Bosco685 Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 Im surprised no one mentions this book The success of ElfQuest inspired alot of independent creators in the 80s. It was released in the same month as Cerebus #1. I think I read somewhere that there were 10,000 copies printed which may explain why its not as scarce as Cerebus. But still a key copper player made in the Bronze. I will also include Visions fanzine in that list and lets not forget Warrior/Quality pub Great callout. I have two 9.8's of that one. Always a favorite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gatsby77 Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 Interesting thoughts on GI Joe & Transformers. I don't see Transformers declining in importance, though. The premise is that much of today's back issue market surrounds first appearances tied to forthcoming movie appearances. That certainly is driving speculative demand for books like Warlock, Black Adam & even Suicide Squad (and esp., Star Wars books). So why wouldn't it also drive medium to long-term demand for Transformers 1, which is confirmed to have three more movies in the pipeline, with each of those likely to do $1 billion plus in box office? Put another way, Suicide may be a huge blockbuster and spawn a sequel or two. Transformers already has, with 4 movies that each individually grossed over $700 million. One's an unknown, the other's a sure bet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastballspecial Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 Really wish some of my local shop in the 80s would have carried some of the Indy books. Maybe I would have more respect for them. I just look at them and wonder what the big deal is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 Really wish some of my local shop in the 80s would have carried some of the Indy books. Maybe I would have more respect for them. I just look at them and wonder what the big deal is. I can see where with the plethora of independents that hit the market throughout 1984-1990, there were many that probably shouldn't have seen print. But then again, everyone has to start somewhere. So these early indies helped cut their teeth with material that were not handled by seasoned hands yet. Where you can't go wrong is digging into some of the anthologies from that period, such as Dark Horse Presents. Each comic contains three to four stories from different creative teams. So you get a taste of various stories, and hopefully a few meet your reading palate. You can always count on Concrete, Crow (at least the first story arc), Grimjack, Nexus, Rocketeer, and Xenozoic Tales. And there are many, many more that work even today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aweandlorder Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 Really wish some of my local shop in the 80s would have carried some of the Indy books. Maybe I would have more respect for them. I just look at them and wonder what the big deal is. You dont need to have respect for books you havent read. You do however need to acknowledge their significance in our medium, if only for the role they played in strengthening creative control with independent creators going forward Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy_McShillihan Posted November 8, 2015 Share Posted November 8, 2015 (edited) Really wish some of my local shop in the 80s would have carried some of the Indy books. Maybe I would have more respect for them. I just look at them and wonder what the big deal is. You dont need to have respect for books you havent read. You do however need to acknowledge their significance in our medium, if only for the role they played in strengthening creative control with independent creators going forward That sig is bad Edited November 8, 2015 by Paddy_McShillihan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AGGIEZ Posted November 8, 2015 Share Posted November 8, 2015 My own sense is that DCCP #26 and New Teen Titans #1 are very "copper-y", and that the whole "copperization" process was not like a lightswitch going off overnight, but in last year's discussion we wanted some firmer timelines. Agree with this. She-Hulk #1 (2/80) and DC Presents 26 (10/80) definitely feel like Copper Age books. I lean towards the CA running from 1980 - 1992 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RockMyAmadeus Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 DC Presents #26 (the insert, that is, not the main story) is probably the first real glimmer of the Copper Age. Fantasy Quarterly #1, a 1978 book, is solidly Bronze. But there are lots of "Bronze-ish" books being published, well into the 80's...Miller's Daredevil, for example, is cited as being "Copper" by many...but it's not. It's more the culmination of the Bronze age shift towards realism. Ronin, though? Absolutely Copper. Likewise, Dark Phoenix is the pinnacle of the Bronze Age form of storytelling. while Days of Future Past is most certainly Copper...in the same title, by the same creators. We've had these discussions many, many times on the boards, and will probably have them forever. There's no clear delineation for any "age", except for Action Comics #1. Everything else is qualified. jimjum12 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimjum12 Posted November 10, 2015 Share Posted November 10, 2015 DC Presents #26 (the insert, that is, not the main story) is probably the first real glimmer of the Copper Age. Fantasy Quarterly #1, a 1978 book, is solidly Bronze. But there are lots of "Bronze-ish" books being published, well into the 80's...Miller's Daredevil, for example, is cited as being "Copper" by many...but it's not. It's more the culmination of the Bronze age shift towards realism. Ronin, though? Absolutely Copper. Likewise, Dark Phoenix is the pinnacle of the Bronze Age form of storytelling. while Days of Future Past is most certainly Copper...in the same title, by the same creators. We've had these discussions many, many times on the boards, and will probably have them forever. There's no clear delineation for any "age", except for Action Comics #1. Everything else is qualified. ..... I agree with all of this except the Miller Daredevil assertion..... although I understand your position fully. I've always felt that once Miller really got his feet underneath him, It was his efforts that made the Copper Age what it was..... he was possibly the father of it..... the way it impacted me, anyway. I was in a position at the time (1980) where I was no longer a comic fan, due to my disdain for most of the thematic elements that fueled the Bronze Age.... I felt the material had become too gratuitous and I had totally lost my interest in the medium. It seemed forced and preachy, driven by an ultra liberal message that lost sight of the entertainment value.... the forays into the fantastic. It was the work of Miller, Byrne, and JRJR that caught my eye on the 7-11 spinner racks and coaxed me back into the fold...... and I apologize for leaving out several of the fine writers who were equally as responsible for returning the balance to the art form. For me, Miller was kind of "the seed, that in the spring, becomes the rose"...... he figured out how to return the Yin to the Yang, without compromising the maturation that the industry was so desperately grasping for. GOD BLESS.... -jimbo(a friend of jesus) ..... I'd say 1979-1981 was a period of crystallization..... a cusp as it were..... when things were both Bronze and Copper..... which is why clearcut demarcation is unlikely to ever reach consensus. That being said..... I am becoming enamored with the phrase "Chromium Age" for 90's books..