Comic Book Spine Realignment Therapy, turn your 8.5's into 9.2's!

[comeaux]

From what I can find on eBay, the search function and the Google:

 

Mark Wilson (eBay: dizneyart, pgcmint.com)

- dealer and restorer(?)

- is a board member (PGCMint) and stated that he has no involvement

 

I’m not accusing this seller of anything at all as I recently purchased this Captain America #107 from him via Ebay seller “dizneyart”

 

I’m putting together a run of Captain America #100 to #200 and trying to collect 9.4 to 9.8 (White Pages)

 

Although I have a substantial amount of books in this run and I went through them last night, the only one that I came across with this slightly anomalous wrap was the one I recently purchased from dizneyart.

 

 

As I stated I am in no way accusing him of doctoring this book but it does have a slight semblance of the other books being questioned.

I would be willing to send it to CGC for review if they think it’s something they want to look into.

 

[bababooey]

Nah, I don't want to burn anyone, I just like people to play by the rules, and for the rules to be ones that can work for the poor snooks, not just the wise guys...kind of like not being able to use stick-um in baseball.

Sorry that wasn't directed at you, you were just last post

- I can't google image, ms paint, ms ppt, photobucket AND keep up with the thread - choices must be made

[Bosco685]

From what I can find on eBay, the search function and the Google:

 

Mark Wilson (eBay: dizneyart, pgcmint.com)

- dealer and restorer(?)

- is a board member (PGCMint) and stated that he has no involvement

 

I’m not accusing this seller of anything at all as I recently purchased this Captain America #107 from him via Ebay seller “dizneyart”

 

I’m putting together a run of Captain America #100 to #200 and trying to collect 9.4 to 9.8 (White Pages)

 

Although I have a substantial amount of books in this run and I went through them last night, the only one that I came across with this slightly anomalous wrap was the one I recently purchased from dizneyart.

 

As I stated I am in no way accusing him of doctoring this book but it does have a slight semblance of the other books being questioned.

I would be willing to send it to CGC for review if they think it’s something they want to look into.

 

Way to go with regards to offering up your book!

 

 

I hope your book is not one of the victims. But that is quite the miswrap.

 

[thirdgreenham]

A poster pointed out my Matt Wilson post.

 

I was wrong in stating that the book I was shown had work done by Matt Wilson. Steve told me last night that the work on the book dealers were shown to determine what restoration was done was worked on by Mark Wilson. He stated that Mark no longer does work for anyone else. Again, the work done on the book I was shown was very very good.

 

While Mark has posted in this thread he hasn't answered the question of whether or not he has any personal/business relationship with this particular seller.

 

 

From what I can find on eBay, the search function and the Google:

 

Mark Wilson (eBay: dizneyart, pgcmint.com)

- dealer and restorer(?)

- is a board member (PGCMint) and stated that he has no involvement

 

Matt Wilson (fantasymasterpieces.com)

- restorer

- Mark's brother

 

Thomas Wilson (eBay: collectors_comics)

- dealer and restorer(?)

- relationship?

 

Jesse Wilson (eBay: wxproduction, wxproduction.com)

- dealer and restorer(?)

- Mark's or Matt's son

- likes to use tape: LINK1, LINK2

- currently has this book listed on eBay

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Avengers-1-CGC-7-0-STUNNING-Hulk-Iron-Man-Thor-Marvel-1963-KEY-/190809428113

 

 

 

The plot thickens sickens

 

Wow, how many of these Franken-books are there? Methinks CGC haseth a problem here

 

Wow.

[originalisbest]

Ah yes the part of every major thread where there is now countless pages of useless jargon.

 

Hopefully an AF 15 will surface tomorrow that was an 7.5 and is now an 9.4 to get this train wreck back to normal.

 

FACE JOB!

[MCMiles]

Restoring a book in any way may as well be mutilating it to some people. To some it is not .

Pressing a book properly may be mutilating a book to some, while to others it's completely benign.

I would imagine what's going on with these books is heavily frowned upon form bothe pro and anti-pressers . Probably much the same way folding the book in half would be.

 

Hopefully the anti-pressing crowd does not see this as an "I told you so" to the pro pressing crowd and draw out the same old arguments, which will not change a thing. But, I'm already seeing signs of that, unfortunately.

 

It will be much better to recognize the fact that bad press jobs should be down graded and CGC should be more consistent with grading period. Had this book been graded more accurately with those factors in mind, it would have never received an upgrade and there would be no incintive to mutilate the books in this way.

