Amazing Fantasy #15 Club

[namisgr]

For me, Avengers #1 would be another top tier Marvel key, as would Strange Tales #110. I'd probably add Fantastic Four #5 as a second tier key.

[Erndog]

For me, Avengers #1 would be another top tier Marvel key, as would Strange Tales #110. I'd probably add Fantastic Four #5 as a second tier key.

 

I'm not sure I agree that Strange Tales #110 should be ahead of FF #5.

 

I mean, Doom is easily one of the most recognizable Marvel villains... Heck, probably characters in general. He makes every top 10 list for comic characters/villains. He's über cool. And the cover to #5 actually features Doom.

 

Dr Strange is cool and all but more with hardcore comic fans.

[johnny54321]

I think ASM 1 belongs in the top tier too.

[Jaydogrules]

After that extraordinarily high heritage auction result for the ST 110, 9.6 it's hard to not make a case for that being a top tier SA marvel key nowadays.

 

-J.

[Shawn Low]

After that extraordinarily high heritage auction result for the ST 110, 9.6 it's hard to not make a case for that being a top tier SA marvel key nowadays.

 

-J.

 

Any first appearances of key characters and even key b-list characters (sorry Stephen Strange) in high grade just hits silly high numbers.

 

And perhaps, as people get priced out of buying key first appearances of A-listers, they are looking for the 'next big thing'. I mean, Goldilocks wasn't exactly high on the A-list prior to the movie. Look where JiM 83 is doing now? And what's next for potential 'record' numbers? Tales to Astonish 27?

 

If the basis for listing keys are 'record' auction results, then ST110 should be up there. As should any key that hits crazy numbers.

 

The point is that we can have opinions about what's top tier or not but there's no debate about that when it comes to AF15.

[Jaydogrules]

After that extraordinarily high heritage auction result for the ST 110, 9.6 it's hard to not make a case for that being a top tier SA marvel key nowadays.

 

-J.

 

Any first appearances of key characters and even key b-list characters (sorry Stephen Strange) in high grade just hits silly high numbers.

 

And perhaps, as people get priced out of buying key first appearances of A-listers, they are looking for the 'next big thing'. I mean, Goldilocks wasn't exactly high on the A-list prior to the movie. Look where JiM 83 is doing now? And what's next for potential 'record' numbers? Tales to Astonish 27?

 

If the basis for listing keys are 'record' auction results, then ST110 should be up there. As should any key that hits crazy numbers.

 

The point is that we can have opinions about what's top tier or not but there's no debate about that when it comes to AF15.

 

True indeed. But the under copy for the ST 110 hit a high as well, if I'm not mistaken.

 

Back on topic...how about that 3.5 that's already at $5,100 on the C-Link auction. I think all of those other PLOD's they have up are funneling attention to it. Any wagers on its final hammer price?

 

-J.

[The-Collector]

After that extraordinarily high heritage auction result for the ST 110, 9.6 it's hard to not make a case for that being a top tier SA marvel key nowadays.

 

-J.

 

But those prices are the result of irrational exuberance after a movie announcement, and this spike is likely only transitory.

 

For me a top tier is reserved for books that have stood the test of time, not hot commodities which have seen irrational movie hype.

[AlexanderM]

I would see it like this:

 

And I definitely see ST110 as a major Silver Age key (perhaps Ditko and Stan's most important collaboration next to Spider-man. Strange of course hasn't had the benefot of big time movies yet. Remember that AF15 was not the most expensive Silver age book before the movies.

 

A1

 

AF15

BB28

Hulk 1

FF1

ST110

ToS 39

JIM 83

X-Men 1

SC4

 

A2

 

ASM 1

Avengers 1

Avengers 4

DD1 (could be A1)

FF5

TTA 27

TTA110

JiM 85

SC22

SC8

 

This is of course not a full list, just some examples of books in each tier.

[chrisco37]

I would see it like this:

 

And I definitely see ST110 as a major Silver Age key (perhaps Ditko and Stan's most important collaboration next to Spider-man. Strange of course hasn't had the benefot of big time movies yet. Remember that AF15 was not the most expensive Silver age book before the movies.

 

The difference is that, even before the movies, everyone knew about Spidey. He's been a part of pop-culture for a long time. Right there with Superman and Batman.

 

Dr. Strange, not so much.

[Jaydogrules]

The "masses" don't necessarily need to be readily familiar with a character in order for his/her first appearance to be considered a "key" within the hobby.

 

-J.

[Erndog]

The "masses" don't necessarily need to be readily familiar with a character in order for his/her first appearance to be considered a "key" within the hobby.

 

-J.

 

From the sounds and looks of it, we're just judging keys by value.

 

If thats the case, lets just rank them from most expensive to cheapest and be done with it.

 

Personally? I think its MUCH cooler showing a buddy FF #5 and Doom than it is showing ST #110. Once I pull out the ST 110, most would be like... 'huh?"

