Potential Comic Art Fans Scam Alert 0

[AnkurJ]

Had he stuck to the seller who took his money we'd probably still be on that topic.

 

I'm actually interested in this myself - any information like an email address on this person. I have no doubt that if this persons done this on CAF, they may try to perpetrate their next scam on another site.

 

All I have is their name which is listed in the first post. I have not received any further correspondence from them. No tracking or refund had been provided to date.

 

And when anyone here is selling, they will want to get the most they can. Nothing abnormal about that. And as I said, the buyer of the book agreed with my grade and was thrilled to own it. Looking at my CAF for sale gallery, I've sold very few pieces over the last 13 years, so the statements that I am benefiting from the site without paying for s premium membership are false.

 

I do not need to explain myself further. My family and patients know the type of person I am, and that is good enough for me.

[comicwiz]

Had he stuck to the seller who took his money we'd probably still be on that topic.

 

I'm actually interested in this myself - any information like an email address on this person. I have no doubt that if this persons done this on CAF, they may try to perpetrate their next scam on another site.

 

All I have is their name which is listed in the first post. I have not received any further correspondence from them. No tracking or refund had been provided to date.

 

And when anyone here is selling, they will want to get the most they can. Nothing abnormal about that. And as I said, the buyer of the book agreed with my grade and was thrilled to own it. Looking at my CAF for sale gallery, I've sold very few pieces over the last 13 years, so the statements that I am benefiting from the site without paying for s premium membership are false.

 

I do not need to explain myself further. My family and patients know the type of person I am, and that is good enough for me.

 

I've never used Square - so did you provide your credit card information via messaging or over a phone call? How was this transaction carried out - through CAF's messaging? Sorry for the dense sounding questions, but I'm not on CAF and I'm just trying to figure out how the virtual handshake and payment handling went down.

[AnkurJ]

Emails through CAF. She then emailed me an invoice through square where I entered my credit card number.

[comicwiz]

Thanks. Did her gallery page ever have a link to an eBay sellers page or any references? Anyhow, hope you get your money back, and if there's any update on the situation or any further information on this individual, please let us know.

[AnkurJ]

It did not. I assumed the best as her communication was initially very good.

[comix4fun]

 

And when anyone here is selling, they will want to get the most they can. Nothing abnormal about that. And as I said, the buyer of the book agreed with my grade and was thrilled to own it.

 

 

 

Getting away with it isn't the same as doing the right thing in the first place.

 

The weight of the rationalization is absolutely crushing.

 

To me, it's not worth contradicting myself, hoping to find the one guy who'll let it slide, to make a few hundred bucks.

 

I understand, not everyone is wired the same way. Makes the hobby difficult to navigate and still enjoy it.

[JadeGiant]

Makes the hobby difficult to navigate and still enjoy it.

 

Ugh, the more I delve into the hobby, the more I find this to be true. Good thing I love artwork enough to keep going

[Bill Cox]

Turns out I do have an account on here. Haven't used it in 8 years. Thanks to Chris for posting my original reply. I figured it was better for me to personally clarify a few things mentioned in the thread.

 

First, contrary to what Ankur said, his account was not closed at the same time as the seller, it was closed 12 hours later. The reason was because he stated CAF should have responsibility for his deal going wrong. The moment he stated that, I was forced to take the position that he's forgotten the rules of the site and poses a risk to the site and to other members by not knowing or caring for CAF's position on transactions between members. As I mentioned earlier, typically I turn off both parties galleries from the start and that's because the person who feels they were wronged state up front that they feel CAF is somehow culpable for the deal (happens 9/10 times), but with Ankur it didn't happen until long after the fact. My concern is always with protecting the site and it's membership. If that means closing down both parties galleries until the dust settles then that's what has to happen. I never once used the word delete or ban in relation to his account. I said I shut down his gallery. At that point in the conversation between he and I, I didn't feel I needed to extend him any further courtesy of an explanation.

 

Next, I'm not sure what someone was talking about regarding selling user information. Obviously that is not something we'd ever do even if it meant LARGE sums of money.

 

Regarding the suggestion of having a safe section on CAF to buy or sell art. We already have that. Our Dealer search has over 72,000 pieces of art for sale right now, and our Premium Member Classifieds has around 8,000 pieces of artwork. I consider the Classifieds a safe place to conduct purchases because any person willing to pay for a premium membership to gain access to this section on CAF typically is going to handle sales as one would expect. They certainly are not going to be someone trying to scam anyone since a scammer is not going to shell out cash for a premium membership. In this case Ankur struck a deal with a person on CAF whom he knew had not had their gallery for more than a month and they were not a premium member. Two red flags to start, and then they accept a low offer on the art. As far as having a system to show who is a good seller or not, we do not have a feature like that as of today but we do show a person's ebay handle when they provide it in their profile, in part so another member can see their feedback for situations like this.

