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I don't post much here. And I don't come here to read much either, so pardon me if this has been discussed at length before (did not see any recent threads about it). I've been collecting OA for close to 20 years now. Prices have always climbed, and there have always been folks along the way who have said "this is it" - "prices are too high" - "this can't continue". I've always disagreed with that thinking. One of the factors in the past that had pushed prices up was "trading up" - you could make a nice profit on something you bought long ago, and then use that money to buy something "bigger and better." I've done that countless times myself as I'm sure many others here have done. But recently, the market has me scratching my head. In all my years (and I know some have been at it even longer), I've never seen anything like today's market. Prices aren't just high - they're insane (just saw the first round of Heritage close today!). I did see this comment in my search here earlier, and it mirrored what I was thinking after looking at the HA results today: "There is no doubt we are now competing with wealthy individuals who are not traditional OA fans, but have been professionally advised to buy OA; this is skewing higher end prices accordingly while also causing a trickle-down boost to lower tier art prices. You're not just competing with other Carillo fans now -- you're competing with folks who would normally spend $5K on a John Buscema Avengers or DC Kirby page, but are finding prices moving too high so they are snapping up decent art "bargains" (like that $2,800 page)." (comment by Race) Is this the general consensus? Do we have deep pocket investors and speculators who have now moved in and are just bidding until they win (regardless of past sales)? It seem like that's the strategy, and they are relying on the underbidder to "steer" them to a reasonable price. In other words, "I don't need to know the market - I'll trust the other bidders". And what is the implication of all this? Are these prices here to stay? Does it make the market more susceptible to a "crash" down the road when these guys decide to find another investment vehicle? (assuming this is really what's going on). Would love to hear any and all thoughts on this. Tony

Time will tell, but I think of comics as an art form like jazz, film, or great novels. Instead of pointing to things that fell out of favor (like Alger), why not focus on the things that have had lasting cultural significance? Shakespeare, Mozart, Van Gogh....

"I think you’re starting with the idea that you don’t like first appearance art being highly valued" How about I say what I think, and you say what you think. Instead of you saying what you think I think.

"He didn't lose skill; he lost audience." Again, I am not talking about the artwork itself. I'm talking about significance. Pick a decade and you can find the most "important" books from that decade. The works of Miller and Moore in the 80's for example. And since you mentioned him, Byrne's X-men and FF work. Byrne has done a TON of books - but those are considered his best works - they were huge at the time. They were significant for that generation. Lee/Kirby FF, Lee/Ditko Spidey, etc. When future generations look back at comics, this is where they will be pointed because these were the high points - the "best of the best". I'm just saying that, I HOPE, these things will be valued over "first appearances". And I'm also ok with both being valued. But I think one is more important than the other.

"The OA for a mindless and poorly drawn 90s book that was super popular is going to outsell Maus art, to use your example, every time." a) I don't think that's true. b) Have you ever seen Maus art for sale? If not, what are you basing this on? "...they buy and sell based on supply and demand and neither of those things relate directly to quality of any type." Why do you think certain items are "scarce"? It is exactly because of quality. What most people consider to be the "best of the best" is usually hard to find because everyone wants it. If Herb Trimpe drew one issue of Doctor Bong, that would make it scarce. It wouldn't make it valuable.

See my comment above - I was never referring to the image itself.

I think you may have misunderstood me again. I wasn't talking about the quality of the artwork itself - I was talking about how significant a work is in within the medium. That's why I mentioned Maus (Pulitzer) and Watchmen (one of Time Magazine's 100 greatest novels).

Floors me every time Scott!!

This entire discussion is about how high the prices are on "first appearances" - in this case, an alternative Spider-Man. But somehow discussing the alternative GL is "absurd"?

I think you missed my point. My comment was not about the validity of a new character, nor whether Miles will have lasting appeal. What I am saying is that quality should have more weight than the novelty of a "first appearance". I've been collecting OA for close to two decades. I've never had a single conversation with another collector who said, "you know what I want? The first appearance of (fill in the blank)." This is the mentality of the comic BOOK collector who is taught to value “keys”. First appearances are the least interesting thing about the comic book medium as an art form. If the comic book medium is to have any lasting appreciation by the culture at large, it will be because of the quality of the important works. This is true in all the arts; film, literature, fine art, music. Nobody cares about an artist’s first film, book, song, or painting; each is judged on its merits. So, in 100 years, people will (hopefully) be reading Maus, and Watchmen, and I can’t imagine anyone being very interested in the first appearance of any character - outside the novelty of it. My experience as a collector, and in talking to other collectors over the years, is that people want art from the “important” books. That’s been the norm. So, the question is, will first appearance originals always be valued at a premium? Maybe. Or will the “significant” works fetch the highest prices? I hope so. Of course there's the possibility that both will be true. Time will tell.

I posted this comment on the Facebook discussion about this and reposting here. Mark Morales has been around for a decade. So while he’s “hot” now (I guess) he’s not exactly Peter Parker. I’ve been collecting comic art for over 15 years and I don’t recall so much significance being placed on a “first appearance”. The best selling comic art has typically been what many consider to be iconic books of the genre. Is this book one of them? I don’t know - never read it (but I doubt it). There’s been a trend in OA collecting which is that a lot of comic book collectors transition into the original art market, and they bring with them some of the book collector mentality (e.g., first appearances). And while it’s entirely possible that the market is heading in that direction, I doubt that too. My .02.

Hello! I hope everyone is staying safe and healthy! I am currently running a sale on my website as follows: ALL comic BOOK art is 10% OFF ALL comic STRIP art is 15% OFF Prices already marked on sale are eligible for the ADDITIONAL discount! Time payments and trade always considered. Thanks! Art Adams John Byrne Frank Cho Darwyn Cooke Alan Davis Dave Gibbons Joseph Michael Linsner Bill Sienkiewicz and more! Regards, Tony www.comicinkking.com

Hello! For a limited time www.comicinkking.com is having a 10% OFF Sale on EVERYTHING on the website. If something is already marked down - you can take an ADDITIONAL 10% off! Act now while supplies last! Regards, Tony

Is it against the rules to reply to a two month old thread? This is a fun discussion and I've definitely had some phases: Phase 1: Buying pretty inexpensive art. I think the first piece I ever bought was a Mike Vossburg She-Hulk page that was pretty terrible. But I just wanted to hold an original in my hands. It's pretty amazing however how quickly you can go up in what you're willing to spend.... Phase 2: Buying art that is considerably more expensive and also buying almost anything that caught my eye. I'm a big 80's guy but... EC art? Sure. Comic strip art? Why not? Nothing was off limits. Phase 3: Pruning the collection. I decided to stop putting any more cash into comic art - and I forced myself to only buy new pieces by selling off old ones. This turned out to be the best move I ever made. I might sell three pieces to buy one other one - but I LOVED the new piece and realized I didn't care much about losing the other three. So I went from having a big variety and more pieces, to fewer, more valuable (both in dollars and sentiment) pieces. This also helped me realize what my "sweet spot" was - the 80's. Phase 4: I assumed I was retired and that my big buying days were over. I'd scratched all the itches I really wanted to and had examples of just about everything I wanted. But to my surprise I sold off pieces I never thought I'd sell and found amazing pieces that I never thought I'd find! I'm still buying and selling stuff pretty frequently and having fun with it. I never get tired of getting a new piece of art. There's so much good art out there - it's hard to NOT be able to find something that sparks your interest.

I've used Robert Dennis - he does great work!