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THE AMAZING FANTASY #15 CLUB
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Started by HarveySwick,

14,480 posts in this topic

VintageComics

VintageComics

Posted
Posted
Just now, NoMan said:

How do they treat a 200k book different than a $2 book in grading?

Well, I'm not a grader so I can't answer that question but I'd assume that more expensive books get more eyes than a less expensive book.

I think you're asking because of the greater cost though, right?

I believe one of the reasons for the additional cost is to cover insurance, which can be quite expensive.

Insuring fragile items for an ever changing inventory is usually done by variable riders and coverage can be expensive.

That's not to say that they aren't charging for profit. Of course they are.

But if I had to guess, I'd say that the expensive books are being used to subsidize the cost of the cheaper tiers, which cost relatively next to nothing to grade compared to the expensive books.

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NoMan

NoMan

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, VintageComics said:

Well, I'm not a grader so I can't answer that question but I'd assume that more expensive books get more eyes than a less expensive book.

I think you're asking because of the greater cost though, right?

I believe one of the reasons for the additional cost is to cover insurance, which can be quite expensive.

Insuring fragile items for an ever changing inventory is usually done by variable riders and coverage can be expensive.

That's not to say that they aren't charging for profit. Of course they are.

But if I had to guess, I'd say that the expensive books are being used to subsidize the cost of the cheaper tiers, which cost relatively next to nothing to grade compared to the expensive books.

thanks

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bronze johnny

bronze johnny

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20 hours ago, peewee22 said:

There are collectors and flippers in cars, artwork, coins, stamps, to name a few. No exceptions here.

Don't forget baseball cards and what happened with a certain Honus Wagner card...

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidseideman/2016/09/22/a-heinous-crime-may-be-lifting-a-1-8-million-honus-wagner-card-now-up-for-auction/#26b6c10a7854

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Sweet Lou 14

Sweet Lou 14

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, bronze johnny said:

Don't forget baseball cards and what happened with a certain Honus Wagner card...

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidseideman/2016/09/22/a-heinous-crime-may-be-lifting-a-1-8-million-honus-wagner-card-now-up-for-auction/#26b6c10a7854

Great article, thanks.  The article seems to indicate that the value of the "Gretzky Wagner" card has actually benefited from its history, including not only the fact that Gretzky once owned it but even the trimming.  Are there any comics for which this kind of thing has happened?  By which I mean, the value of a specific copy was enhanced by something unusual, controversial, or even salacious about its ownership history?

Also, not really related as it's a completely different sort of story, but has anyone seen this article?  If this is true, we're talking about completely crapping out on a nearly half-billion dollar investment.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/05/26/louvre-intervenes-leonardo-da-vinci-row-author-claims-paris/

Edited by Sweet Lou 14
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bronze johnny

bronze johnny

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Posted
11 minutes ago, Sweet Lou 14 said:

Great article, thanks.  The article seems to indicate that the value of the "Gretzky Wagner" card has actually benefited from its history, including not only the fact that Gretzky once owned it but even the trimming.  Are there any comics for which this kind of thing has happened?  By which I mean, the value of a specific copy was enhanced by something unusual, controversial, or even salacious about its ownership history?

Also, not really related as it's a completely different sort of story, but has anyone seen this article?  If this is true, we're talking about completely crapping out on a nearly half-billion dollar investment.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/05/26/louvre-intervenes-leonardo-da-vinci-row-author-claims-paris/

Wow! Thanks for sharing! I was wondering what happened with this.

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peewee22

peewee22

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54 minutes ago, jjfversion1 said:

Here is my personal copy. My favorite comic in my collection (outside of my first print TMNT 1 of course)

 

B77B1874-AB5D-4026-BDD9-CC2E838D08E0.jpeg

Book presents very nicely, congrats!

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234wallst

234wallst

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On 5/27/2019 at 2:22 PM, bronze johnny said:

Don't forget baseball cards and what happened with a certain Honus Wagner card...