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastballspecial Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 Really wish some of my local shop in the 80s would have carried some of the Indy books. Maybe I would have more respect for them. I just look at them and wonder what the big deal is. You dont need to have respect for books you havent read. You do however need to acknowledge their significance in our medium, if only for the role they played in strengthening creative control with independent creators going forward I didn't say I didn't read them. I just wasn't exposed at a younger age to them. It might have given me a better appreciation for them.(Probably a better word then respect I used earlier.) I read a lot of them when I was older and just thought. Eh That doesn't mean I don't understand there significance in the medium. It just means I am not going out in my adult "buying years" to pay big money to search them out. Tomatoe/Tomato I have more an infinity for old Charlton's as well from the 70s Yang, Peacemaker and such as well as the reprints. Not valuable and not really desired, but brings back fond memories as child when my parents bought them for me to read when they couldn't afford much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 The New Teen Titans launch definitely had a difference in direction for a comic title that made it clear times were a'changing. Taking a Silver Age team of sidekicks and taking them down a darker path with Deathstroke the Terminator, Trigon (created by humans that escaped Earth so as to form a cult focused on the beauty of life, and the darkness of their souls pushed out leading to this character's creation), and even the deceit of Terra making her way onto the team only to betray them later. I was buying only those titles I found extremely entertaining at the time. The New Teen Titans by Wolfman and Perez was always high on my pull list. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimjum12 Posted November 11, 2015 Share Posted November 11, 2015 The New Teen Titans launch definitely had a difference in direction for a comic title that made it clear times were a'changing. Taking a Silver Age team of sidekicks and taking them down a darker path with Deathstroke the Terminator, Trigon (created by humans that escaped Earth so as to form a cult focused on the beauty of life, and the darkness of their souls pushed out leading to this character's creation), and even the deceit of Terra making her way onto the team only to betray them later. I was buying only those titles I found extremely entertaining at the time. The New Teen Titans by Wolfman and Perez was always high on my pull list. Teen Titans is a prime example....... for me, The CA is epitomized by rebirth, the re-vamping of "dead" titles by top notch hired guns who contributed substantial runs that raised the bar for the entire industry. That, coupled with the relatively uncensored explosion of the B&W Indy segment made for quite the evolution. The Miller DD's probably generate the debate they do because they are basically two separate units...... Miller art and Miller story AND art. The super star writer/artist individuals really came into play here and is probably one of the things I loved most about the CA.... GOD BLESS... -jimbo(a friend of jesus) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Smooth Posted December 25, 2015 Share Posted December 25, 2015 ??️ (Overstreet) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastballspecial Posted December 25, 2015 Share Posted December 25, 2015 NTT was the only DC book I was reading as a teenager. My brother and I would read X-men and TT. Everything else to us at the time was lame. We would later pick up Avengers, JLA, Defenders and a few others, but lets be clear for early Teen buyers those two above books were it in the 80s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flash105 Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 To me George Perez and Frank Miller are the definition of Copper. Neal Adams and John Bryne are Bronze age dudes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisco37 Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 To me George Perez and Frank Miller are the definition of Copper. Neal Adams and John Bryne are Bronze age dudes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gatsby77 Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 We can continue to rehash the year Copper Age begins ad nauseum, but a reminder that this list was compiled primarily for Overstreet's, and -- per my 2013 edition, Overstreet's defines Copper as 1984-1992. Has that changed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimjum12 Posted December 27, 2015 Share Posted December 27, 2015 We can continue to rehash the year Copper Age begins ad nauseum, but a reminder that this list was compiled primarily for Overstreet's, and -- per my 2013 edition, Overstreet's defines Copper as 1984-1992. Has that changed? ...other than that Overstreet couldn't be more wrong, I suppose not. GOD BLESS... -jimbo(a friend of jesus) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brock Posted December 27, 2015 Author Share Posted December 27, 2015 We can continue to rehash the year Copper Age begins ad nauseum, but a reminder that this list was compiled primarily for Overstreet's, and -- per my 2013 edition, Overstreet's defines Copper as 1984-1992. Has that changed? Each year, I'm putting the results of this discussion in my Market Report... I've used 1982 to 1992 as a timeline, but the dating will always be an endless debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ComicConnoisseur Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 We can continue to rehash the year Copper Age begins ad nauseum, but a reminder that this list was compiled primarily for Overstreet's, and -- per my 2013 edition, Overstreet's defines Copper as 1984-1992. Has that changed? To solve this endless debate. How about just going by decades? 1930s 1940s 1950s 1960s 1970s 1980s 1990s 2000s 2010s Also I wonder who came up with this naming the different ages by metals? Anybody take credit for this? I can see naming something the golden age. Golden age of movies. Golden age of TV. Golden age of baseball but maybe it should stop at that stage? or we could break it up into revolutionary stages if one pleases. The Golden Age of comics 1938 to 1960 birth of the hobby. The Marvel Age of comics Marvel 1961 to 1985 revolutionizes the industry! Begins with Fantastic Four 1 and ends with the Secret Wars series. The Frank Miller/Alan Moore age of comics begins in 1986 with both Watchmen #1 and Dark Knight Returns #1. Both series took comic books to a more adult storytelling platform. Transformed comic books perception with the mainstream. I would say this age still continues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