[Jaydogrules]

The "masses" don't necessarily need to be readily familiar with a character in order for his/her first appearance to be considered a "key" within the hobby.

 

-J.

 

From the sounds and looks of it, we're just judging keys by value.

 

If thats the case, lets just rank them from most expensive to cheapest and be done with it.

 

Personally? I think its MUCH cooler showing a buddy FF #5 and Doom than it is showing ST #110. Once I pull out the ST 110, most would be like... 'huh?"

 

I don't think anyone's really basing their lists strictly on "value" or they would have ASM 1 in the top tier. But what's considered a "key" can certainly shift with the wind. I'm looking at you Adam Strange. Iron Man was considered a second stringer until the movies came out, and now TOS 39 is universally considered a "key". Ant-Man was a footnote and now his first appearance is considered a second tier key. ST 110 certainly contains the first appearance of a classic Marvel character, whether or not he's on the front cover. Is he as popular in the mass media as Iron Man right now? Of course not. But even that could change with an introductory tease at the end of a Marvel movie or more concrete information and progress from the studio on a solo movie. Maybe we should examine what we consider the definition of a "key" to be, and then decide what those keys are.

 

-J.

[AlexanderM]

The "masses" don't necessarily need to be readily familiar with a character in order for his/her first appearance to be considered a "key" within the hobby.

 

-J.

 

From the sounds and looks of it, we're just judging keys by value.

 

If thats the case, lets just rank them from most expensive to cheapest and be done with it.

 

Personally? I think its MUCH cooler showing a buddy FF #5 and Doom than it is showing ST #110. Once I pull out the ST 110, most would be like... 'huh?"

 

I don't think anyone's really basing their lists strictly on "value" or they would have ASM 1 in the top tier. But what's considered a "key" can certainly shift with the wind. I'm looking at you Adam Strange. Iron Man was considered a second stringer until the movies came out, and now TOS 39 is universally considered a "key". Ant-Man was a footnote and now his first appearance is considered a second tier key. ST 110 certainly contains the first appearance of a classic Marvel character, whether or not he's on the front cover. Is he as popular in the mass media as Iron Man right now? Of course not. But even that could change with an introductory tease at the end of a Marvel movie or more concrete information and progress from the studio on a solo movie. Maybe we should examine what we consider the definition of a "key" to be, and then decide what those keys are.

 

-J.

 

Yeah. It is not really merely about how recognizable a figur is at any point in time. There have been times where obscure figures have been more widely known than Spider-man or Wolverine.

 

One way of looking at it is considering what would be the standing (major, minor key etc.) when all have had the same exposure in movies etc. Right now Spider-man, X-men, Iron-man etc have had a lot of exposure. We know that Marvel for example is doing this on purpose. They have their phases and will develop the different characters in different movies over time. This means that the first figures in phase 1 and 2 will likely have increased more in value than phase 3 etc characters before phase 3 has started. This does no mean they are more key, because that will be decided in the end when phase 3 etc is over and they have had the same exposure. Dr Strange is set to be central to Marvel mystic third phase.

[cloudofwit]

Me too. but in terms of price jumps, doesnt BB28 have a greater return at this point since AF15 will see marginal price increases?

 

 

Currently, the large gains on BB28 has already been materialized. Gains are much more limited now.. BB28 was stagnant in 2009-2011.

 

Let's be fair.

 

Before the Spider-man movies AF15 was not the most expensive Silver age book. Now it is. BB28 has not had the help from movies that AF15 has. I know a lot of people have a lot (really a lot) of money invested in AF15 and really need the demand to stay high. Therefore any talk of any book out-pacing it will be seen as blasphemy.

 

But in 2013 BB28 has gained significantly more in value than AF15, and the trailer hasn't even been shown yet.

 

I own both books, and love both, but I think some of you guys are being a little unfair to the BB28. But on the other hand - what do you expect in a "Amazing Fantasy #15 Club" thread

 

When you claim "Before the Spider-man movies, AF 15 was not the most expensive Silver age book", I wonder what source(s) you have in mind?...

 

For what it's worth, AF #15 became the #1 Silver Age book in Overstreet by 1994 (OPG #24). That was 8 years BEFORE the first Spider-Man movie.

 

There's no doubt the movies haven't hurt the value of AF #15s--and HAVE helped--but I think you're wildly exaggerating their importance. When that first Spider-Man movie came out in 2002, it was the 40th anniversary of the character. Sure, Hollywood influences the pop culture psyche--and nosebleed hammer prices to a degree--but, c'mon, this character had been a popular Halloween costume, a doll, a figurine, on wristwatches; this character's likeness was plastered on flashlights, lunchboxes, cups, keychains, pajamas, underwear, and toilet paper--for many moons before the run of Spider-Man movies of the last decade.

