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Can we really trust CGC? Why are grades on my books so low?
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254 posts in this topic

Seven of my Watchmen books were graded by a well respected grader:

 

If we continue to let comic book grading be the Wild Wild West, we are going to end up with a joke of an industry on the brink of failure like in the 90's. An expert in grading should be right most of the time. We have to stop this send it in blind grading that has has been proven over and over to be faulty. I am so upset with this because, I believe these grades are unfair and in order to even try to get them changed I have to spend more money.

I hate to rant but does anyone understand what i am going through? I have a Watchmen #1 and #4 that an expert tells me are a 9.8 not a 9.8- not a 9.6+ but a solid 9.8. I get both back at 9.4's. Please do not beat me up on this but how do I even know these are the books I sent?

I believe my grader, I believe his grades on the money.

Out of 7 books he gets 4 wrong. way wrong? I do not agree with that. But, the bigger problem is, it is all opinion. Instead of so black and white why why not have a 9.8+, 9.8- and 9.8? I am not sending anymore books to the CGC. I can not keep spending money on "hope" or "moods" or things could get damaged during shipping all these excuses. If CGC really wants to establish themselves as the future. Why not train people and let them grade books in locations all over th country with a drop off and pick up. Instead of a few people sitting in a room at one location. There are only about 151 Watchmen 9.8 in existence right now. My grader told me mine was a 9.8 it came back a 9.4. CGC says this expert grader missed 4 out of 7. Now, why would I send any more books to CGC when I can figure out why I got the grade I have. A miss of 1 or 2 maybe... but 4 is too many for me. Nobody's right, nobody's wrong... it is just the wild wild west of comics and we are supposed to shell out big bucks for an opinion.

I do not think I will be a part of it and I do not see a future for this type of manipulation either.

Thanks for listening to me rant, now I am going to start enjoying books again instead of spending money to cast them in an opinionated cell.

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Welcome to the boards. Did you get the grader notes on the comics? Maybe the comics were damaged in transit to CGC? Do you have any before scans (and also post the after scans when you get the books in hand)?

Can you pm the name of the well respected grader?

 

Brian

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Who is your expert grader? Does he have any chops as far as CGC grading "standards" are concerned, or is he someone that has been in comics for years, but hasn't done much with CGC? If so, chances are his grades are going to be off until he starts reviewing hundreds of CGC graded books. 1 and 4 are both notoriously hard in 9.8 because of production defects. Why did you get them graded in the first place? Are they for your collection? Or were you looking for the big 9.8 to flip for a profit?

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I thought about that but out of 7 ...4 missed grades but the other 3 made grade and one went from a 9.6+ to a 9.8. I will just put it like this the 3 that came back at 9.8 are not worth half of what the number 1 and number 4 are. I believe and this is just IMHO that undergrading is going on on the rare Watchmen books. But, since I can not prove anything and everyone wants to blame the grader or shipping I will just keep my books safe at home and maybe one day, the powers that be will decide to get serious about grading and establish a drop off and pick up point so there will be no excuses. As I have said before I have complete faith in my grader. But, I have heard enough horror stories about CGC. Out of 7 books 4 are way off? I do not buy that at all not with one coming back higher than expected. I believe rare issues are being graded harsher or something is wrong. There has to be away to prove that a book you send in is the book you receive back. It tells a lot about CGC that they have not found a solution for this yet. Or maybe they are not concerned about it.

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I am sorry to rant. I planned to believe it or not get them in a large frame with plastic covering for my childeren. Because I love the Watchmen so much. I wanted them to have the much ado 9.8 collection. I have 8 of the 12 in 9.8 but without number 1, 4, and 8 I am in a bad place. Those 3 alone will run about $1000 on ebay. I really needed those, now I will have to give up on it but I guess the lesson is worth more than the money. I am going to tell my kids to buy comics for the reason I did for the story and the art and forget about all this certified . I gave it a chance and I see that the extent of this goes far beyond what I want to be a part of. I would not have ever started this quest if I had not really thought I had a 9.8 number one.

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It's funny that this was posted today.

I just got back my batch of 20 moderns sent in October (I'm in Canada, so I know it's a little longer).

I always pre-screen through CGC, ALWAYS. Until my last batch :mad:. Now before I tell you what happened, this is the first time I've sent in books this year (2008), and I've read and re-read the complaints on these boards about the new regime but I didn't think it would change so drastically.

Anyways, to make a long story short, I sent in quite a few (6 copies), of New Mutants 98, and 5 issues of Amazing in the 200's. Years past these were no brainer 9.8's, EVEN THOUGH I pre-screened the books (so I donated my extra $3). Well anyways today I get 1 9.8, 1, out of the 5 Amazing's and 6 New Mutants. Now I'm thinking maybe I missed 1 or 2, but to miss on 10 books?!? It just seems to me that they've changed their standards on 9.8's--am I wrong?

I'm still going to use CGC, they're the industry standard, but I will never non-pre-screen again!

Just my thoughts.

