TMNT #1 Club
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3,259 posts in this topic

1 hour ago, Ryan. said:

I'd be curious to see what mid-grade to upper mid-grades would sell for now. Would they take a hit due to not being high grade, or would they actually turn in higher than expected results since it's an opportunity for collectors who don't have ultra deep pockets to get a first print?

For example, if I had $8000 to spend on a TMNT 1, would I shoot for a 9.6 second print or, let's say, a 4.0 first print. I'm not so sure.

4.0 1st print.  What the heck!   That's the first appearance.  

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3 hours ago, Ryan. said:

I'd be curious to see what mid-grade to upper mid-grades would sell for now. Would they take a hit due to not being high grade, or would they actually turn in higher than expected results since it's an opportunity for collectors who don't have ultra deep pockets to get a first print?

Well, from my own personal point of view, that's when a comic book becomes a true vintage collectible is when it's able to sell for multiples to condition guide in all grades across the entire condition spectrum and not only in the uber 9.8 and 9.9 condition levels only.  (thumbsu

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It's an interesting discussion but I don't think you could get a 4.0 for 8K...I have a friend who recently bought a 5.5 for 13K.

I personally was in that position myself recently, of 2nd 9.6 or a 1st, until I was able to trade a page of art for a 1st print. I'd owned a couple in the past but had sold them through the years and kept my 2nd print SS 9.6. When I decided to get a 1st, I realized there was no way I could covert my 2nd print into anything of the kind of grade I'd want in a 1st. Low grades of these are scarce as is but that all black cover would likely REALLY accentuate the flaws in a low grade. So for me, I was simply going to keep my 2nd print 9.6 as it looks great vs maybe being able to get a 2.5.

Fortunately, it all turned into a moot point when I was able to trade art for the kind of book I wanted! :banana: I still have the 2nd print, and I'm still not sure if I'm keeping it or not at this point.

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29 minutes ago, TMNT said:

It's an interesting discussion but I don't think you could get a 4.0 for 8K...I have a friend who recently bought a 5.5 for 13K.

I personally was in that position myself recently, of 2nd 9.6 or a 1st, until I was able to trade a page of art for a 1st print. I'd owned a couple in the past but had sold them through the years and kept my 2nd print SS 9.6. When I decided to get a 1st, I realized there was no way I could covert my 2nd print into anything of the kind of grade I'd want in a 1st. Low grades of these are scarce as is but that all black cover would likely REALLY accentuate the flaws in a low grade. So for me, I was simply going to keep my 2nd print 9.6 as it looks great vs maybe being able to get a 2.5.

Fortunately, it all turned into a moot point when I was able to trade art for the kind of book I wanted! :banana: I still have the 2nd print, and I'm still not sure if I'm keeping it or not at this point.

Interesting. To me it would be insane to spend $8000 on a GD/VG copy but then I see what coverless or beater copies of AF 15 sell for and doesn't look so crazy. 

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6 hours ago, Gazoony said:

Personally I'd take a 1st print over a second print anyday. The first print is the "true" first appearance of the turtles. I would never be satisfied with a 2nd, 3rd or whatever print. Just my opinion.

Agreed.  Not only is it the actual first appearance, the comic that started it all.... it's also rarer. 

Otherwise,  DC should make a second print of action comics 1 and start selling that for a million dollars and see if anyone bites. 

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Im tempted to agree with @Icculus308win on this one but it's dependant upon the grade. From what I've seen over the last 15 years a high grade 2nd print (9.6/9.8) is far harder to get a hold of than a lower grade 1st print.

The second print was only a few months after the 1st and had a low print run too. Collectors were not as interested in 2nd prints in those days and it was seen as a reader or something you could bleach to make look like a 1st print. I have often wondered how many were damaged in an attempt to fake them into a first print. There are very few 2nd prints in high grade on the census compared to the 1st and 3rd prints:

1st print:  980 total slabs, 32 in 9.8, 56 in 9.6 ---- print run 3200

2nd print: 529 total slabs, 9 in 9.8, 37 in 9.6 ---- print run 6000

3rd print: 1214 total slabs, 66 in 9.8, 142 in 9.6 ---- print run 35000

So I think the predominant factor is value. 1st print blows 2nd print out of the water, it's not even close. A 9.6 2nd print went for $6250 in Jan 2021 whereas you can't get a 1st print 4.0 for less than $10k. What's interesting is that the print run for 2nd print is closer to first print but the values are in line with the 3rd print even though there are more than 5 times as many. For this reason I think the 2nd print is undervalued and will rise accordingly over the next year.

Getting back to the temptation of @Icculus308win (and this is from the perspective of 2 collectors who own 9.8's of every issue discussed so far) I would be far more likely to hold onto my 2nd print 9.8 than either of the other prints in 9.8 - but that wasn't the scenario provided. 

22 hours ago, Ryan. said:

 

For example, if I had $8000 to spend on a TMNT 1, would I shoot for a 9.6 second print or, let's say, a 4.0 first print. I'm not so sure.

Here I would choose the low grade 1st print. but here:

$12,000 for a 4.5 1st print or 9.8 2nd print?

