N e r V Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 10 hours ago, Randall Dowling said: They are his under copies. I wasn't joking about his 6th, 7th, and 8th undercopies. Although, I think there are certain issues that board members raided (think Eerie 23 and Vampirella 1)! There are certain flaws that CGC doesn't consider when they grade that are deal breakers for him. And aside from books that have already been graded, none of them have been restored, smashed, or otherwise played with. Still, believe it or not, after having bought thousands of magazines, there are some issues that he's still looking to upgrade. That's how hard certain Warrens are to find in very high grade (I'm looking at you, Eerie 50). Yes so if any of you out there know where a nice copy of the Ten Commandments tablet is, Steve is looking for it. He plans on putting it in his den between the Holy Grail and the UFO remains from Area 51.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevemmg Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 Picked up a couple of Vampirella mags on Saturday at the Mighty Con in Wheaton. The 3 is an undercopy, so if anyone is looking for one, this one could go. Any interesting trades? Randall Dowling and Brandon Shepherd 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Shepherd Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 7 hours ago, N e r V said: I’m still of the opinion that magazine slabbing is easily 10-15 years behind its cousin the comic book. I think certain keys are probably less far behind but most magazines still exist with raw copies out there capable of becoming the next “highest graded” or among the top tiers. I just don’t believe that slabbing or pressing has taken off with magazines remotely like it has in comics. Interesting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Dowling Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 7 hours ago, N e r V said: I’m still of the opinion that magazine slabbing is easily 10-15 years behind its cousin the comic book. I think certain keys are probably less far behind but most magazines still exist with raw copies out there capable of becoming the next “highest graded” or among the top tiers. I just don’t believe that slabbing or pressing has taken off with magazines remotely like it has in comics. I think you're right to a degree, Brett (and frankly, I hope it stays that way). However, there were others locking down and certifying the best copies they could find 10-15 years ago and ran into the same scarcity for certain issues. I don't doubt that nicer copies of Eerie 50 will show up, but I think the current census is a good early indicator of which issues are more challenging in high grade. When I look at every issue around Eerie 50 having 8-12 copies certified with 9.4-9.8 at the top and Eerie 50 having only 3 copies, I think that's a legitimate indication that Eerie 50 is pretty tough in higher grades. Also, I'm pretty sure that magazines (for the most part) are less "improvable" (I really hate that word for pressing) than comics are. When black covers get a stress on the spine, they tend to break color. And there's a lot of black covers on magazines! The Lions Den, oakman29, Stevemmg and 1 other 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Dowling Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 7 hours ago, N e r V said: Yes so if any of you out there know where a nice copy of the Ten Commandments tablet is, Steve is looking for it. He plans on putting it in his den between the Holy Grail and the UFO remains from Area 51.... You joke but he does, in fact, have a skeleton from Bigfoot, so... The Lions Den 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakman29 Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 1 hour ago, Randall Dowling said: I think you're right to a degree, Brett (and frankly, I hope it stays that way). However, there were others locking down and certifying the best copies they could find 10-15 years ago and ran into the same scarcity for certain issues. I don't doubt that nicer copies of Eerie 50 will show up, but I think the current census is a good early indicator of which issues are more challenging in high grade. When I look at every issue around Eerie 50 having 8-12 copies certified with 9.4-9.8 at the top and Eerie 50 having only 3 copies, I think that's a legitimate indication that Eerie 50 is pretty tough in higher grades. Also, I'm pretty sure that magazines (for the most part) are less "improvable" (I really hate that word for pressing) than comics are. When black covers get a stress on the spine, they tend to break color. And there's a lot of black covers on magazines! 100% agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N e r V Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 2 hours ago, Randall Dowling said: I think you're right to a degree, Brett (and frankly, I hope it stays that way). However, there were others locking down and certifying the best copies they could find 10-15 years ago and ran into the same scarcity for certain issues. I don't doubt that nicer copies of Eerie 50 will show up, but I think the current census is a good early indicator of which issues are more challenging in high grade. When I look at every issue around Eerie 50 having 8-12 copies certified with 9.4-9.8 at the top and Eerie 50 having only 3 copies, I think that's a legitimate indication that Eerie 50 is pretty tough in higher grades. Also, I'm pretty sure that magazines (for the most part) are less "improvable" (I really hate that word for pressing) than comics are. When black covers get a stress on the spine, they tend to break color. And there's a lot of black covers on magazines! Black covers as a wide group are tough, period. Comic collectors have been paying premiums for years on books like Spider-Man #28. Magazines do seem