic shipment lot.
  18. Indeed. I've been comparing the content to my UKPV research and it's quite interesting to see the joins. It's a little melancholy as an exercise though, as back in the day there were clearly so many more people involved in comic discussions and such. I'd like to go back to those days and play a more active role at a time when it all mattered. Let's face it, who really cares about this stuff nowadays...?
  19. A couple of snippets from some old 1970's UK fanzines I've been reading - I was hoping to find a review or something - will keep looking
  20. Here's another clipping from issue #6 (Aug-Sep 76): Did Fantastic Four indeed not come over for two months? Not bad! Explains why I've never found #176 I suppose. And did X-Men, Premier and Spotlight stop? Yup. Nice
  21. Yes, I called it 'oddly similar' for a reason Juno
  22. Based on my extensive Miller research, I'm going to stick my neck out and say there's near to zero chance of that Gary. So expect one along any day now Looking forward to it. I can't look back on it, because it hasn't happened yet