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Okajima pedigree
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1,554 posts in this topic

And the Action #71 CGC 2.0  from same seller went for $2052.  Strong prices. 

That Planet 27 worried me a bit, looks like Okajima was erased and rewritten.  Is there a master list of these things?  The one I have has a certificate that states they were sold in three lots to three different buyers (sadly mine is a post-camp copy).  Are these others coming with any certificates?  I'm wondering if we reach a point where someone just scribbles "Okajima" and some date code on the cover and sends it in.  At least when getting 8-10X guide.  I hate to voice this concern, but it has been in my mind and I'm really wanting to pull the trigger on a camp copy but getting a little worried at these prices.  

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2 hours ago, mwotka said:

And the Action #71 CGC 2.0  from same seller went for $2052.  Strong prices. 

That Planet 27 worried me a bit, looks like Okajima was erased and rewritten.  Is there a master list of these things?  The one I have has a certificate that states they were sold in three lots to three different buyers (sadly mine is a post-camp copy).  Are these others coming with any certificates?  I'm wondering if we reach a point where someone just scribbles "Okajima" and some date code on the cover and sends it in.  At least when getting 8-10X guide.  I hate to voice this concern, but it has been in my mind and I'm really wanting to pull the trigger on a camp copy but getting a little worried at these prices.  

I was the seller on all of these.  I bought a small group of them over the summer from a non-comic seller out of California who claimed that they had been in the family for decades (pre-dating the 1990's find - I was told that these were given to the seller's great aunt by an old man they did housekeeping for, who had purchased them back in the 50's -- I know that sounds crazy, but it's what I was told!).  The Planet you referenced actually had whiteout over top of the "Okajima" and I carefully scraped it off (I could see a tiny bit of the signature and knew what was likely under there; I posted a before/after pic of it on my instagram back before I sent it to CGC). 

Some of the books I bought in this batch didn't have any codes on them, so I'll end up keeping those, but I had a few with just "Okajima" (like the Detective last night & the Planet), some with "Okajima" and the date/"camp codes" (like the Action last night), and a handful of later books (post-camp) with either no markings or a date stamp that matched other Okajima copies that show up in the Heritage archives.  I actually thought that the Action would sell for more, given that it had name/date/code, but the lower grade clearly played a part (and the writing was more hidden in the dark title than on the Detective/Planet that sold for higher prices).

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Appreciate the info!  Interesting to hear there were more out there than what was sold when the estate was broken up.  Also why no certificates.  I had certainly noticed you have had a few recently, great to hear the story behind them.  Weird about the whiteout, but who knows why things happened decades ago.  I hope you have a few more left to sell.

I wonder if anyone has a master list of every known issue going...

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34 minutes ago, mwotka said:

Appreciate the info!  Interesting to hear there were more out there than what was sold when the estate was broken up.  Also why no certificates.  I had certainly noticed you have had a few recently, great to hear the story behind them.  Weird about the whiteout, but who knows why things happened decades ago.  I hope you have a few more left to sell.

I wonder if anyone has a master list of every known issue going...

I think I saw some sort of a list within this thread, but it could've been many pages back.  It would be cool to see the earliest coded book to see if it was "1A" or something to that effect.  It seemed like the older (1943) issues had the name but no "code", but I'm not sure if that is consistent across the collection or just what I happened to see. 

I have a few more at CGC right now, and I gave Heritage a couple of them.  The coolest one (in my opinion) is the Superman #26, since it's a WWII themed cover - that one (from Jan '44) has just the name but no codes.  Planet (Nov '43) was just name/no codes.  Detective 81 (Nov '43) was just name/no codes.  Action 71 (April '44) had date/name/code of "2K".  

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3 hours ago, Action252Kid said:

I was the seller on all of these.  I bought a small group of them over the summer from a non-comic seller out of California who claimed that they had been in the family for decades (pre-dating the 1990's find - I was told that these were given to the seller's great aunt by an old man they did housekeeping for, who had purchased them back in the 50's -- I know that sounds crazy, but it's what I was told!).  The Planet you referenced actually had whiteout over top of the "Okajima" and I carefully scraped it off (I could see a tiny bit of the signature and knew what was likely under there; I posted a before/after pic of it on my instagram back before I sent it to CGC). 