 

 

I like your post Mike and I agree with a lot of it, but there are other issues.

 

What always worried me about pressing was the non disclosure. I Had no problem with people who were upfront about it, if you have something in the open, then it's your book and there is of course nothing wrong with pressing it if you chose, but for those who did not disclose...well, there lies the problem. Don't disclose one thing, then you find people who try to manipulate the system by not disclosing something else. It just snowballs, like not posting "restored" when you sell a book, it's all meant to present something in the best possible light to potential buyers.

 

I actually don't find this pressing any more damaging than regular pressing. I find it less pretty, but I don't see the big difference. It's the loophole aspect I find troubling. That people are trying to get around CGC and find loopholes, not disclose what they are doing and game the system.

 

I feel the same way about tape. I have no problem with archival tape on a split or attaching a small piece, it DOES help preserve the book However, to have a system that encourages people to use something that will damage the paper (non-archival tape) so that they can GAME the system. ...that I mind very much.

 

If these things were noted...and yes, I know not everything can be detected, no one is perfect, but if they WERE noted when known..this would eliminate at least some of the gaming.

 

Look at all the books being pressed right now, it's incredible. I know people thought I was joking about Virgin books yesterday, but one day, they will be at a premium, because they ARE going to be scarce.

 

I never quite got why, if someone doesn't think pressing IS restoration, they would care if it's noted on the label. Here is a perfect opportunity, CGC owns a pressing company. NOTE the work done on the label. Maybe some people will want those books even more :shrug:

 

I know what you are saying and I know you know these boards has been round and round about most, if not all of that a bazillion times already. I personally don't care to see it go back through all of that because after x amount of years a lot of that has already worked itself out to an extent, and different people have adjusted their buying or collecting needs and habits to deal with it.

 

Proper pressing will always be debatable, and as we have seen, it's pretty heavily accepted. This current re-alignment deal is very visual and like tape, there is a fairly unanimous dislike toward it. Like pressing and tape, it is a loophole that could be exploited in the name of the "game". I don't disagree with that. I'd like to see both tape and re-alignment be a negative with CGC.

 

CGC will never be able to detect proper pressing, and who's to say if it's virgin or not if it can't be detected. I'm sure there are already people using "Original Owner" to give the impression the books are "virgin". It's just another extension of the game. I'm sure people talented enough to press a book into near perfect condition are certainly talented enough to put a little dent in and then call it virgin. And what of true "virgin" books that are perfect. Do we assume they are pressed. Too perfect to be virgin? Will a 9.4 virgin be more desirable because the 9.8 virgin is so perfect that she may be enhanced but we don't know for sure?

 

At least with standards that can be measured by CGC the gaming has to stay within certain parameters that help people make good buying decisions.

 

There really are no definitive answers, and opinions will vary, but when opinions are overwhelmingly similar, such as with tape and re-alignment, hopefully some standards can come from it.

 

Both sides of the pressing debate seem to be turned-off by this new form of manipulation. Hopefully instead of it becoming a reason to re-hash old arguments that we know go to no where over and over, all voices can come together to make sure it is addressed.

 

 

[MCMiles]

David Merryweather should be banned from the thread for stretching the screen.

[Bosco685]

Both sides of the pressing debate seem to be turned-off by this new form of manipulation. Hopefully instead of it becoming a reason to re-hash old arguments that we know go to no where over and over, all voices can come together to make sure it is addressed.

 

 

Odd thing is I've detected no "I hate all you pressers" in this entire thread other than a joke here or there. So why take it there?

[etanick]

The lower grade slab of that Lois lane is in heritage database

 

Apparently it was a 5,5 that sold on May 6, 2011

 

After looking at the before scan, it does not look that egregious

 

ie: From the 5.5 it doesn't look like the spine was shifted

 

yes, there is a shifted...whether it is a natural process of a regular press of a spine shift, only the person that sub that 5.5 book know.

 

the 5.5 has less of a fanning as well as not even fanning top to bottom. Take a look at the top left corner..the higher grade book shifted just enough to lessen the rub on top as well as the rub on the bottom spine.

[comix4fun]

From what I can find on eBay, the search function and the Google:

 

Mark Wilson (eBay: dizneyart, pgcmint.com)

- dealer and restorer(?)