to have more than their fair share of black or really dark covers which is a challenge. You’re probably right about how much pressing can help some magazines (great question to ask someone like Joey Post) but I still question how much in general people are even pressing magazines vs comic books today since a lot of mags that may be “tough” aren’t worth the dollars to bother with. I think it’s a value thing with magazines still generally being far behind the comic book. I have no doubt the higher priced mags or keys are pressing candidates. I also believe CGC is a bit “softer” with its grading on magazines for the reasons you cited with general production flaws that may be common in magazines vs the comic book. In the same way golden age books are a little different than grading say, a modern comic. Size is also a factor. I actually use the word of mouth on collectors like yourself or oakman or Steve or Bounty since the trends you guys express as being “tough” gives me a general idea of what to expect in the market because it’s your actual experience. You don’t all agree on everything but to me it’s a better starting point than looking at data from CGC that I find a bit to small or incomplete right now to claim as market facts. I’ve been buying mags long enough now to know that just because of only a handful of mags exist in slabs or high grade it doesn’t automatically make it a fact. Market experience is proving different (for me). So I’m back to my original thought that magazine grading is still very much so years behind the comic book grading in terms of interest. To me that’s kind of a good thing with collecting because in my experience even a current red hot mag like Vampi #1 I still see very high grade copies raw quite a bit out there. Think about some of the top keys in comics in high grade and then think about how many of them come up for sale raw vs slabbed in today’s market... chevalmeow and The Lions Den 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N e r V Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 3 hours ago, Randall Dowling said: You joke but he does, in fact, have a skeleton from Bigfoot, so... I thought he still had a live Bigfoot and a Skelton of a Yeti? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N e r V Posted October 14, 2019 Share Posted October 14, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Annihilus Posted October 15, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted October 15, 2019 (edited) On 10/14/2019 at 9:27 AM, N e r V said: I actually use the word of mouth on collectors like yourself or oakman or Steve or Bounty since the trends you guys express as being “tough” gives me a general idea of what to expect in the market because it’s your actual experience. You don’t all agree on everything but to me it’s a better starting point than looking at data from CGC that I find a bit to small or incomplete right now to claim as market facts. I’ve been buying mags long enough now to know that just because of only a handful of mags exist in slabs or high grade it doesn’t automatically make it a fact. Market experience is proving different (for me). Echoing these comments, I've learned so much about collecting from the pros on these boards during the 12 some years I've been here. Any time I'm out in the wild discussing comics with anyone I happen to run across in shops or whatever, I ultimately drop nuggets I've learned here over the years. Usually several. These boards are one of the single biggest repositories of comic knowledge anywhere (if not the largest). Sure comes in handy, especially with the libraries of false knowledge you can find pretty much anywhere on FaceBook.n Also: the trifecta I was able to acquire from Stevemmg's sweet, sweet sales threads! Edited October 15, 2019 by Annihilus chevalmeow, speedcake, Stevemmg and 4 others 6 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bounty_coder Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 On 10/14/2019 at 6:24 AM, Randall Dowling said: You joke but he does, in fact, have a skeleton from Bigfoot, so... Say, ah, wha!?!?!?! Picture or it doesn't exist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakman29 Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 39 minutes ago, Annihilus said: Echoing these comments, I've learned so much about collecting from the pros on these boards during the 12 some years I've been here. Any time I'm out in the wild discussing comics with anyone I happen to run across in shops or whatever, I ultimately drop nuggets I've learned here over the years. Usually several. These boards are one of the single biggest repositories of comic knowledge anywhere (if not the largest). Sure comes in handy, especially with the libraries of false knowledge you can find pretty much anywhere on FaceBook.n Also: the trifecta I was able to acquire from Stevemmg's sweet, sweet sales threads! Now THAT is a badazz group of books right there.😎 Stevemmg, Annihilus, Randall Dowling and 1 other 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Dowling Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 7 minutes ago, bounty_coder said: Say, ah, wha!?!?!?! Picture or it doesn't exist He has it on the same wall next to some weird crystal skull and electronics don't work around that thing... Stevemmg 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bounty_coder Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 On 10/14/2019 at 9:27 AM, N e r V said: Black covers as a wide group are tough, period. Comic collectors have been paying premiums for years on books like Spider-Man #28. Magazines do seem to have more than their fair share of black or really dark covers which is a challenge. You’re probably right about how much pressing can help some magazines (great question to ask someone like Joey Post) but I still question how much in general