There's a Restored 9.4 Tec 33 Blowing up on Ebay

[Gotham Kid]

Winner had fb of 13.

All four of the top bidders have 100% bids with the seller. (Three of them are also current top bidders on a Silver Age book, Incredible Hulk #1 at 9.6 restored, being auctioned by the seller.)

Update: The seller yanked their Incredible Hulk #1 eBay auction. It had all the same top bidders as the Tec #33.

 

What they need is a solid result in a Clink/CC/HA auction to add confidence to buyers ans establish where the market is for what is essentially something new in the marketplace.

 

They've already had several books auctioned off on CC and Heritage.

 

Meant after this thread and the issues/concerns raised herein.

 

Gotcha. We'll see how the SC4 9.8, IH 1 9.8, More Fun 52 9.6 and Fantastic 3 do at auction.

[bluechip]

heres what Im talking about.

 

Also, and this may be standard with extensive restoration, most everything looks repainted too, like the Bob Kane sig (which is also repositioned), the lite blue water shapes, and the rule between masthead and artwork. Some of this is no doubt due to the lower resolution of the Pre restoration image they posted.

 

I looked for an unrestored copy for comparison, and added it on the far right.

 

Great graphic, and one that should scare anyone thinking about buying any of these reproductions...stuff like this taints all restored/conserved books IMHO, but I'm sure hammer would be proud!

 

This is strange. Just because it looks good doesn't mean it's restored if it doesn't match the original. If any original images or colors remain missing then the loss should remain an apparent grade-impacting defect. And any ink that creates a new unique image on the book (whether a scribble or something that It fails to match the original image) should also be a defect, as opposed to restoration, because it doesn't "restore" what was there in the first place.

 

I understand that graders can't always know what a book looked like before, but in cases where that information can be provided and is provided, it would be a good thing if a cert company would include that information and give that book a unique resto designation. It would encourage people to provide the befores with the afters.

 

 

[*matterus023*]

Out of interest where do people stand on the use of xerox?

[Aman619]

I was thinking about this too. Why not use Photoshop to produce a perfect image of the covers, then print them on both ides, trim it and staple it to onto the book. Similar to a color xerox but, depending on the printer, resulting in higher quality images.

 

Im sure with such a cover being 100% added material, it would fall low on the resto scale. But is a heavily repainted and drawn image on the original cover paper that much preferred as a solution?

 

yes clearly, but is there a way to weight the pros and cons once we are no longer talking about seeing the flawed original paper as the cover? This is why the idea of restored books never appealed to me.

[*matterus023*]

I personally as I learn more and more dislike the use of xerox. It is an escape goat I feel for restorers.

 

But my knowlege is still at a low level. I would prefer something hand crafted than computer personally. I mean we have all seen The terminator and now how that turned out

[tabcom]

Out of interest where do people stand on the use of xerox?

I prefer Hewlett Packard.

[Doohickamabob]

I personally as I learn more and more dislike the use of xerox. It is an escape goat I feel for restorers.

We used to have an escape goat in the back yard. I often used him as a scapegoat. But he escaped, which really got my goat.

 

[*matterus023*]

I personally as I learn more and more dislike the use of xerox. It is an escape goat I feel for restorers.

We used to have an escape goat in the back yard. I often used him as a scapegoat. But he escaped, which really got my goat.

 

ooops

[VintageComics]

CGC 9.2 Extensive holder to 9.4 Moderate holder still has me thinking

 

 

Resto standards have changed but so have resto designation standards. If I'm not mistaken, wasn't that old book graded under CGC's old grading standards and the new book under the updated resto designations?

 

Yes old label 9.2 E to new 9.4 M

 

It may be a difference in the perception of "conservation" vs "restoration". That is, techniques now deemed conservation were at one time included in restoration. So with those conservation techniques out of the restoration picture, that could account for a bump down as in Ext to Mod or Mod to Sl.

 

Great point. I might even think that makes sence.

 

It might make Sense

 

Wow, it's simply amazing how we rationalize and try to look for reasons to give CGC the benefit of the doubt when we see inconsistencies or any questions in terms of their grading or restoration rating determinations. Yes indeed, it must be their "new and improved" techniques or more accurate re-definitions.

 

Yet, when we see any inconsistencies or questions with respect to grading or restoration rating issues from the other company, a large number of the board members here immediately accuse them of gross incompetency or what have you. And seemingly, almost to the point of total contempt and disdain, as though they had just committed a fraudulent act with heinous intent.

 

I actually find this rather surprising, considering that many of these were the exact same board members that used to espouse the honesty, integrity, knowledge, and sheer competence of Steve and West when they were both still working with CGC.

 

Now my post was in the core of your quote but it applied equally to CGC and CBCS. And I wasn't making excuses for them. I was stating what I strongly believe is happening. With different definitions of what is restoration vs conservation coming into play, the designations (Ext, Mod, Slight) could well change along with them. But ever since I started on these boards I have always maintained it makes no difference what you call it: restoration, conservation, whatever. A different term does not change what a book has been through. And a MUCH better understanding of what restoration is (including conservation) is sorely needed.

 

Agreed.

 

I've noticed the same thing and have been confused how easily people can turn on Steve and West.It kind of sickens me.

 

There is only a small handful of people who speak negatively about them and from what I remember they are relatively new here if I'm not mistaken.

