Bosco685 Posted November 23, 2017 Author Share Posted November 23, 2017 7 hours ago, Gatsby77 said: Here's a projected profit/loss for Justice League from two days ago, from Forbes' Rob Cain: His creds? He's a "former studio executive and current film finance consultant and producer." Forbes: Warner Bros. Faces A Possible $50M to $100M Loss on 'Justice League' It's an extensive analysis, but he presumes the costs of: $300 million for producing the movie $150 million for marketing $60 million for global home entertainment costs $20 million for talent residuals and "off-the-tops" (release-related expenses) $20 million in interest expense and $50 milion for talent participation to the director, producers, stars, and others. That comes out to $600 million total. Then there's an additional 12% or so cost of capital over a few years which gets us to the widely-reported & assumed $700 milion break-even, even including off-sets from marketing partners that subsidized the marketing. And here's a chart on how the projected ROI compares to other recent comic book films, in which Justice League ranks 20th out of 20: I am very familiar with Rob Cain's pieces. He was the 'experienced studio executive' who published early on how much Batman v Superman had to make to break even. He used the rumored marketing budget (the thing that gets ignored in Marvel movies) to calculate his experienced assumption. So his theory was WB invested $400M, and with additional costs it would have to break $634 million. Was The $400 Million Warner Bros. Put Into 'Batman v Superman' A Good Investment? Deadline.com did a more thorough analysis, including all costs involved for theater and digital/disc distribution and determined the break-even was $575.89M (a $58.11M difference). Yet the Cain analysis noted that cost was just in theaters. He had gone with the rumored marketing expense because that was the general rumor. How could he go wrong? I also noticed for Guardians of the Galaxy he is reflecting the mistaken Box Office Mojo production budget of $170M. A little publication he should look into found out this was inaccurate. Disney Reveals Guardians Of The Galaxy Was Over Budget At $232 Million Because, you know. We want honesty in our analytics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted November 23, 2017 Author Share Posted November 23, 2017 He was super in Netflix's 'Mindhunter' show. So it was great to see they got him as part of the cast. 'Justice League' Actor Reveals Joss Whedon Written And Directed Batman Scene Quote In the case of Justice League, actor Holt McCallany revealed that the opening scene in which Batman beats a thug and is interrupted by a Parademon was directed by Joss Whedon. "I love Joss Whedon. My scene with Batman was originally conceived as a comedic scene. That’s how Joss wrote it, and that’s how we shot it," the actor told Men's Fitness. "I thought it came out great, but the studio felt it would be a mistake to open the film with a completely comedic scene, so it was re-edited a little bit. I was disappointed, but when I got home to New York I found a bottle of my favorite Champagne and a note from Joss that said, 'To Battles Lost. Gratefully, Joss., I can’t tell you how much it meant to me that he took the time to write to me. Joss Whedon is a class act. I had the letter framed." "It was a great experience, and a fun scene to shoot. Ben [Affleck] was very easygoing, we got it in just a few takes," the actor confessed. "My favorite fight scenes are usually ones that are choreographed with some style to them, and ones that are choreographed around a particular actor’s individual strengths. The old adage in the fight game is 'styles make fights.' I like to design my own fight choreography in conjunction with my director and stunt coordinator whenever possible, and here it was a great way to be a part of the film—even though I got beat by Batman." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bane Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 Booked my tickets for Saturday afternoon Bosco685 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wall-Crawler Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 (edited) 17 hours ago, darkstar said: Marvel hasn't done anything with villains either. They are still pushing Loki, which is hilarious. They pissed away Crossbones and Ultron. The Mandarin, who should've served as a bin Laden analog and made an impact in every Marvel movie, fell victim to the greatest misstep in comic book movies other than DC going all in with Snyder. Eventually the creators of these properties are going to realize that if you don't have a villain worth his salt, you don't have a film. They all seem to have a problem with villains. I loved WW but did not like how they handled Ares (in the end). I would say, while not a "true" villain, Marvel has handled the Winter Soldier very, very well. I also surprisingly liked Michael Keaton as the