- is a board member (PGCMint) and stated that he has no involvement

 

I’m not accusing this seller of anything at all as I recently purchased this Captain America #107 from him via Ebay seller “dizneyart”

 

I’m putting together a run of Captain America #100 to #200 and trying to collect 9.4 to 9.8 (White Pages)

 

Although I have a substantial amount of books in this run and I went through them last night, the only one that I came across with this slightly anomalous wrap was the one I recently purchased from dizneyart.

 

As I stated I am in no way accusing him of doctoring this book but it does have a slight semblance of the other books being questioned.

I would be willing to send it to CGC for review if they think it’s something they want to look into.

 

Way to go with regards to offering up your book!

 

 

I hope your book is not one of the victims. But that is quite the miswrap.

 

 

 

Given the size of the mis-wrap and the lack of corresponding reverse roll I don't know if this one fits the profile.

[comix4fun]

David Merryweather should be banned from the thread for stretching the screen.

 

 

And for repeating Bababooey's joke.

[faster friends]

Dirty rub shifters

[comicwiz]

From what I can find on eBay, the search function and the Google:

 

Mark Wilson (eBay: dizneyart, pgcmint.com)

- dealer and restorer(?)

- is a board member (PGCMint) and stated that he has no involvement

 

I’m not accusing this seller of anything at all as I recently purchased this Captain America #107 from him via Ebay seller “dizneyart”

 

I’m putting together a run of Captain America #100 to #200 and trying to collect 9.4 to 9.8 (White Pages)

 

Although I have a substantial amount of books in this run and I went through them last night, the only one that I came across with this slightly anomalous wrap was the one I recently purchased from dizneyart.

 

As I stated I am in no way accusing him of doctoring this book but it does have a slight semblance of the other books being questioned.

I would be willing to send it to CGC for review if they think it’s something they want to look into.

 

Way to go with regards to offering up your book!

 

 

I hope your book is not one of the victims. But that is quite the miswrap.

 

 

 

Given the size of the mis-wrap and the lack of corresponding reverse roll I don't know if this one fits the profile.

 

+1

 

No face job. need scanz. money

[skypinkblu]

Restoring a book in any way may as well be mutilating it to some people. To some it is not .

Pressing a book properly may be mutilating a book to some, while to others it's completely benign.

I would imagine what's going on with these books is heavily frowned upon form bothe pro and anti-pressers . Probably much the same way folding the book in half would be.

 

Hopefully the anti-pressing crowd does not see this as an "I told you so" to the pro pressing crowd and draw out the same old arguments, which will not change a thing. But, I'm already seeing signs of that, unfortunately.

 

It will be much better to recognize the fact that bad press jobs should be down graded and CGC should be more consistent with grading period. Had this book been graded more accurately with those factors in mind, it would have never received an upgrade and there would be no incintive to mutilate the books in this way.

 

 

I like your post Mike and I agree with a lot of it, but there are other issues.

 

What always worried me about pressing was the non disclosure. I Had no problem with people who were upfront about it, if you have something in the open, then it's your book and there is of course nothing wrong with pressing it if you chose, but for those who did not disclose...well, there lies the problem. Don't disclose one thing, then you find people who try to manipulate the system by not disclosing something else. It just snowballs, like not posting "restored" when you sell a book, it's all meant to present something in the best possible light to potential buyers.

 

I actually don't find this pressing any more damaging than regular pressing. I find it less pretty, but I don't see the big difference. It's the loophole aspect I find troubling. That people are trying to get around CGC and find loopholes, not disclose what they are doing and game the system.

 

I feel the same way about tape. I have no problem with archival tape on a split or attaching a small piece, it DOES help preserve the book However, to have a system that encourages people to use something that will damage the paper (non-archival tape) so that they can GAME the system. ...that I mind very much.

 

If these things were noted...and yes, I know not everything can be detected, no one is perfect, but if they WERE noted when known..this would eliminate at least some of the gaming.

 

Look at all the books being pressed right now, it's incredible. I know people thought I was joking about Virgin books yesterday, but one day, they will be at a premium, because they ARE going to be scarce.

 

I never quite got why, if someone doesn't think pressing IS restoration, they would care if it's noted on the label. Here is a perfect opportunity, CGC owns a pressing company. NOTE the work done on the label. Maybe some people will want those books even more :shrug:

 

I know what you are saying and I know you know these boards has been round and round about most, if not all of that a bazillion times already. I personally don't care to see it go back through all of that because after x amount of years a lot of that has already worked itself out to an extent, and different people have adjusted their buying or collecting needs and habits to deal with it.