Some of the books I bought in this batch didn't have any codes on them, so I'll end up keeping those, but I had a few with just "Okajima" (like the Detective last night & the Planet), some with "Okajima" and the date/"camp codes" (like the Action last night), and a handful of later books (post-camp) with either no markings or a date stamp that matched other Okajima copies that show up in the Heritage archives.  I actually thought that the Action would sell for more, given that it had name/date/code, but the lower grade clearly played a part (and the writing was more hidden in the dark title than on the Detective/Planet that sold for higher prices).

Wow, thanks for sharing that.  It certainly adds a twist.

7E7w.gif

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1 hour ago, Action252Kid said:

I think I saw some sort of a list within this thread, but it could've been many pages back.  It would be cool to see the earliest coded book to see if it was "1A" or something to that effect.  It seemed like the older (1943) issues had the name but no "code", but I'm not sure if that is consistent across the collection or just what I happened to see. 

I have a few more at CGC right now, and I gave Heritage a couple of them.  The coolest one (in my opinion) is the Superman #26, since it's a WWII themed cover - that one (from Jan '44) has just the name but no codes.  Planet (Nov '43) was just name/no codes.  Detective 81 (Nov '43) was just name/no codes.  Action 71 (April '44) had date/name/code of "2K".  

The Action Comics #68  ""Okajima"" 11-16-43 1C would be the earliest (aka 1C) code that I have tracked.

Startling Comics #24 "Okajima" is the earliest I've tracked with the name "Okajima" (book issued 8/27/1943).  Only one book is known to me that is earlier, Red Dragon Comics #7 (leaving a full 5 month gap, issued 3/30/1943).

Thanks again for sharing.

 

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14 minutes ago, path4play said:

This is what I have compiled from this thread, GPA, online sales, collector sharing etc.,

Please feel free to edit, update and add.