Vulture and he is still alive in that film universe, so... I would further argue that Doc Ock in Spider-Man 2 was excellent. I know that is not part of the current slate of films, but he was pretty great in that flick. While not "my Joker" Heath Ledger was awesome. There have been a few, but yes, very few and far between, on both sides. I think they "throw them away" too casually. Edited November 23, 2017 by Wall-Crawler Bosco685 and Artboy99 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdoginohio Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 i'm hoping a Fourth World movie is in the works. Bosco685 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kagenish Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 I saw the movie twice we like it a lot. do I find the villain was a throwaway yes but I'm happy the movie gave us great interaction between each superhero. I do want to see Zack Synder true vision for JL maybe in an ultimate cut and for the head of WB to spot put his hands in any DC films and lt Geoff and Jon run the show. Bosco685 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsilverjanet Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 Purchased the Bvs 4k ultimate cut this morning from Best Buy for $15 Bosco685 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drotto Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, kagenish said: I saw the movie twice we like it a lot. do I find the villain was a throwaway yes but I'm happy the movie gave us great interaction between each superhero. I do want to see Zack Synder true vision for JL maybe in an ultimate cut and for the head of WB to spot put his hands in any DC films and lt Geoff and Jon run the show. Issue is a pure Snyder version likely does not exist. The film was not done when he left, an any scenes that had not made the short list for a final cut are likely incomplete and do not have effects. With BvS I suspect the uncut version was more or less done before the theatrical edition was made, since Snyder was still in control with that movie. To finish say a 90% done movie like you are proposing would be expensive, and I am not sure if there is a massive financial upside for WB doing it. It would likely be much more like the Richard Donner cut of Superman 2 which was scraped together from incomplete and even practice scenes that really were never intended for release. And yeah that took 30 years. Edited November 23, 2017 by drotto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnthonyTheAbyss Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 (edited) 19 hours ago, darkstar said: Marvel hasn't done anything with villains either. I keep hearing this. I don't know why people think this is true... - Obadiah Stane was fantastic. It was the perfect first villain for Iron Man to go up against. - Loki is a better character in the movies than in the comics - Hela...nuff said (go see the movie) - Thanos...c'mon, everybody knows this will be one of the greatest movie villain of all time - Winter Soldier...went from killing people to dawning the Captain America shield It's like the Superman mustache-gate and Snyder vs Whedon...overblown by comic nerds like us. Edited November 23, 2017 by AnthonyTheAbyss Gobble gobble Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted November 23, 2017 Author Share Posted November 23, 2017 (edited) 47 minutes ago, drotto said: Issue is a pure Snyder version likely does not exist. The film was no done when he left, an any scenes that had not made the short list for a final cut are unlikely incomplete and do not have effects. With BvS I suspect the uncut version was more or less done before the theatrical edition was made, since Snyder was still in control with that movie. To finish say a 90% done movie like you are proposing would be expensive, and I am not sure if there is a massive financial upside for WB doing it. It would likely be much more like the Richard Donner cut of Superman 2 which was scraped together from incomplete and even practice scenes that really were never intended for release. And yeah that took 30 years. You are most probably right. Remember, 'Batman v Superman' was a finished four-hour movie that then Snyder peeled back for general release. None of us have ever even seen the original copy he made for his production crew to review and then cut down. ‘Batman v Superman’ was 4 hours long, scenes were moved around in the editing room Quote ProVideo Coalition published a great in-depth interview with Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice editor David Brenner last week. During the interview, Brenner revealed that the original cut of the movie was nearly 4 hours long! He also explained that some scenes got moved around in the editing room. For example, in the --script, Lex Luthor is introduced later, but in the finished movie, they decided to move his scenes to the beginning. So with Justice League, they hadn't refined