 

Regarding getting back to things related to the seller all I can disclose is that their name is Julie Johnston. After Ankur's original email I had a few emails with her where I told her I had shut off her gallery, and I requested she send me proof from Square that she refunded the money to him in order for me to consider turning her gallery back on, and she did admit to needing to refund the money so it was clear that something had happened. These emails with her was going on hours before the emails that led to my having to shut down his gallery. When the responsibility remark came up I was chafed to say the least, and had to follow policy at that point. I would add so that he's aware of it, that if a formal request was made by his credit card company I'd gladly hand over the data I have on file for her.

 

At any rate, I've nothing more to add to this conversation unless someone has any other questions about our site's Ts and Cs. If people don't appreciate the policies we have in place they don't need to use or visit CAF.

[Thegoldenage]

Interesting thread. I only want to add that I've known Ankur for the better part of 15 years and have had many good comic book transactions with him. No concerns here.

[Silver Surfer]

Had he stuck to the seller who took his money we'd probably still be on that topic.

 

I'm actually interested in this myself - any information like an email address on this person. I have no doubt that if this persons done this on CAF, they may try to perpetrate their next scam on another site.

 

All I have is their name which is listed in the first post. I have not received any further correspondence from them. No tracking or refund had been provided to date.

 

And when anyone here is selling, they will want to get the most they can. Nothing abnormal about that. And as I said, the buyer of the book agreed with my grade and was thrilled to own it. Looking at my CAF for sale gallery, I've sold very few pieces over the last 13 years, so the statements that I am benefiting from the site without paying for s premium membership are false.

 

I do not need to explain myself further. My family and patients know the type of person I am, and that is good enough for me.

 

The kind of guy who would have the gall to start this thread right after you sold your Cap #74.

Link

[Meeley Man]

Looking at my CAF for sale gallery, I've sold very few pieces over the last 13 years, so the statements that I am benefiting from the site without paying for s premium membership are false.

 

But you have sold pieces. And Bill and CAF saw nothing out of those deals, despite giving you the platform to be able to do so more easily. Plus, how much art have you obtained from other members? You see, "benefit" doesn't just have to be about getting oodles of cash.

 

do not need to explain myself further. My family and patients know the type of person I am, and that is good enough for me.

 

What if another party, who isn't the noted group, had a better opinion of you than that?

[oceans11]

 

do not need to explain myself further. My family and patients know the type of person I am, and that is good enough for me.

 

What if another party, who isn't the noted group, had a better opinion of you than that?

 

But what about the comic art community, which is the group that is being addressed here? I'm going to assume most of us here are not in the category of "family and patients" so that doesn't do us any good in lending credibility to Ankur's statements or bolstering his reputation. Reputation in any collecting community is key.

 

Age old knowledge, you know who you're buying from, otherwise you are assuming risk. CAF has no involvement in that risk as it's between seller and buyer. And no, despite subjectivity to grading, comic books don't increase a grade or two when you go to sell them, even if they've been kept in some magical restorative safe deposit box

[Peter G]

I appreciate both sides here.

 

Cant we all get along ?

[Knightsofold]

I appreciate all potential scam alerts. Thank you.

 

 

[art4comics.com]

I have not posted in some time on this board but wanted to chime in.

 

I don't think Bill needs to defend what he did or why he did it. CAF has built a great original art collecting community and promoted the hobby in ways I could never have foreseen. I have been a premium member since the beginning. Even if I never used a single premium member service I would gladly send CAF money every year. I support the market data for the same reason. I use it a few times a year and really don't need it but another opportunity to support CAF. The hours of enjoyment I get from the site and friends I have made there are priceless. I have done many deals there as a buyer, seller and trader. I don't think anyone in this hobby can dispute the importance of CAF and its contribution. I honestly don't understand people who spend 4 and 5 figures on art not putting down the ante for a CAF premium membership but they must have their reasons. CAF has clear rules and understandings about what services it provides and what it is not responsible for.

 

As far as the whole deal with Ankur. I am sorry you got screwed. I hope it works out for you and you get your money back. As someone who has been cheated, ripped off and lied to many times, I know what it feels like. I also know there are so many other great interactions and experiences that make up for the bad ones. The comic art community is generally very helpful, friendly and supportive although within every group there are outliers.

