Am I wasting my time buying CGC 9.8's..... 1 1

[theCapraAegagrus]

Just now, Krismusic said:

https://www.plastics.ca/PlasticTopics/RecyclingPlastics

this might be true to Canada as from what I read many plastic recyclers in Canada expand their types of plastic's that can be recycled. I do know that for consumer waste generally most plastic isn't sorted as the logistics makes it cost ineffective. but if its a large shipment of plastic is organized properly it can maybe then be re-used, etc.. 

 

Sorry for digressing from the Topic. 

There are tons of products that use plastics - like copolymers - that aren't recyclable, though. Stuff like >GF-PA70<, which is 70% nylon, doesn't have a chance of recycling. It's just scrap. That's the kinda stuff I am talking about.

[Red_Hood]

3 hours ago, valiantman said:

Because sellers on Ebay (in the 1990s) were constantly selling 7.5s that they called "near mint".  CGC isn't perfect, but 9.2 to 9.8 opinions are much, much better than sellers with 7.5 books calling them "near mint".

I agree that there were/are problems with poor sellers with the example you provided, valiantman.  But the onus should fall on the collector to educate themselves and learn to understand the difference in the grades.  Otherwise, they are putting a lot of faith in others to tell them what they should be buying.  Taking the time to learn and putting the work and effort to do as much research as possible will save so much money in the long run.  My personal opinion is that people are too lazy to put that effort in and its costing them dearly.

Edited December 4, 2019 by Red_Hood

[valiantman]

6 minutes ago, Red_Hood said:

I agree that there were/are problems with poor sellers with the example you provided, valiantman.  But the onus should fall on the collector to educate themselves and learn to understand the difference in the grades.  Otherwise, they are putting a lot of faith in others to tell them what they should be buying.  Taking the time to learn and putting the work and effort to do as much research as possible will save so much money in the long run.  My personal opinion is that people are too lazy to put that effort in and its costing them dearly.

Possibly - but my opinion is that any comic that is worth $100+ (before it's graded) for a particular grade and worth much, much less if it is overgraded should be considered for buying "already slabbed".  Why risk $100+ buying a $100 raw book that ends up being worth $20 for overgrading, when you could have guaranteed the CGC slabbed grade for just a few dollars more?   Between losing 80% or "paying extra" (20% to 50%) for an already-slabbed book, the math says go with slabbed.  Additionally, even if you are an excellent grader and you have the opportunity to closely inspect a raw book (not possible on ebay, but sure, in person, it's possible), there is no guarantee that the next person will agree with your grade.  Then you'll have to defend your own grading (and who are you? who am I? etc.) when you're ready to sell a raw book.  CGC graded books don't need to be defended on the 2nd sale, 3rd sale, etc.  They are what they are... and what they are is "more liquid", "higher buyer confidence", and "certified for future sales".  Raw books provide none of these benefits.  For a $5 book, it doesn't matter.  For a $100,000 book, it definitely matters.  For everything in between, it's up to the buyer to figure out how much they're willing to lose. 

[Hamlet]

6 hours ago, valiantman said:

Possibly - but my opinion is that any comic that is worth $100+ (before it's graded) for a particular grade and worth much, much less if it is overgraded should be considered for buying "already slabbed".  Why risk $100+ buying a $100 raw book that ends up being worth $20 for overgrading, when you could have guaranteed the CGC slabbed grade for just a few dollars more?   Between losing 80% or "paying extra" (20% to 50%) for an already-slabbed book, the math says go with slabbed.  Additionally, even if you are an excellent grader and you have the opportunity to closely inspect a raw book (not possible on ebay, but sure, in person, it's possible), there is no guarantee that the next person will agree with your grade.  Then you'll have to defend your own grading (and who are you? who am I? etc.) when you're ready to sell a raw book.  CGC graded books don't need to be defended on the 2nd sale, 3rd sale, etc.  They are what they are... and what they are is "more liquid", "higher buyer confidence", and "certified for future sales".  Raw books provide none of these benefits.  For a $5 book, it doesn't matter.  For a $100,000 book, it definitely matters.  For everything in between, it's up to the buyer to figure out how much they're willing to lose. 

I think the issue is that it is rarely “just a few dollars more”.  You can often get raw books for a lot less than a comparable slabbed copy, especially at the ~ $100 price point you mention.  You have to be careful, and good at grading, but that uncertainty can work in either direction.  The cost of slabbing is a huge percentage of the price of a $100 book.  

For me, the biggest issue I have with slabbed books is I can’t see the inside of the book, and CGC’s label notes are not detailed enough for me to know if the book has internal defects I hate.  Staple half-popped?  Centerfold loose at one staple?  Is the interior cover tanning?  These are all defects I’m left in the dark about when buying a slabbed book.  

And I hate to beat this horse, but for the most part I expect that any slabbed book I buy has been pressed/cleaned/manipulated ( at least once ).  