[drbanner]

I've noticed the same thing and have been confused how easily people can turn on Steve and West.It kind of sickens me.

There is only a small handful of people who speak negatively about them and from what I remember they are relatively new here if I'm not mistaken.

Indeed, they are almost exclusively folks that didn't interact with CGC, Steve, or West when they started CGC and the comic book 3rd-party grading industry. Too bad they were not on the forum at all prior to Steve leaving out on his own and then to Heritage, back when CGC interacted with us common folks...

[jimjum12]

I've noticed the same thing and have been confused how easily people can turn on Steve and West.It kind of sickens me.

There is only a small handful of people who speak negatively about them and from what I remember they are relatively new here if I'm not mistaken.

Indeed, they are almost exclusively folks that didn't interact with CGC, Steve, or West when they started CGC, 3rd-party grading, and were not on the forum at all prior to Steve leaving out on his own and then to Heritage. Back when CGC interacted with us peons...

 

+ 1 ....... Steve, as busy as he was while with CGC, took the time to post in the forums and I found that admirable. There was no CGC before Steve. Rather than look down on those who are looking down on him, I prefer to chalk it up to ignorance and their never having had the chance to get to know him. He and West are both good peeps.... and I miss them both around here. GOD BLESS...

 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

[Sqeggs]

Rather than look down on those who are looking down on him, I prefer to chalk it up to ignorance and their never having had the chance to get to know him. He and West are both good peeps.... and I miss them both around here. GOD BLESS...

 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

 

I was thinking of looking down on you for not looking down on the people who are looking down on Borock ... but I'm too nice a guy.

[woowoo]

Rather than look down on those who are looking down on him, I prefer to chalk it up to ignorance and their never having had the chance to get to know him. He and West are both good peeps.... and I miss them both around here. GOD BLESS...

 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

 

I was thinking of looking down on you for not looking down on the people who are looking down on Borock ... but I'm too nice a guy.

 

Thought you were a girl ? from you avatar.

[Sqeggs]

Rather than look down on those who are looking down on him, I prefer to chalk it up to ignorance and their never having had the chance to get to know him. He and West are both good peeps.... and I miss them both around here. GOD BLESS...

 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

 

I was thinking of looking down on you for not looking down on the people who are looking down on Borock ... but I'm too nice a guy.

 

Thought you were a girl ? from you avatar.

 

Gotta keep people guessing!

[woowoo]

Rather than look down on those who are looking down on him, I prefer to chalk it up to ignorance and their never having had the chance to get to know him. He and West are both good peeps.... and I miss them both around here. GOD BLESS...

 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

 

I was thinking of looking down on you for not looking down on the people who are looking down on Borock ... but I'm too nice a guy.

 

Thought you were a girl ? from you avatar.

 

Gotta keep people guessing!

[VintageComics]

I was thinking about this too. Why not use Photoshop to produce a perfect image of the covers, then print them on both ides, trim it and staple it to onto the book. Similar to a color xerox but, depending on the printer, resulting in higher quality images.

 

Im sure with such a cover being 100% added material, it would fall low on the resto scale. But is a heavily repainted and drawn image on the original cover paper that much preferred as a solution?

 

yes clearly, but is there a way to weight the pros and cons once we are no longer talking about seeing the flawed original paper as the cover? This is why the idea of restored books never appealed to me.

 

I spoke to CGC about this and from what I remember, I believe their position is that they don't accept xerox as restoration. I understand why - it's a slippery slope that opens the door to recreating an entire comic book and considering it restoration. They only accept 'traditional methods of restoration', meaning hand painted art work.

[VintageComics]

heres what Im talking about.

 

Also, and this may be standard with extensive restoration, most everything looks repainted too, like the Bob Kane sig (which is also repositioned), the lite blue water shapes, and the rule between masthead and artwork. Some of this is no doubt due to the lower resolution of the Pre restoration image they posted.

 

I looked for an unrestored copy for comparison, and added it on the far right.

 

Great graphic, and one that should scare anyone thinking about buying any of these reproductions...stuff like this taints all restored/conserved books IMHO, but I'm sure hammer would be proud!

 

I know restorers make mistakes but this is two mistakes on two books.

 

I wonder if CGC needs to start investing in photo-recognition technology for bigger books.

 

Stuff like this shouldn't be getting missed.

[rodan57]

 

Stuff like this shouldn't be getting missed.

 

I agree.

 

How is placing a reproduced Kane signature in the wrong place any less significant a defect than, let's say, a tape pull? In each case the information that should be on the book is no longer there.

 

And a buffering line between the front and back covers, whether it be too thick, too thin, missing or inserted in error, is still, when done wrong, a defect that runs from the top to the bottom of the book.

[VintageComics]

The Bob Kane sig is in the wrong spot AND the black line under the Bob Kane sig is also different. So not only did the art move West, it moved South.

 

I wonder if anything else on the cover doesn't match up.

[Tri-Color Brian]

Rather than look down on those who are looking down on him, I prefer to chalk it up to ignorance and their never having had the chance to get to know him. He and West are both good peeps.... and I miss them both around here. GOD BLESS...

 

-jimbo(a friend of jesus)

 

I was thinking of looking down on you for not looking down on the people who are looking down on Borock ... but I'm too nice a guy.

 

Thought you were a girl ? from you avatar.

 

Gotta keep people guessing!

 

He swings both ways... He's a guy, but he likes girly romance books...