Census results for DC

[clarkkentdds]

I was wondering why there are twice as many Marvel Silver Age books graded by CGC as DC.....

 

1. Were there fewer DCs printed?

2. Are there as many DCs that just haven't been sent into CGC yet?

3. Did fewer DCs "survive"?

4. Are Marvels just more trendy now and just as many DCs exist?

 

It just seems like high grade DC material is not as common as the 9.6 Marvel stuff. Any opinion would be great!

[blowout]

......marvel's sell for much more on ebay, therefore more dealers slab them............

 

......the demand for dc just doesn't seem to be there............

[Bonds25]

I don't buy that argument. There are a lot of DC issues in high demand - Batman, Action, Adventure, Superman, etc. - especially those with nice covers by Neal Adams, Marshall Rogers, Jim Aparo, etc.. I also think they're undervalued, so a lot of people aren't going to spend $20 to grade them when they only book for $20. And yes, I also think they're much more rare than their Marvel counterparts.

[blowout]

....i agree that silver dc's are probably rarer than marvels, but i still think that a lot of the slabbing that's going on is dealers trying to make money................and the profit margin just isn't there for dc's at the moment.................

[comicinvestor-migration]

I agree totally, Marvels are where the real speculation is going on, therefore they're going to be the ones slabbed first to get the highest return on your slab investment.

 

It's the old continuity thing hard at work.

[drbanner]

Silver and Bronze age DC's are definitely scarcer than Marvels (the opposite holds true for Golden Age). At just about every store I go into, and every show I attend, there are way more Marvels.

 

Also, there seem to be far fewer "key" DC Silver and Bronze age books, so both the overall population is smaller, and the number of key issues (which are prime candidates for slabbing) is smaller. When I've put up high grade, key DC books, they've gone for a ton (Adventure 431 9.8 20x guide, Phantom Stranger 1 9.6 7x guide).

 

Interestingly, the buyers for my last batch of nice CGC'ed DC's on ebay included Mark Wilson and Stephen Fishler. I sold Fishler a 9.8 Strange Adventures 208 for $400 in May, his recent market report has it listed as selling for $750, and now here it is in the Heritage auction! We'll see where it ends up...

[g-man]

i agree....it is not very often see books like JLA or Brave & Bold keys in high grade. Same goes for Detective. When was the last time u saw Det 359 or 400 in 9.4? Never see them at shows either...Jsut saw Bats 232 go for $750 in 9.6. Roughly 6x guide. Not bad.

I love Marvels but some of the DCs have great covers like Flash 175 or B&B #85.

[greggy]

Yeah unfortunately, DCs don't really seem to do well unless it is:

 

1) Very high grade and/or

2) "Key" issue

 

I would get a lot more of my DCs slabbed and up for sale if the prices realized were more acceptable to me. I have only sold CGC DCs once on eBay and the best price that I obtained was $510 for a CGC 9.2 Superman 199.

 

However, you see common numbered Marvel issues going for crazy prices. I just can't seem to figure it out.

 

Yes, Mark Wilson is one of the few dealers that I see buying CGC DCs on a regular basis. That's all I saw him buying down in San Diego. He even bought a bunch from Motor City so he feels that they would be worth it in the long run.

 

But...as my Marvel stash is getting really thin, you may see more DCs in the future!

[hogations]

1. Were there fewer DCs printed?

 

In the 60s, the major DC titles actually had higher print runs that Marvels - especially during the period where the Batman TV show was popular. However, people just took better care of their Marvels. I bet if you took a population snap-shot of the readers back then, you'd probably find the DC crowd to be younger. Marvel books definitely appealed more to the older crowd.

 

3. Did fewer DCs "survive"?

 

In high grade, definitely.

 

4. Are Marvels just more trendy now and just as many DCs exist?

 

As other people mentioned in this thread, Marvels are (and mostly likely always will be) more popular than DCs. In terms of supply, I'm sure everyone would agree that the number of high grade DCs are far lower than Marvels, but the demand is not as strong.

[aardvark88]

Cgc is specifically geared for those w/ a vfnm fetish. Thanks to Robt Bell, there were warehouse quantities (sealed bundles) of hi-grade silver Marvel back issues for the mktplace. Maybe only the Boston pedigree had a few multiple copies of silver DCs in hi-grade. More Marvel zombies so more silver & bronze Marvels sent to cgc today.

[blowout]

"Thanks to Robt Bell, there were warehouse quantities (sealed bundles) of hi-grade silver Marvel back issues for the mktplace...."

 

.....does anyone think that there are yet to be found hoards of high grade dc silver?

.....if the print runs were higher than marvel then surely there is more high grade out there.............

[PovertyRow]

IMHO - Marvel is more "collectible" (aka "profitable") and from the get go Marvel CGC's in high grade sold well;. So the speculators/investors were the ones with the most disposable property to send to CGC. I think the main DC Collectors are more collector than speculator/investor. They buy DC for love more than profit.

[Darthdiesel]

So the speculators/investors were the ones with the most disposable property to send to CGC. I think the main DC Collectors are more collector than speculator/investor. They buy DC for love more than profit.