some scenes because the plan to do this later when he hired Joss Whedon to help out. This could play out like a Donner Cut if it ever made its way to release, with some rough looking scenes. Edited November 23, 2017 by Bosco685 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted November 23, 2017 Author Share Posted November 23, 2017 Justice League had another $10M (+) day on Wednesday, and supposedly is on the way to a $63M weekend. DEADLINE: ‘Justice League’ Solid With $63M+ Thanksgiving B.O. Quote Coco: The Disney film earned an A+ CinemaScore last night, Pixar’s 6th ever, and the best since Up. On top of that, Coco came in much higher on its first day with an estimated $13.3M; which is behind Thanksgiving openers Moana ($15.5M) and Frozen ($15.1M) and ahead of Good Dinosaur ($9.76m) and Tangled ($11.9M). Currently, the Lee Unkrich-Adrian Molina film should hit $70M-plus in five days, and $47M over three days. The Pixar movie steps on the capes of Warner Bros/DC super friends movie Justice League which earned $10.45M yesterday, -1% from Tuesday for a running total of $122.3M. Pic’s 5-day is at $63.6M with three day landing at $44.1M, -53%, which again, thanks to the holiday, bests the post-Easter drop of Batman v. Superman (-69%) and August champ Suicide Squad (-67%). While many have dinged Justice League for being-less than as a superhero movie, especially in its ensemble execution, the fact is that it’s brought more dollars to the Thanksgiving frame than Warner Bros. Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them a year ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkstar Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 2 minutes ago, AnthonyTheAbyss said: I keep hearing this. I don't know why people think this is true... - Obadiah Stane was fantastic. It was the perfect first villain for Iron Man to go up against. - Loki is a better character in the movies than in the comics - Hela...nuff said (go see the movie) - Thanos...c'mon, everybody knows this will be one of the greatest movie villain of all time - Winter Soldier...went from killing people to dawning the Captain America shield It's like the Superman mustache-gate and Snyder vs Whedon...overblown by comic nerds like us. Because it is true. Look how many villains you came up with. Now look at how many Marvel movies have been made. Jeff Bridges WAS fantastic, but having the villain in Iron Man 1 ultimately just being another guy in a metal suit wasn't. I'll give you Winter Soldier, I can't speak to Hela, and Thanos hasn't arrived. I don't want to anger everyone, so I won't discuss Loki. You don't have to accept mediocrity just because you are a fan of the source material. Look at the overall catalogue of Marvel movies, or superhero movies in general, and you'll notice they usually nail the heroes (especially Marvel) in regards to casting, aestethics, etc. but their approach to villains has been extremely underwhelming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted November 23, 2017 Author Share Posted November 23, 2017 'Justice League' Art Book Reveals New Look at Zeus and Ares Quote One of Justice League's most epic moments was a flashback sequence to ancient times, when the heroes of Earth united to repel Steppenwolf's first attack on our planet. Before Justice League's release, there was a lot of speculation about who two warriors of the ancient war were; in the film we learned they are Zeus and Ares, the "Old Gods" of the ancient world. Now the official Justice League artwork book gives fans a better look at both characters. We got to know Ares well in Wonder Woman, but seeing Zeus on the battlefield in Justice League was an impressive visual moment. The art book reveals a concept for Zeus' metallic arms, no doubt to better channel his massive bolts of lightning, which looked awesome in battle on the big screen. The sequence resonated especially well as a tease of what we could get in David Sandberg's Shazam movie, which is still very much in the production pipeline, with Zachary Levi playing the mystical superhero. The lore of the DCEU Old Gods has been quite interesting to see onscreen, and with Justice League opening the door to The New Gods of Apokolips and New Genesis, the entire Jack Kirby "Fourth World" saga is on the table for DCEU adaptation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drotto Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 31 minutes ago, Bosco685 said: You are most probably right. Remember, 'Batman v Superman' was a finished four-hour movie that then Snyder peeled back for general release. None of us have ever even seen the original copy he made for his production crew to review and then cut down. ‘Batman v Superman’ was 4 hours long, scenes were moved around in the editing room So with Justice League, they had refined some scenes because of the plan to do this later when he hired Joss Whedon to help out. This could play out like a Donner Cut if it ever made its way to release, with some rough looking scenes. Wow, I got an ounce of respect from Bosco685!