First Appearance of Spider-Man's Black Costume Anywhere?
0

78 posts in this topic

2,847 posts

most people would say an issue of Marvel Age, cant remember what issue or date on it though

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
45,882 posts

Wasn't Marvel Team up #141 and Secret Wars #8 tied for 1st appearance?

Then ASM #252

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,113 posts

The Marvel Age issue had a prototype costume. Secret Wars 8 is the listed first. Yeah this is a preview book but I am interested in finding the first published appearance of the final design of the black costume and I think this is it. This issue of Amazing Heroes pre-dates the release of Secret Wars 8.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2,113 posts

Marvel Team-Up 141 is one of my most prized Marvel comics for a few reasons. This book has a 75 cent Canadian Variant that is nearly impossible to find, there is a Mark Jeweler Variant, it features one of the earliest appearances of Spider-Man's black costume, oh and the cover was done by Mignola! There are so many things about this book that make it a true comic/Spider-Man collectible. If only I could find the original cover art I would gladly sacrifice my lowest hanging testicle.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9,034 posts

Spectacular Spider-Man (forgot the #) also came out the same time as MTU 141 but it's not noted on the label. Then there is that Marvel Age issue.

 

But for most people:

 

ASM 252 (chronology) and Secret Wars 8 (continuity).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
79,820 posts
Spectacular Spider-Man (forgot the #) also came out the same time as MTU 141 but it's not noted on the label. Then there is that Marvel Age issue.

 

It's this one.

 

2446066-spectacularspider_man090_super.jpg

 

Here are all the Venom appearances in Spectacular (costume and symbiote).

 

Spectacular Spider-Man black suit appearances

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
79,820 posts

Interesting enough, when I looked up Venom on Comicvine to figure out all the appearances of Venom, it reflects 1070 comics.

 

Venom master appearance list

 

:o

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
694 posts

In order by publication date:

 

Amazing Heroes # 39 January 1984 ( preview book )

 

Marvel Age # 12 March 1984 ( preview book )

 

Marvel Team-up # 141 May 1984

 

Amazing Spider-man # 252 May 1984

 

Spectacular Spider-man # 90 May 1984: ( this book does not get much credit because he isnt in the black costume on the cover, and only appears in it, on the last page ).

 

Secret Wars # 8 December 1984 ( publication date is way far past these books, however the story takes place " before" them in marvel continuity )

 

Im sure someone could comment on which week the May issues were released, and we could get a definate answer on which one was first.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
365 posts
Posted (edited)

Alright I’m going to throw my two cents in here as I feel I have some useful information on this topic . I know cgc recognizes ASM 252 and marvel team up 141 as 1st apps of black Spidey what if I told you guys and gals out there that it’s not right . Mmmmmm you say well ok here it is:

the original black spidey concept was first dropped in this issue:

Amazing Heroes # 35 November 15 /1983

 

yes a year before any marvel licensed comic had this . If you read article it refers to the new BLACK and RED costume but because these early fanzines  magazines were printed in black and white you don’t  actually see this colour combo in proper colour print until Marvel Age 12 (1984) few months prior to all known first published appearances. If this isn’t cool enough here are the other very htf fanzines that predate all known published black Spidey appearances . In this order 

Amazing Heroes 35 (November 1983)

The Comic Reader 215 (December 1983)

Heroes Hotline ( 1983 )

Amazing Heroes 39 ( January 1984 )

Marvel Age 12 ( March 1984 ) only colour publication in comic book format 

[ photos are of interior article inside Marvel Age 12]

imageproxy.php?img=&key=31b352271b3a5a4b

5167BDE5-F2F8-4D52-AFA5-2A389906C284.png

FE472EAA-46F2-4998-B57A-F05647CAA592.png

196398F9-8BDB-4A62-8406-8378A0F787B0.png

41AC9E3A-ADD0-4B8F-BE1B-66B2AD4CA43E.jpeg

Edited by Subby1938

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
365 posts

Marvel Age article continued ...