Release Date Code Date   Grade Code Number Code Letter
3/30/1943   Red Dragon Comics #7 6.5    
8/10/1943   Planet Comics #27 "Okajima" 5.5    
8/27/1943   Startling Comics #24 "Okajima" "1P" 2.5    
9/1/1943   Captain Marvel Adventures #28 "Okajima"      
9/1/1943   Catman #21 "Okajima"      
9/14/1943   Sparkler #26 "Okajima"      
9/22/1943   Captain Midnight #13 "Okajima"      
9/24/1943   Detective Comics #81 "Okajima" 3.5    
9/26/1943   Marvel Mystery Comics #49 "Okajima" 3.5    
10/1/1943 11/19/1943 Catman #22 "Okajima 1D"   1 D
10/4/1943   Wings #40 "Okajima" 6.5    
10/8/1943   Master Comics #44 Okajima      
11/3/1943   Superman #26 "Okajima"      
11/5/1943   Sensation Comics #25 "Okajima"      
11/17/1943 11-16-1943 Action Comics #68 "Okajima" 11-16-43 1C   1 C
11/19/1943   Captain Midnight #15 Okajima 1E 6.5 1 E
12/26/1943 1/26/1944 Captain Marvel Adventures #31 ("1-26-43") "1H", "Okajima"   1 H
12/30/1943   Human Torch #14 (1-1-?) "1F" or "1J" or "1Y" (most likely)   1 J
1/1/1944 2/22/1944 Catman #23 "2-22-44 Okajima 2j"   2 J
1/14/1944 1/19/1944 Whiz Comics #51 (1-19-44) 1z   1 Z
1/26/1944 1/25/1944 Headline Comics #7 1-25-44 "2B"   2 B
2/8/1944 2/22/1944 Air Fighters Comics V2 #7 (2/22/44) "2j" 7 2 J
2/9/1944 2/12/1944 Master Comics 48 "2-12-44" "2H" 5 2 H
2/9/1944 2/19/1944 Sensation #28 "2-19-44 Okajima 2I"   2 I
2/15/1944 2/24/1944 Super Magician v2n12 (2-24-44) "2K"   2 K
2/16/1944 2/22/1944 Police Comics #29 (2/22/44) "2j"   2 J
2/18/1944 2/24/1944 Action Comics #71 (2-24-44) 2K 2 2 K
2/18/1944 2/22/1944 Crack Comics #33 (2/22/44) "2M"   2 M
2/25/1944   Adventure Comics #91 (2/?/44) 2?   2 N
2/25/1944 3/4/1944 Shadow Comics #v4#1 [37] 3/4/44 7 2 O
3/1/1944 3/11/1944 Black Terror #6 (3/11/44) "2q" 7.5 2 Q
3/6/44 3/18/44 Zip Comics 46 (3/18/44) "2R" 7.5 2 R
3/15/44 3/18/44 Police Comics #30 (3/18/44) "2R" 8.5 2 R
3/19/44 3/18/44 Marvel Mystery Comics #55 (3/18/44) "2R" 5.5 2 R
3/21/44 3/29/44 Super Magician v3#1 (3/29/44) "2T"   2 T
3/22/44 4/1/44 Boy Comics #16 (4/1/44) "2u" 7 2 U
4/1/1944 3/29/44 Captain Aero Comics #15 (V3 #13) (3/29/44) "2T" 7 2 T
4/4/44 4/29/44 Jungle Comics 54 (4/29/ 44) "3J" 8 3 J
4/5/44   Star Spangled Comics #33 7    
4/7/44 3/27/1944 Prize Comics #42 "3-27-44" "Okajima" "2"   2  
4/7/44 4/1/44 Sensation Comics #30 2W 7.5 2 W
4/7/44 4/8/44 Fighting Yank #8 (4/8/44) "2x" 8 2 X
4/11/44 4/15/44 Thrilling Comics #42 (4/15/44) "3A"   3 A
4/11/44 4/15/44 Thrilling Comics #42 3A   3 A
4/11/44 4/27/44 Wings #46 "Okajima" (4/27/44) 3?   3 I
4/12/44 4/11/44 Flash Comics #54 (4/11/44) "2xz" 9 2 Z
4/12/44 4/15/44 Human Torch #15 (4/15/44) "3A" 9 3 A
4/14/44 4/8/44 Police Comics #31 (4/8/44) "2x" 9.2 2 X
4/18/44 4/22/44 Captain America Comics 39 (4/20/44) "3D" 9 3 D
4/18/44 4/27/44 Super Magician v3n2 (4/27/44) "3?"   3 I
4/21/44 4/15/44 Captain Marvel Jr. 19 (4/15/44) "3A" 8.5 3 A
4/21/44 4/24/44 Tip Top #96 (4/22/44) "3F"   3 F
4/25/44 5/29/44 Fight Comics #33 (5/29/44) "3T" 8 3 T
4/26/44 4/23/44 Target V5#3 (4/23/44) 3G 5 3 G
4/26/44 4/25/44 Adventure Comics #92 (4/25/44) 3G   3 G
4/28/44   Captain Marvel Adventures #36 6    
4/28/44 5/6/44 Shadow Comics V4 #3 (5/6/44) "3m" 7.5 3 M
5/3/44 5/4/44 Superman #29 "Okajima ?"      
5/5/44 5/23/44 Startling Comics #28 (5/23/44) "3R" 8.5 3 R
5/10/44 4/25/44 Master Comics 51 (4/25/44) "3H"   3 H
5/10/44 5/9/44 All American Comics #59 3O 7.5 3 O
5/11/44 5/9/44 Captain America Comics 40 (5/9/44) "3o" 8.5 3 O
5/12/44 5/9/44 Police Comics #32 (5-?-44) "3N"   3 N
5/17/44   Wonder Woman #9 7.5    
5/18/44 5/24/44 Marvel Mystery Comics 57 (5/24/44) "3R" 8.5 3 R
5/19/44 5/24/44 Action #74 (5/24/44) "3S" 8 3 S
5/19/44 6/3/44 Rangers Comics #18 (6/3/44) "3w"   3 W
5/23/44 5/26/44 Big Shot #47 (5/25/44) 3S   3 S
5/24/44 5/16/44 Captain Marvel Jr. 20 (5/16/44) "3q" 9.2 3 Q
5/24/44 5/24/44 Captain Midnight #21(5/24/44) "3R" 8.5 3 R
5/26/44 5/29/44 More Fun Comics 98 (5/29/44) "3T"   3 T
5/31/44 5/30/44 Ace #88 (5-30-44) "3u"   3 U
6/7/44 5/30/44 Military Comics #31 (5/30/44) "3u" 9.2 3 U
6/7/44 6/15/44 Sensation Comics #32 (6-15-44) "3x"   3 X
6/9/44 5/30/44 Master Comics #52 (5/30/44)   3 U
6/9/44 6/15/44 Wow #27 (6-15-44) "3x"   3 X
6/11/44 6/23/44 Captain America Comics #41 (6/23/44) "3z" 7 3 Z
6/16/44 6/27/44 Whiz Comics #56 4A 8.5 4 A
6/21/44 6/15/44 Captain Marvel Jr. #21 (6/15/44) "3x"   3 X
6/21/44 6/23/44 Captain Midnight #22 3Z 8 3 Z
7/12/44 6/30/44 Target V5#4 (6/30/44) "4B"   4 B
7/21/44 8/9/44 Mystery Comics 2 (8/9/44) "4o" CAMP 3 8 4 O
8/15/44   Super-Magician Comics #v3#6 (#30) 8.5    
8/16/44   Police Comics #35 Okajima      
8/18/44   Wow Comics #29 6    
8/25/44 8/22/44 Whiz Comics #58 "4-22-44" "4T" "CAMP I" 8 4 T
8/25/44 9/2/1944 Shadow Comics v4#7 (9-2-44) "4V" Okajima 7.5 4 V
8/30/44 8/21/44 Captain Marvel Jr #23 (8-21-44) "4u"   4 U
9/6/44   Military Comics #34 (no date) "4xv" 7 4 X
9/6/44   Sensation #35 "Okajima 4y" 9 4 Y
9/13/44   Police Comics #36   4 X
10/3/44   Fighting Yank #10 7    
10/13/44 10/10/44 Police Comics #37 (Date Stamp)      
10/27/44 10/21/44 Mystery Comics #4 (Date Stamp) 8    
10/27/44 11/11/44 Shadow Comics #v4#9 [45] (Date Stamp) 8    
12/15/44 12/29/44 Police Comics #39 (Date Stamp)      
12/29/44 1/5/45 Superman #33 (Date Stamp)      
1/16/45 1/16/45 SuperMagicianV3#11 (Date Stamp) 8    
2/23/45 3/8/1945 Crime Does Not Pay #39 (Date Stamp) 6.5    
3/16/45 3/29/1945 Green Lantern #15 (Date Stamp) 9    