 

Proper pressing will always be debatable, and as we have seen, it's pretty heavily accepted. This current re-alignment deal is very visual and like tape, there is a fairly unanimous dislike toward it. Like pressing and tape, it is a loophole that could be exploited in the name of the "game". I don't disagree with that. I'd like to see both tape and re-alignment be a negative with CGC.

 

CGC will never be able to detect proper pressing, and who's to say if it's virgin or not if it can't be detected. I'm sure there are already people using "Original Owner" to give the impression the books are "virgin". It's just another extension of the game. I'm sure people talented enough to press a book into near perfect condition are certainly talented enough to put a little dent in and then call it virgin. And what of true "virgin" books that are perfect. Do we assume they are pressed. Too perfect to be virgin? Will a 9.4 virgin be more desirable because the 9.8 virgin is so perfect that she may be enhanced but we don't know for sure?

 

At least with standards that can be measured by CGC the gaming has to stay within certain parameters that help people make good buying decisions.

 

There really are no definitive answers, and opinions will vary, but when opinions are overwhelmingly similar, such as with tape and re-alignment, hopefully some standards can come from it.

 

Both sides of the pressing debate seem to be turned-off by this new form of manipulation. Hopefully instead of it becoming a reason to re-hash old arguments that we know go to no where over and over, all voices can come together to make sure it is addressed.

 

 

Lot of valid points, Mike...I guess my mind is not devious enough to have thought of fake virgin comics...(not calling you devious;) but that is absolutely what would happen, you are right.

 

Unfortunately regarding pressing, the horse has left the barn. As I read this thread,I realize I'm probably one of the 12 people left who doesn't want to learn to press my own books;) Always did hate ironing;)

 

In the learn something EVERY day department, I did learn about people using nail clippers on books, today...I did not know that.

[Cat-Man_America]

David Merryweather should be banned from the thread for stretching the screen.

 

 

And for repeating Bababooey's joke.

 

[font:Times New Roman]I just pressed the visual and manipulated it to the side slightly. [/font]

[Bosco685]

In the learn something EVERY day department, I did learn about people using nail clippers on books, today...I did not know that.

 

Sorry for that education. But I've happened across this a couple of times, and was bummed out it was happening.

[comix4fun]

David Merryweather should be banned from the thread for stretching the screen.

 

 

And for repeating Bababooey's joke.

 

[font:Times New Roman]I just pressed the visual and manipulated it to the side slightly. [/font]

 

 

It's DULUTED!!!!!

[skypinkblu]

In the learn something EVERY day department, I did learn about people using nail clippers on books, today...I did not know that.

 

Sorry for that education. But I've happened across this a couple of times, and was bummed out it was happening.

 

Nope, it's GOOD to know...I don't think I'll ever worry about it, since I'm not looking at books in "grade" but it's good to know I can recycle my nail clippers at comic book shows:)

[seanfingh]

From what I can find on eBay, the search function and the Google:

 

Mark Wilson (eBay: dizneyart, pgcmint.com)

- dealer and restorer(?)

- is a board member (PGCMint) and stated that he has no involvement

 

I’m not accusing this seller of anything at all as I recently purchased this Captain America #107 from him via Ebay seller “dizneyart”

 

I’m putting together a run of Captain America #100 to #200 and trying to collect 9.4 to 9.8 (White Pages)

 

Although I have a substantial amount of books in this run and I went through them last night, the only one that I came across with this slightly anomalous wrap was the one I recently purchased from dizneyart.

 

As I stated I am in no way accusing him of doctoring this book but it does have a slight semblance of the other books being questioned.

I would be willing to send it to CGC for review if they think it’s something they want to look into.

 

Way to go with regards to offering up your book!

 

 

I hope your book is not one of the victims. But that is quite the miswrap.

 

 

 

Given the size of the mis-wrap and the lack of corresponding reverse roll I don't know if this one fits the profile.

 

Not every Marvel 2 cent variant is a face job, obviously. The fanned pages is far more of a tell than the front to back miswrap. We all have tons of 2 cent variants from 1966-1968

[DiceX]

This manipulation needs to have a name so we can discuss it properly...

From henceforth, I christen thee... "Ratcheting"

Named so due to the movement of the cover around the spine, and to the fact that anyone who does this is a complete tool.

 

In it's honor, I offer a meme...