4983B5D5-0D2F-4E6D-A38F-9A55CB21F660.jpeg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
365 posts

There is one publication even earlier than listed group I have I’m not sure on its distribution or as viable contender but here it is for the purist out there 

 

The Comic Journal # 85 (October 1983 )

E05CE359-0FF6-49FC-9F6E-B8F557A60D00.png

E549B911-CF9E-4FF2-89EC-4B2A12826359.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
54,946 posts

The first appearance of the black costume is ASM #252. Anything prior to that is marketing previews and promotional material. Since comic books are a storytelling medium, the first appearance of *anything* only counts if it's in the context of the story, which has been the traditional understanding since comics fandom began, or Action Comics #12 would be the first appearance of Batman.

And, even with all of that, all the previews talk about a black AND RED costume, which wasn't the final design...so it's not even the same costume.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
54,946 posts
Posted (edited)

Just so you know...this topic has been discussed in great and alarming depth over many years, with the forces of reason trying to beat back the irrationality of the hucksters trying to redefine what a "first appearance" actually means, so they can sell you something, usually in the form of the pale imitation of preview material, which the comic community has rightfully rejected.

It hasn't worked yet, and hopefully, it never will.

You want to collect previews? Knock yourself out. Pay whatever you think they're worth, and whatever makes you happy. 

You want to attempt to redefine decades of accepted traditional understandings of "appearances"...? I suspect the Facebook and Instagram crowds might be more amenable.

Edited by RockMyAmadeus

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
365 posts

What makes you the expert ? Really I’m curious . I post cool info you’d shoot me down like some Spiderman police . Well cgc which this forum is recognizes the preview book marvel Age 12  . Black and Red was first design and first app of the costume ! That’s that  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
54,946 posts
25 minutes ago, Subby1938 said:

What makes you the expert ? Really I’m curious 

This:

38 minutes ago, RockMyAmadeus said:

this topic has been discussed in great and alarming depth over many years,

 

28 minutes ago, Subby1938 said:

I post cool info you’d shoot me down like some Spiderman police

Only when Sting was a member. After he went solo, they were never the same.

28 minutes ago, Subby1938 said:

Well cgc which this forum is recognizes the preview book marvel Age 12  

Sure. Why wouldn't they? Being a preview doesn't mean it doesn't exist. It simply means it's a preview of the actual thing (which is what actually matters.)

30 minutes ago, Subby1938 said:

Black and Red was first design and first app of the costume ! 

The first part of your statement is correct. The second part is not.

30 minutes ago, Subby1938 said:

That’s that  

Wait...what makes you the expert?

:popcorn:

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
52,230 posts
5 hours ago, Subby1938 said:

What makes you the expert ? Really I’m curious . I post cool info you’d shoot me down like some Spiderman police . Well cgc which this forum is recognizes the preview book marvel Age 12  . Black and Red was first design and first app of the costume ! That’s that  

CGC doesn't recognize Marvel Age as the first appearance. It says that it's concept art that predates ASM 252.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
52,230 posts
5 hours ago, RockMyAmadeus said:

The first appearance of the black costume is ASM #252. Anything prior to that is marketing previews and promotional material. Since comic books are a storytelling medium, the first appearance of *anything* only counts if it's in the context of the story, which has been the traditional understanding since comics fandom began, or Action Comics #12 would be the first appearance of Batman.

Correct. 
I understand why people want to collect preview stuff like this. They are fun and interesting but they aren't first appearances as defined by decades of comics fandom

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
365 posts

I just wanted to post information on books that predated ASM 252 and then was called a “ huckster “ like some guy trying to sell preview books I don’t own . I get warned by the mods about my posts which they said didn’t follow cgc guidelines . It’s a info thread and clearly it’s a click thing I’m not part of . 

 

Whats this all about? I stand by my comments 

 

Funny thing how that black and red suit exists today in many spider characters costume design . Marvel prob just didn’t want to pay for red inks bitd made it blank instead to save cash .  

875FD41D-1C52-4758-ACD4-4F0A3699AC64.jpeg

A47C05F9-0D22-41D4-BCC7-46BD9386798F.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8,873 posts
54 minutes ago, Subby1938 said:

I just wanted to post information on books that predated ASM 252 and then was called a “ huckster like some guy trying to sell preview books I don’t own . I get warned by the mods about my posts which they said didn’t follow cgc guidelines . It’s a info thread and clearly it’s a click thing I’m not part of

Nah, it’s just a bit of a sensitive issue, in that it’s been debated repeatedly on here.  There’ve been a couple of posters in the past who seemed bound and determined to redefine the way first appearances are collected.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
0