Wow, that is awesome!  Is there a picture online of the Red Dragon?  I have a few issues that fit right into portions of the titles that she was buying.  My Captain Marvel Adventures #30 ("Okajima" on cover, no date or code) would be after the Captain Marvel 28 ("Okajima" only), and just before the Captain Marvel 31 ("Okajima" plus date & code), so that would maybe help show the cutoff between just the name on the cover and when they had the name/date/code.

I have the Sensation Comics #34 as well, which came from the same source, but unfortunately it had no markings on it -- so I'm not sure yet if CGC will certify it as an Okajima.  It fits right in there (she had #30, 32, 35), and it had the same look as the other coded ones from the period, but I'd understand if it couldn't get the pedigree status (that's one I'd just keep if that happened, since I'm convinced it is one).  

 

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21 minutes ago, Action252Kid said:

Wow, that is awesome!  Is there a picture online of the Red Dragon?  I have a few issues that fit right into portions of the titles that she was buying.  My Captain Marvel Adventures #30 ("Okajima" on cover, no date or code) would be after the Captain Marvel 28 ("Okajima" only), and just before the Captain Marvel 31 ("Okajima" plus date & code), so that would maybe help show the cutoff between just the name on the cover and when they had the name/date/code.

I have the Sensation Comics #34 as well, which came from the same source, but unfortunately it had no markings on it -- so I'm not sure yet if CGC will certify it as an Okajima.  It fits right in there (she had #30, 32, 35), and it had the same look as the other coded ones from the period, but I'd understand if it couldn't get the pedigree status (that's one I'd just keep if that happened, since I'm convinced it is one).  

 

I believe the Red Dragon image is located somewhere on this thread.  It had no markings - I presume it was submitted with one of Alan Bahr's certificates. 