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnthonyTheAbyss Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 7 minutes ago, darkstar said: Because it is true. Look how many villains you came up with ... You don't have to accept mediocrity just because you are a fan of the source material. I was just giving examples...not my complete list. You could also ad Ultron to the list. He's suppose to be a souless android. The movie perfectly represents him. Red Skull...great villain. I do understand how the argument came about. Heroes fighting their doppelgangers...such as Antman and Black Panther (who will be fighting Golden Jaguar). Or any Guardians movie villain...pretty weak. But to flatly claim (not saying you...just from the articles/videos I've seen) that Marvel doesn't do well with their villains is a false blanket statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bosco685 Posted November 23, 2017 Author Share Posted November 23, 2017 23 minutes ago, drotto said: Wow, I got an ounce of respect from Bosco685!!! Don't worry. You'll burn through it with something about a rumor you always felt was right about something related to DC movies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkstar Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 4 hours ago, AnthonyTheAbyss said: I was just giving examples...not my complete list. You could also ad Ultron to the list. He's suppose to be a souless android. The movie perfectly represents him. Red Skull...great villain. I do understand how the argument came about. Heroes fighting their doppelgangers...such as Antman and Black Panther (who will be fighting Golden Jaguar). Or any Guardians movie villain...pretty weak. But to flatly claim (not saying you...just from the articles/videos I've seen) that Marvel doesn't do well with their villains is a false blanket statement. Well another big problem is that they just use them and then discard them. Everyone loved the airport fight in Civil War. Why has Marvel made all these movies but never had a group of super heroes fighting a group of super villains? The heroes are always stuck fighting nameless, faceless hordes of robots, aliens, and human meatshields. Ultron wasn't poorly handled and Spader was good, unfortunately he arrived an starred in a terribly written movie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Aldred Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 On 22 November 2017 at 8:48 PM, jsilverjanet said: What’s Marvel come up with other than Loki? The nutjob uber-Goth, Hela, is my current favourite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnthonyTheAbyss Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 (edited) 21 minutes ago, darkstar said: Well another big problem is that they just use them and then discard them. Everyone loved the airport fight in Civil War. Why has Marvel made all these movies but never had a group of super heroes fighting a group of super villains? The heroes are always stuck fighting nameless, faceless hordes of robots, aliens, and human meatshields. Ultron wasn't poorly handled and Spader was good, unfortunately he arrived an starred in a terribly written movie. But you could say that about DC also... For every great Bat villain (Joker, Ra's Al Ghul) there's a Talia, Bane, Two-Face, and Scarecrow. Superman fighting Zod is the equivalent of Iron Man fighting Obadiah Stane. Doomsday and Lex Luther were some of the worse movie adaptations. Wonder Woman didn't even have a true "villain". Suicide Squad made Enchantress a hula dancer! And on top of all that Steppenwolf...OMG Steppenwolf!!! I just don't understand how anybody can say Marvel doesn't do good villains without including DC in that conversation. I honestly have no issues with either. But for the sake of argument I'm just trying to make my point. Edited November 23, 2017 by AnthonyTheAbyss Gobble till you wobble Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darkstar Posted November 23, 2017 Share Posted November 23, 2017 5 minutes ago, AnthonyTheAbyss said: But you could say that about DC also... For every great Bat villain (Joker, Ra's Al Ghul) there's a Talia, Bane, Two-Face, and Scarecrow. Superman fighting Zod is the equivalent of Iron Man fighting Obadiah Stane. Doomsday and Lex Luther were some of the worse movie adaptations. Wonder Woman didn't even have a true "villain". Suicide Squad made Enchantress a hula dancer! And on top of all that Steppenwolf...OMG Steppenwolf!!! I just don't understand how anybody can say Marvel doesn't do good villains without including DC in that conversation. I honestly have no issues with either. But for the sake of argument I'm just trying to make my point. I already stated earlier in this thread that DC has done even worse with villains. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