 

This underlying whole comic purist, collector first holier-than-thou attitude in your post is ridiculous (to quote CI: "is reprehensible to me") and sets me off everytime I see it. Poverty, you are not the first, nor will be the last to spout this nonsense and spin it such that collectors are pure only if they don't sell their books, and all dealers (even honest ones that provide a service) should be taken out and lynched.

How many people bought 25 copies of that Death Of Superman issue while I did not? Tell me those were DC collectors in for the love of the hobby anstead of profit..

 

I collect Cherry Poptart comics for love and not profit...does that make me a better human being?

 

JUST PLAIN RUBBISH!size>

[aardvark88]

Don't think there r any more hordes of silver DC to be found. The last big haul I heard about was by Bulldog? Collectibles around 1992. There were 2 barns full of hi-grade runs of late 50s-60s DCs, Charlton, Harveys & Marvels . 1 of the 2 barns was burned down but they found the remnants of early Showcase in the aftermath. Think they paid around 10 cents a book for the remaining barn-stock & brought the unbagged goods to San Diego Con. There was a feeding frenzy at their booth during Wed. dealer set up & 1st day of reg. sales Thurs. Sparkle City (J Verenault & partner) were buying long boxes of hi-grade at a time. That was the most fun I ever had at San Diego crawling around digging thru EVERY long box on the floor. Very few of the bks were pre-bagged or pre-priced.

[comicinvestor-migration]

Now them were the days, eh?

 

Now, those would all go of to CGC and form the crux of a new Heritage auction catering to investors with more money than brains.

[PovertyRow]

I collect Cherry Poptart comics for love and not profit...does that make me a better human being?

 

I don't believe I was making a qualitative statement. If the phrase "for the love" implies that, then change it to "for the collecting".

[aardvark88]

If it weren't for the new influx of investor/coin collector cash flowing into the hi-end of the hobby, we'd have no 1 buying at the top end since Nic Cage, Russ Cochran & Stv Geppi r cashing out chunks of their paper collectible holdings: cgc comics, pedigrees, movie posters, BLBs, orig comic & strip art.

[AlphaOmega]

I was wondering why there are twice as many Marvel Silver Age books graded by CGC as DC.....

 

Being a collector of mainly Silver Age DC's, I can tell you my experiences. I've been aggressively searching for SA DC in VF or better condition for the past ten years and have completed about 3/4 of my collection during that time. I've been to dozens of shows during that time and have scoured CBG, eBay, Yahoo Auctions, classified ads, Usenet, along with numerous mail order dealers in my quest

 

1. Were there fewer DCs printed?

 

From what I've seen and heard, more DC's were printed from 1957 to around 1964. The popularity of Marvel comics and their print runs appears to surpass nearly every DC title from the early/mid sixties on with maybe the exception of Superman/Batman. I've seen equal amount of both Marvel and DC at most conventions though.

 

2. Are there as many DCs that just haven't been sent into CGC yet?

3. Did fewer DCs "survive"?

 

I think both of these questions go together. That is, there aren't as many CGC DC books because not as many survived.

 

4. Are Marvels just more trendy now and just as many DCs exist?

 

I think that Silver Age Marvels have been and are more popular. Because of this, there were more collections that survived than their DC counterparts. I would qualify this as the main reason why we see many more CGC Marvels than DCs. The continuing popularity of Marvels drives the CGC submission rate and feeds upon the numerous issues that survived from the 60's.

 

It just seems like high grade DC material is not as common as the 9.6 Marvel stuff. Any opinion would be great!

 

For some reason, I find this true also. Both Marvel and DC had their problems with paper quality in the early 60's (DC's have very weak spines and Marvel had chipping). Still, I'd say that I've personnally seen high grade copies (8.5 and above) of every Marvel book printed from 1961 and beyond. On the other hand, there are dozens upon dozens of DC's that I've never seen in any grade above Fine or so (Action 247 comes to mind). There are many Silver Age DC's out there, but the majority of them are hammered!

 

As an aside, I've sold some high grade CGC DC books from time to time and when I have, it's the big boys that have paid the crazy prices: Steve Geppi, Robert Roter, Joe Serpico, etc.

[Joanna]

If I could just afford it, I've found several great early DC's that I love to get CGC'd, including a JLA 31 with a black cover that has no spine ticks and looks pretty minty to me. But the guide has prices that just aren't all that exciting, and it would have to grade at NM or above to be worth it. I just don't know if it is really is NM (one reason I keep asking questions about the difference between all the increments of 9) and having just found out how much shipping costs, plus the price of submission and the several months worth of wait time... I just don't know. I've found about half a dozen early Silver Age books in my collection so far that look pretty near perfect. Some day, when I have the extra money, I'm going to send them in.

 

The point of this is that I think it's not just the condition but the lower guide prices that also discourage DC grading.

 

-- Joanna

[murph0]

I'd agree that the low numbers are due to DC not being hot. As we have seen, a lot of people CGC in order to sell...well if you can get the same price for the DC book with or without CGC'ing the DC book..is there really any point in sending it in to be graded, spending at least 50 dollars, and waiting at least a week just so you can get the same results? IMO, most people with DC are sitting on them thus creating an artifically low supply and who knows when it'll pick up..if ever..

 

Brian