 

[tv horror]

14 hours ago, THE_BEYONDER said:

Surely the plastic used to make CGC cases will be banned in 20 years...

I'm sitting on a nearly complete set of Spider-man titles less three issues and the only plastic I have is the bags they are placed in, as for grading I don't care they are my babies so long as they are complete and no tears. I love reading my comics I figure that if they have lasted this long maybe swotting bugs the odd head or two fencing with or just to cover your face from the Sun that they have done their job and I'm happy with my lot. Yes I'm CRAZY but a crazy happy Spiderfan! 

Edited December 5, 2019 by tv horror

[RockMyAmadeus]

14 hours ago, valiantman said:

14 hours ago, Red_Hood said:

I'm finding it harder to understand why people put so much faith into 3rd party grading companies.  At the end of the day its only their opinion and its been demonstrated time and time again that the same book gets a different grade on many occasions.

I can't even recall all the times I've had a book graded 9.6 and then cracked it out and sent it in again and received a 9.8.

Also many books I've sent in thinking it would get 9.2 and they give it a 9.8

A lot of people paying a lot of money for an opinion by that one grader on that one specific day, hoping you don't get that harsh grader who nitpicks anything on the book 

or the loose grader who misses those same flaws.  
 

The high volume of books churning through has caused a wide variety of "opinions" and not much weight on consistent standards.

 

Because sellers on Ebay (in the 1990s) were constantly selling 7.5s that they called "near mint".  CGC isn't perfect, but 9.2 to 9.8 opinions are much, much better than sellers with 7.5 books calling them "near mint".

Yes to both of you. Yes, yes, yes. 

[Krismusic]

12 hours ago, Hamlet said:

I think the issue is that it is rarely “just a few dollars more”.  You can often get raw books for a lot less than a comparable slabbed copy, especially at the ~ $100 price point you mention.  You have to be careful, and good at grading, but that uncertainty can work in either direction.  The cost of slabbing is a huge percentage of the price of a $100 book.  

For me, the biggest issue I have with slabbed books is I can’t see the inside of the book, and CGC’s label notes are not detailed enough for me to know if the book has internal defects I hate.  Staple half-popped?  Centerfold loose at one staple?  Is the interior cover tanning?  These are all defects I’m left in the dark about when buying a slabbed book.  

And I hate to beat this horse, but for the most part I expect that any slabbed book I buy has been pressed/cleaned/manipulated ( at least once ).  

 

One thing I am seeing a lot more of is people pressing raws and selling them so its not just slabs you almost have to expect all books have had a Mr. Clean magic eraser, hot iron or t shirt press taken to them now. 

(seeing this as a trend on some Facebook groups)

Edited December 5, 2019 by Krismusic
added source

[theCapraAegagrus]

1 minute ago, Krismusic said:

One thing I am seeing a lot more of is people pressing raws and selling them so its not just slabs you almost have to expect all books have had a Mr. Clean magic eraser, hot iron or t shirt press taken to them now.

[Krismusic]

Just now, theCapraAegagrus said:

your telling me.. the many amateur youtube video's showing to use Mr Clean magic erasers to clean up their books even on moderns; it lifts some colours too and the youtuber is like yeah it will remove some colour but if your light on the pressure no one notice it... 

 

[theCapraAegagrus]

1 minute ago, Krismusic said:

your telling me.. the many amateur youtube video's showing to use Mr Clean magic erasers to clean up their books even on moderns; it lifts some colours too and the youtuber is like yeah it will remove some colour but if your light on the pressure no one notice it... 

I like the 1st/2nd Gen of CGC labels more and more every day.

[Krismusic]

4 minutes ago, theCapraAegagrus said:

I like the 1st/2nd Gen of CGC labels more and more every day.

.. I would do some more research but I though pressing was kind of known slightly but probably only done on high dollar books.. I'll have to do some research but I thought I read something about pressing being around even before CGC. but I could be wrong. 

 

Edited December 5, 2019 by Krismusic
found the thread

[Krismusic]

5 minutes ago, theCapraAegagrus said:

I like the 1st/2nd Gen of CGC labels more and more every day.

at least with those gens you dont have to worry about the MR clean magic erasers  

[theCapraAegagrus]

2 minutes ago, Krismusic said:

.. I would do some more research but I though pressing was kind of known slightly but probably only done on high dollar books.. I'll have to do some research but I thought I read something about pressing being around even before CGC. but I could be wrong. 

Well, yeah, but not at the frequency/volume of today. It was still in its infancy back then. I don't think amateurs tinkered with it. Everyone and their grandma are looking at comic books as stocks these days - trying to (literally) squeeze pennies out of 'em. I h8 it.

[eastcoaster]

On 12/3/2019 at 12:15 PM, Hollywood1892 said:

Hmmm

I guess it comes down to perspective.

I wonder if its brought more people to the hobby

I don't think I'd collect raw books now. I bought plenty when I was reading but now I just want preserved memories and art.

[Hollywood1892]

I'm looking at a 9.4 right now from '71