Your find is certainly helping to fill in a number of the very early missing gaps, pretty exciting.  What's bizarre is that prior owner's recollection of the collection acquisition falls outside the "Estate Sale" origin story.  Seems a bundle or two must have slipped out of that shed or were given away/sold somewhere earlier up the line.  Although there was that "3rd buyer" who I believe is still a mystery.  Is there any possibility somehow your guy's story just got mixed up and these originated from the 1995 sale?

Edited by path4play
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25 minutes ago, Action252Kid said:

Wow, that is awesome!  Is there a picture online of the Red Dragon?  I have a few issues that fit right into portions of the titles that she was buying.  My Captain Marvel Adventures #30 ("Okajima" on cover, no date or code) would be after the Captain Marvel 28 ("Okajima" only), and just before the Captain Marvel 31 ("Okajima" plus date & code), so that would maybe help show the cutoff between just the name on the cover and when they had the name/date/code.

I have the Sensation Comics #34 as well, which came from the same source, but unfortunately it had no markings on it -- so I'm not sure yet if CGC will certify it as an Okajima.  It fits right in there (she had #30, 32, 35), and it had the same look as the other coded ones from the period, but I'd understand if it couldn't get the pedigree status (that's one I'd just keep if that happened, since I'm convinced it is one).  

 

I don't own this, it's from my comicconnect watch list. One that got away

red4.35a-1.jpg

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16 minutes ago, path4play said:

I believe the Red Dragon image is located somewhere on this thread.  It had no markings - I presume it was submitted with one of Alan Bahr's certificates. 

Your find is certainly helping to fill in a number of the very early missing gaps, pretty exciting.  What's bizarre is that prior owner's recollection of the collection acquisition falls outside the "Estate Sale" origin story.  Seems a bundle or two must have slipped out of that shed or were given away/sold somewhere earlier up the line.  Although there was that "3rd buyer" who I believe is still a mystery.  Is there any possibility somehow your guy's story just got mixed up and these originated from the 1995 sale?

See that's what I'm thinking.  At first, I thought that I might've been buying these from the original family (the seller was located in the right general area), then I was told the story about them being given to a great aunt years ago, but I suspect these could've actually come from that estate sale.  Of course, if these were somehow tied to that mysterious 3rd buyer, you'd think that there are (or at least were) more of them, but I was told that this was everything.  

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9 hours ago, Action252Kid said:

See that's what I'm thinking.  At first, I thought that I might've been buying these from the original family (the seller was located in the right general area), then I was told the story about them being given to a great aunt years ago, but I suspect these could've actually come from that estate sale.  Of course, if these were somehow tied to that mysterious 3rd buyer, you'd think that there are (or at least were) more of them, but I was told that this was everything.  

Maybe after she stopped adding to her collection she gave some out to some kids for mowing the lawn or something, who can know.  Its interesting they are a spectrum of titles, and from a wide range of dates so there was no real discernible logic to the pulling. 

Edited by path4play
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11 hours ago, path4play said:

This is what I have compiled from this thread, GPA, online sales, collector sharing etc.,

Please feel free to edit, update and add

 

Do you have a list of post-camp books?   Or can you point me to one?

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All the info. lists etc is contained withing this thread, I am sure it was Miraclemet who used to update it as peeps posted their books and more info discovered.

I think it was ongoing and dependent where in the thread you look as to how up to date the list would be, its been a long time since I read through but its well worth the read. 

Edited by Kevin.J
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Hi.  Fascinating stuff.  Joining discussion late so trying to understand how to identify these pedigree books.  If a handwritten alphanumeric notation such as this one appears on the top left front cover of a 1943 comic book, does that indicate Okajima pedigree, despite "Okajima" not being written in cursive on front cover?   

804646696_WambiJungleBoy3-frontcropped.jpg.cbbf139eb1f85d66180738e7b2b38472.jpg

Or is it necessarily the case that ALL Okajima books were notated in one specific way depending on issue date of book, e.g., with at least "Okajima" on front cover before 1944 and with no "Okajima" but a date stamp and/or camp-specific alphanumeric info after that?   I ask because it seems possible that Ms. Okajima could have obtained a 1943 book from the same source in a subsequent year (say 1946?), because the back issue caught her eye, etc., when just the alphanumeric notation was being used.  

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