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidseideman/2016/09/22/a-heinous-crime-may-be-lifting-a-1-8-million-honus-wagner-card-now-up-for-auction/#26b6c10a7854

It's been known for some time that PSA cannot reliably detect trimmed cards 100% of the time.  Most all cards produced are cut from some sheet.  It's not impossible for someone to simulate that cut at a later date to the point it's not distinguishable.  But comparing card trimming would be analogous to PLOD-able alterations in CGC world.  

If you are anti-pressing, graded comics are not for you.  Every big book that eventually finds it's way to a big dealer will get pressed if there is any chance for upgrade.  Heck even CGC has their own pressing division.

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bronze johnny

bronze johnny

Posted
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, 234wallst said:

It's been known for some time that PSA cannot reliably detect trimmed cards 100% of the time.  Most all cards produced are cut from some sheet.  It's not impossible for someone to simulate that cut at a later date to the point it's not distinguishable.  But comparing card trimming would be analogous to PLOD-able alterations in CGC world.  

If you are anti-pressing, graded comics are not for you.  Every big book that eventually finds it's way to a big dealer will get pressed if there is any chance for upgrade.  Heck even CGC has their own pressing division.

It's actually microtrimming and the problem with detection is not exclusive to PSA, but also is of concern for Beckett, and SGC. Micro-trimming isn't exclusive to sportscards - I wouldn't trust any comic book grading company (including my favorite, CGC) catching microtrimming 100% of the time. That said, pressing has its place in the hobby.

The issue isn't always about pressing or anti-pressing. Some collectors have preferences for books that aren't pressed over those that are. Have a preference for something doesn't mean your'e anti-something else. So it's not always a zero-sum game.

The real issue has to do with whether pressing a book over and over again so that someone can squeeze every cent out of it benefits the book. Micro-trimmed cards, like micro-trimmed comics, are an example of what some will do to maximize profits. I posted the link for the article to share with boardies how fascinating this story is (and to consider that guys like Mastro sometimes get caught). Doubt he will be the last one. 

 

Edited by bronze johnny
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peewee22

peewee22

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, bronze johnny said:

It's actually microtrimming and the problem with detection is not exclusive to PSA, but also is of concern for Beckett, and SGC. Micro-trimming isn't exclusive to sportscards - I wouldn't trust any comic book grading company (including my favorite, CGC) catching microtrimming 100% of the time. That said, pressing has its place in the hobby.

The issue isn't always about pressing or anti-pressing. Some collectors have preferences for books that aren't pressed over those that are. Have a preference for something doesn't mean your'e anti-something else. So it's not always a zero-sum game.

The real issue has to do with whether pressing a book over and over again so that someone can squeeze every cent out of it benefits the book. Micro-trimmed cards, like micro-trimmed comics, are an example of what some will do to maximize profits. I posted the link for the article to share with boardies how fascinating this story is (and to consider that guys like Mastro sometimes get caught). Doubt he will be the last one. 

 

Am I mistaken or on the very early graded books, pressing was noted on the label?

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VintageComics

VintageComics

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Posted
38 minutes ago, bronze johnny said:
42 minutes ago, peewee22 said:

Am I mistaken or on the very early graded books, pressing was noted on the label?

If my memory serves me correctly, yes.

As far as I know, pressing is was only noted on early labels when it was done with a restoration job, of which pressing would have been a necessary part of the job (for example, after wet cleaning a book it would need to be pressed as a necessity).

It's just my educated guess that they stopped notating pressing because

a) it was redundant and

b) it caused confusion because people assumed that all books without the notation were unpressed

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peewee22

peewee22

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Posted (edited)
31 minutes ago, VintageComics said:

As far as I know, pressing is was only noted on early labels when it was done with a restoration job, of which pressing would have been a necessary part of the job (for example, after wet cleaning a book it would need to be pressed as a necessity).

It's just my educated guess that they stopped notating pressing because

a) it was redundant and

b) it caused confusion because people assumed that all books without the notation were unpressed

I agree. No way CGC could keep up with pressing as it gradually became a standard tool in the hobby. Interesting, I've heard HA would send collections sight unseen to be pressed. "Press em and then grade em."

Edited by peewee22
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