Jay

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Jay lets be honest what is the point? If experts can not agree on the basic condition of a book what good will it do to get an opinion on it? So, what are we to do if we do not like the grade? Pay again and again until they get it right? No, I will not. I do not send book in "hope" of getting a grade. I have them graded by one of the best in the industry. If my grader says a book is a 9.8 and CGC says it is a 9.4 and both are experts there is a problem there. We do need a way to grade comic books and protect investments. But, I see CGC is not the way to go. After I got my books back it makes me want to go out and buy up all the Watchmen #1 at 9.4 and 9.6 because I know there are tons of them out there that got down graded just like mine did that should be 9.8's. Lord forbid there be too man 9.8's of a certain comic book.

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Jay lets be honest what is the point? If experts can not agree on the basic condition of a book what good will it do to get an opinion on it? So, what are we to do if we do not like the grade? Pay again and again until they get it right? No, I will not. I do not send book in "hope" of getting a grade. I have them graded by one of the best in the industry. If my grader says a book is a 9.8 and CGC says it is a 9.4 and both are experts there is a problem there. We do need a way to grade comic books and protect investments. But, I see CGC is not the way to go. After I got my books back it makes me want to go out and buy up all the Watchmen #1 at 9.4 and 9.6 because I know there are tons of them out there that got down graded just like mine did that should be 9.8's. Lord forbid there be too man 9.8's of a certain comic book.

 

If you want to be taken seriously around here, you need to cut down on the conspiracy .

 

Unlike your "expert grader" there are plenty of people around here who have proven time & time again that they know how to grade to CGC's standards - your expert obviously doesn't, which, as much as it sucks for you, doesn't really have anything to do with CGC, but rather with you trusting somebody who doesn't have the track record to back up this trust.

 

I don't know what your goal is here - but how about you:

 

a) tell us who this expert grader is

b) post some scans of the books that were supposed be 9.8's

 

because with you being a complete newbie that's the only way these complaints will seem credible in any way.

 

And, btw, there's a reason why some Watchmen issues are harder to find in CGC 9.8 than others - it's called production defects (thumbs u

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Thanks mschmidt,

 

But, no thanks I am not here to conform to what you think a comic book person should be. I love the Watchmen and I read them for the first time at the age of 10. I have several copies of each issue and every girl, I ever dated including my wife was asked to read the Watchmen and tell me what they thought about it. I asked them to read it because it was that important to me... to have them read IMHO one of the greatest stories of all time. I am not asking for your blessings because no matter what you say... the book will remain a 9.4. The problem with all this now is everyone is an expert, well I do not want to be an expert. I just want better standards and rules so everything is not so open to "feelings" and "interpretation" I have bought comics not collected them for a long time and I feel standards would help us all. I do not want a repeat of the 90's, I want my children to enjoy comics the way I did... and that is why I wanted the Watchmen collection. So, they could witness the mecca of comic books. So, if you do not agree with me that is fine but I am not revealing any sources and anyone's name. I have heard enough horror stories on here about CGC and their methods and now I have my own. I do not want to be an expert, you can have that title. Why don't you reveal some of the name of the graders who are undergrading these book at teh CGC?

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Thanks mschmidt,

 

But, no thanks I am not here to conform to what you think a comic book person should be. I love the Watchmen and I read them for the first time at the age of 10. I have several copies of each issue and every girl, I ever dated including my wife was asked to read the Watchmen and tell me what they thought about it. I asked them to read it because it was that important to me... to have them read IMHO one of the greatest stories of all time. I am not asking for your blessings because no matter what you say... the book will remain a 9.4. The problem with all this now is everyone is an expert, well I do not want to be an expert. I just want better standards and rules so everything is not so open to "feelings" and "interpretation" I have bought comics not collected them for a long time and I feel standards would help us all. I do not want a repeat of the 90's, I want my children to enjoy comics the way I did... and that is why I wanted the Watchmen collection. So, they could witness the mecca of comic books. So, if you do not agree with me that is fine but I am not revealing any sources and anyone's name. I have heard enough horror stories on here about CGC and their methods and now I have my own. I do not want to be an expert, you can have that title. Why don't you reveal some of the name of the graders who are undergrading these book at teh CGC?

 

The problem is your thinking. There IS a standard. CGC has set it. If your personal grader is not meeting the standard then he/she is not a good grader. It's a harsh reality to accept, but loving comics does not entitle you to good grades on them. Everyone who takes an interest in truly high grade books goes through an adjustment period learning the ins-and-outs of CGC style grading. Either accept that there is a standard and put in the time to at least become comfortable with it, or quit grinching. What you want already exists. Embrace it. Or don't.

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The problem with all this now is everyone is an expert, well I do not want to be an expert. I just want better standards and rules so everything is not so open to "feelings" and "interpretation"

 

None of us are experts. As stated before, you probably missed something. I just got a 9.0 book back that I swore was at least a 9.4.

 

Guess what, I missed something. About .4 somethings to be exact.

 

:o

 

It happens.

 

Edit: After looking at it again, really closely, I found the something.

Edited by Timmay
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:news:

 

 

To the original poster. I dont care who your expert grader is, everyone misses something sometimes. Do not ever buy book unless you KNOW how to grade, and have a ballpark of how CGC works. There is no 9.6+ that would be a 9.8, there is also no 9.6- that would be 9.4. I have never met anyone with a 100% accuracy rate for finding 9.8's (except I am 5 for 5 at the moment, but expect that to change.) so your un-named expert grader isnt flying here.

 

My advice. Send your books to PGX get the high grades you oh so desire and sell them when you are bored for 25-60% of what cgc books would get.

 

 

Dude.

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