 

Seems like there was a substantial sale or two via Sotheby's in the early 1990s; then the advent of the Internet by the mid-1990s; then the 3 movies; and then that million dollar sale in 2011. Even if the movies didn't exist, I'm still convinced AF #15 would've overtaken Showcase #4 and FF #1. And it did overtake the others, in a way, by the mid-1990s when Overstreet began reflecting AF #15 as the #1 Silver Age book.

[AlexanderM]

Me too. but in terms of price jumps, doesnt BB28 have a greater return at this point since AF15 will see marginal price increases?

 

 

Currently, the large gains on BB28 has already been materialized. Gains are much more limited now.. BB28 was stagnant in 2009-2011.

 

Let's be fair.

 

Before the Spider-man movies AF15 was not the most expensive Silver age book. Now it is. BB28 has not had the help from movies that AF15 has. I know a lot of people have a lot (really a lot) of money invested in AF15 and really need the demand to stay high. Therefore any talk of any book out-pacing it will be seen as blasphemy.

 

But in 2013 BB28 has gained significantly more in value than AF15, and the trailer hasn't even been shown yet.

 

I own both books, and love both, but I think some of you guys are being a little unfair to the BB28. But on the other hand - what do you expect in a "Amazing Fantasy #15 Club" thread

 

When you claim "Before the Spider-man movies, AF 15 was not the most expensive Silver age book", I wonder what source(s) you have in mind?...

 

For what it's worth, AF #15 became the #1 Silver Age book in Overstreet by 1994 (OPG #24). That was 8 years BEFORE the first Spider-Man movie.

 

There's no doubt the movies haven't hurt the value of AF #15s--and HAVE helped--but I think you're wildly exaggerating their importance. When that first Spider-Man movie came out in 2002, it was the 40th anniversary of the character. Sure, Hollywood influences the pop culture psyche--and nosebleed hammer prices to a degree--but, c'mon, this character had been a popular Halloween costume, a doll, a figurine, on wristwatches; this character's likeness was plastered on flashlights, lunchboxes, cups, keychains, pajamas, underwear, and toilet paper--for many moons before the run of Spider-Man movies of the last decade.

 

Seems like there was a substantial sale or two via Sotheby's in the early 1990s; then the advent of the Internet by the mid-1990s; then the 3 movies; and then that million dollar sale in 2011. Even if the movies didn't exist, I'm still convinced AF #15 would've overtaken Showcase #4 and FF #1. And it did overtake the others, in a way, by the mid-1990s when Overstreet began reflecting AF #15 as the #1 Silver Age book.

 

As you say the movies have helped the value of AF15. There is no need to debate this - nor the magnitude (because no one will ever know the exact magnitude). And of course AF15 would still be a huge key without any movie. I own the book and love it.

 

We could also look at first appearance of Iron-man and Antman. They were considered third-tier characters before the movies. Antman probably still is because the movie has still to happen, but even the plans have had a very significant influence on 27 and 35. Not to talk about Iron-man's first appearance.

 

My point was that BB28 has not had this help yet. And while Wolverine has become a historically important character (perhaps Marvel's 2nd most popular) the first appearance of the team he is part of (X-men) need not imo. be more valuable than first appearance of JLA (rather the opposite imo.). Same could be said about Avengers.

 

The second point is that BB28 has increased more in value in 2013 than AF15. This is not opinion just fact.

[gcwatson94]

[namisgr]

From the sounds and looks of it, we're just judging keys by value.

 

If thats the case, lets just rank them from most expensive to cheapest and be done with it.

 

Personally? I think its MUCH cooler showing a buddy FF #5 and Doom than it is showing ST #110. Once I pull out the ST 110, most would be like... 'huh?"

 

That's too bad, because Ditko's art on Strange Tales is second to none, and the character is way cool.

 

[AlexanderM]

From the sounds and looks of it, we're just judging keys by value.

 

If thats the case, lets just rank them from most expensive to cheapest and be done with it.

 

Personally? I think its MUCH cooler showing a buddy FF #5 and Doom than it is showing ST #110. Once I pull out the ST 110, most would be like... 'huh?"

 

That's too bad, because Ditko's art on Strange Tales is second to none, and the character is way cool.

 

 

For what it is worth I would much rather have a ST110 than a FF5. I honestly don't even see those two as in the same league. I really like Doom and all, but to me it is a bit like comparing Spider-man to the Green Goblin.

[Shawn Low]

 

For what it is worth I would much rather have a ST110 than a FF5. I honestly don't even see those two as in the same league. I really like Doom and all, but to me it is a bit like comparing Spider-man to the Green Goblin.

 

Perhaps it's a Heroes vs Villains thing. Key first appearances of superheroes always trump (by price at least) the first appearance of their nemesis.

 

Ie:

 

FF/Doom

Spidey/DocOck

Thor/Loki

Supes/Lex

Batman/Joker

 

etc.

 

 

[Kindle-migration]

 

Can someone please list current prices for AF 15 in 1.0 to 3.0 grades?