people are even pressing magazines vs comic books today since a lot of mags that may be “tough” aren’t worth the dollars to bother with. I think it’s a value thing with magazines still generally being far behind the comic book. I have no doubt the higher priced mags or keys are pressing candidates. I also believe CGC is a bit “softer” with its grading on magazines for the reasons you cited with general production flaws that may be common in magazines vs the comic book. In the same way golden age books are a little different than grading say, a modern comic. Size is also a factor. I actually use the word of mouth on collectors like yourself or oakman or Steve or Bounty since the trends you guys express as being “tough” gives me a general idea of what to expect in the market because it’s your actual experience. You don’t all agree on everything but to me it’s a better starting point than looking at data from CGC that I find a bit to small or incomplete right now to claim as market facts. I’ve been buying mags long enough now to know that just because of only a handful of mags exist in slabs or high grade it doesn’t automatically make it a fact. Market experience is proving different (for me). So I’m back to my original thought that magazine grading is still very much so years behind the comic book grading in terms of interest. To me that’s kind of a good thing with collecting because in my experience even a current red hot mag like Vampi #1 I still see very high grade copies raw quite a bit out there. Think about some of the top keys in comics in high grade and then think about how many of them come up for sale raw vs slabbed in today’s market... Good discussion y'all. Comic Magazine grading differs a little bit than regular Sized Comic grading in a few ways: There are certain defects such as Bindery Tears which are permitted in books up to 9.6/9.8 depending on how the rest of the book is. These are defects that someone who isn't a mag collector and say strictly used to Comic sized grading would scoff at as they look like "tiny spine splits" or Spine Tears (which essentially they are). A 9.6/9.8 with this bindery defect may be deemed a NM- 9.2 raw by most people. It really depends on the perspective and understanding the defect. From a visual perspective it can be a defect which definitely affects the eye appeal so I can see it being shunned more even though the # says otherwise There is a Scale of Size valuation at play here. When everyone says "mags are graded softer" it is not so much that. It is the fact that Mags are bigger; have more real estate thus their defect impact is scaled upwards as well. For example if you took the exact defects on a Certain Mag and Transposed them to a Comic book...all else being equal...The comic get's a lower grade because the surface area of the defects to size of medium ratio is more impact-full. That might blow some minds but that essentially is what it starts to boil down to (in my experience). In terms of Census; yes I do think Mags in general are much further behind. BUT; there are areas where this is normalized. Take Marvel Preview #4 and #7; 2 books that took off like a Rocket (no pun intended) with the GOTG movies. Compare those #'s those of their comic counterparts to get a better idea from a relative perspective. Randall Dowling, Annihilus and oakman29 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N e r V Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 1 hour ago, Annihilus said: Echoing these comments, I've learned so much about collecting from the pros on these boards during the 12 some years I've been here. Any time I'm out in the wild discussing comics with anyone I happen to run across in shops or whatever, I ultimately drop nuggets I've learned here over the years. Usually several. These boards are one of the single biggest repositories of comic knowledge anywhere (if not the largest). Sure comes in handy, especially with the libraries of false knowledge you can find pretty much anywhere on FaceBook.n Also: the trifecta I was able to acquire from Stevemmg's sweet, sweet sales threads! Almost 3 first issues... Can you guess which one kinda is but kinda isn’t? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N e r V Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 Still waiting on my recent Steve thread books but here’s my 9. Dupes or upgrades of a sort for me but I had fun watching the feeding frenzy by some... I got most of the books I was looking for which if you ever tried claiming books while actually having to work you know the challenges. As noted there are a few black or blackish covers which are difficult in grade... Thanks again Steve! batmiesta, Randall Dowling and Stevemmg 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakman29 Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakman29 Posted October 15, 2019 Share Posted October 15, 2019 Vampirella #23 is just an awesome book. Randall Dowling and Stevemmg 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N e r V Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 32 minutes ago, oakman29 said: Vampirella #23 is just an awesome book. It’s always been one of my favorites. Probably because of my love of Eerie #23 I’ve considered it a distant relative... Really digging #90 more these days too. The colors, the art, underrated to me... Stevemmg, oakman29 and Randall Dowling 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N e r V Posted October 16, 2019 Share Posted October 16, 2019 This is one of the few Warren books I bought off the stands too. As a kid the Warren magazines and magazines in general were spotty buys due to price and crowding into my comic book budget. Wanted a better copy of #72 and I got one... So call it a nostalgia buy... oakman29, Randall Dowling and Stevemmg 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