I would choose the 2nd print all day every day

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15 hours ago, pubmonkey said:

Im tempted to agree with @Icculus308win on this one but it's dependant upon the grade. From what I've seen over the last 15 years a high grade 2nd print (9.6/9.8) is far harder to get a hold of than a lower grade 1st print.

The second print was only a few months after the 1st and had a low print run too. Collectors were not as interested in 2nd prints in those days and it was seen as a reader or something you could bleach to make look like a 1st print. I have often wondered how many were damaged in an attempt to fake them into a first print. There are very few 2nd prints in high grade on the census compared to the 1st and 3rd prints:

1st print:  980 total slabs, 32 in 9.8, 56 in 9.6 ---- print run 3200

2nd print: 529 total slabs, 9 in 9.8, 37 in 9.6 ---- print run 6000

3rd print: 1214 total slabs, 66 in 9.8, 142 in 9.6 ---- print run 35000

So I think the predominant factor is value. 1st print blows 2nd print out of the water, it's not even close. A 9.6 2nd print went for $6250 in Jan 2021 whereas you can't get a 1st print 4.0 for less than $10k. What's interesting is that the print run for 2nd print is closer to first print but the values are in line with the 3rd print even though there are more than 5 times as many. For this reason I think the 2nd print is undervalued and will rise accordingly over the next year.

Getting back to the temptation of @Icculus308win (and this is from the perspective of 2 collectors who own 9.8's of every issue discussed so far) I would be far more likely to hold onto my 2nd print 9.8 than either of the other prints in 9.8 - but that wasn't the scenario provided. 

Here I would choose the low grade 1st print. but here:

$12,000 for a 4.5 1st print or 9.8 2nd print?

I would choose the 2nd print all day every day

For value I absolutely agree, I would choose the 2nd print too. But if I had to choose only one to keep for the rest of my life and couldn't sell, I'd pick the first print and love it forever. 😃

 

One day I'll get me a first print, but I'm working on the rest of the original run until the right opportunity comes along. 

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5 hours ago, Gazoony said:

For value I absolutely agree, I would choose the 2nd print too. But if I had to choose only one to keep for the rest of my life and couldn't sell, I'd pick the first print and love it forever. 😃

 

One day I'll get me a first print, but I'm working on the rest of the original run until the right opportunity comes along. 

I'm the same.   I would want a piece of history for my permanent collection and that's a 1st print all the way.  The market seems to think this way as well because even low grade prices getting out way of my league...but maybe it will correct one day.  :cry:

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9 hours ago, DPV said:

I only recently found this forum.  We lost my Dad last year.  Dementia is a vicious disease.  But I'm here to share our story.  My Dad used to go to comic book conventions and shows and was friendly with Eastman and Laird in the 80's.  He used to see them at the shows and they'd always chat at each other's tables.  Dad had all signed first print comics from them, #1-10, many in multiples.  I inherited my Dad's collection and am reselling most of it with Comic Connect.  But they're difficult to let go of.  I grew up with these stories (I was born in 84), but hadn't gone through his comics with him in 30 years+.  Growing up and loving TMNT, It was so cool to go through his collection and see everything he had.  And I'm just realizing that the value of these comics is a bit crazy.  The TMNT #1 CGC 8.5 is up to $14,400 now!  I can't believe how much these are worth.  I can vouch for the signature, my Dad has been telling me this story my whole life.  Selling these comics is sad, but it is helping my Mom retire.  So I am so very grateful.  I am currently in the #1 club!  If anyone else wants to join the club with an 8.5, bidding is up and it's all going to help my Mom retire.  I am keeping some of the TMNT 1st prints... they will always be a connection to my Dad.  I miss going to comic shows with Dad and meeting folks that are also passionate about them.  Take care all!

Sorry for your loss, good luck with the auction

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14 hours ago, DPV said:

I only recently found this forum.  We lost my Dad last year.  Dementia is a vicious disease.  But I'm here to share our story.  My Dad used to go to comic book conventions and shows and was friendly with Eastman and Laird in the 80's.  He used to see them at the shows and they'd always chat at each other's tables.  Dad had all signed first print comics from them, #1-10, many in multiples.  I inherited my Dad's collection and am reselling most of it with Comic Connect.  But they're difficult to let go of.  I grew up with these stories (I was born in 84), but hadn't gone through his comics with him in 30 years+.  Growing up and loving TMNT, It was so cool to go through his collection and see everything he had.  And I'm just realizing that the value of these comics is a bit crazy.  The TMNT #1 CGC 8.5 is up to $14,400 now!  I can't believe how much these are worth.  I can vouch for the signature, my Dad has been telling me this story my whole life.  Selling these comics is sad, but it is helping my Mom retire.  So I am so very grateful.  I am currently in the #1 club!  If anyone else wants to join the club with an 8.5, bidding is up and it's all going to help my Mom retire.  I am keeping some of the TMNT 1st prints... they will always be a connection to my Dad.  I miss going to comic shows with Dad and meeting folks that are also passionate about them.  Take care all!

How many times are you gonna post the same post? I think you forgot CGeneral, and the magazine section,  how about the water cooler.

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22 minutes ago, oakman29 said:

How many times are you gonna post the same post? I think you forgot CGeneral, and the magazine section,  how about the water cooler.

I wasn't really sure where to post.  Sorry to offend.  Not exactly the welcome I was hoping for.

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