 

My advice, when the problem is resolved contact Bill and I would think he would open up your gallery again as he doesn't seem to be the kind of person to hold a grudge. Learn from what happened as hopefully we all have and move on.

 

[rjpb]

a bump from 1.8 to 2.5 bumps the price at least 50% in grade. 2.0 in Overstreet is $1300, 4.0 is $2600. A 1.8 might be about $$800-1000, but a 2/2.5 would be $1300-$1800. Good- to Good+ may seem minor (to OA collectors who've on since moved beyond this silly funny book business) but it's a huge difference!

 

Point well taken. But on the talking point about it not appearing to be a huge difference, I find GA books tend to play by a different set of rules anyway. CGC giving glue on covers a blue pass was probably my earliest introduction to this grey area of collecting. The most recent though was being told by some well-heeled dealers and collectors that ads being cut out from a GA book barely effects the grade and value, even though I consider them to be incomplete. I've certainly seen the rarity factor push a GA books value above guide price, even in low grades.

 

Maybe when they are selling, but not when they are buying. I've owned a few GA books with clipped coupons that didn't effect story pages, and had to sell them at at least 50% below what they would have realized complete, and that's for VG-F books, I imagine its worse for higher grade. I could see it having minimal effect on 1.5-2.0 books, as all sorts of factors come into play when pricing those.

[Sqeggs]

a bump from 1.8 to 2.5 bumps the price at least 50% in grade. 2.0 in Overstreet is $1300, 4.0 is $2600. A 1.8 might be about $$800-1000, but a 2/2.5 would be $1300-$1800. Good- to Good+ may seem minor (to OA collectors who've on since moved beyond this silly funny book business) but it's a huge difference!

 

Point well taken. But on the talking point about it not appearing to be a huge difference, I find GA books tend to play by a different set of rules anyway. CGC giving glue on covers a blue pass was probably my earliest introduction to this grey area of collecting. The most recent though was being told by some well-heeled dealers and collectors that ads being cut out from a GA book barely effects the grade and value, even though I consider them to be incomplete. I've certainly seen the rarity factor push a GA books value above guide price, even in low grades.

 

Maybe when they are selling, but not when they are buying. I've owned a few GA books with clipped coupons that didn't effect story pages, and had to sell them at at least 50% below what they would have realized complete, and that's for VG-F books, I imagine its worse for higher grade. I could see it having minimal effect on 1.5-2.0 books, as all sorts of factors come into play when pricing those.

 

Yeah, a clipped coupon -- much less a missing ad page -- gets a big hit from CGC (except maybe, as you note, at the lowest grade levels) or gets you a qualified label if it's otherwise a high grade book. The value would be much lower than for an intact copy of the same book.

 

Maybe what the dealer was saying was something along the lines of: "This is a very scarce book, so even though it has a clipped coupon, I can still get guide price for it." I can see that happening.

[thehumantorch]

Had he stuck to the seller who took his money we'd probably still be on that topic.

 

I'm actually interested in this myself - any information like an email address on this person. I have no doubt that if this persons done this on CAF, they may try to perpetrate their next scam on another site.

 

All I have is their name which is listed in the first post. I have not received any further correspondence from them. No tracking or refund had been provided to date.

 

And when anyone here is selling, they will want to get the most they can. Nothing abnormal about that. And as I said, the buyer of the book agreed with my grade and was thrilled to own it. Looking at my CAF for sale gallery, I've sold very few pieces over the last 13 years, so the statements that I am benefiting from the site without paying for s premium membership are false.

 

I do not need to explain myself further. My family and patients know the type of person I am, and that is good enough for me.

 

I'm sorry you've had problems with your purchase. Nobody deserves to get ripped off.

 

But, blaming CAF, in any way is wrong. Just like the CGC boards, transactions take place without any supervision from the host and that's clear in the CAF user agreement. Bill shut down the dishonest user's account and then shut down your account when you escalated the issue.

 

I don't get the criticism about selling items on CAF while having only a free membership It's allowed and you haven't broken any rules.

 

But I have to take issue with your above post. It's clear to me that the Cap 74 was grading as a 1.8 by CGC. It's also clear that you considered it a 1.8 as you clearly state in a linked thread.

 

 

"We all want to get the most we can when we sell something."

 

Cracking it out and selling it 2 grades higher - higher than you yourself believed it to be -and neglecting to inform prospective buyers that it was previously graded CGC 1.8, clearly shows that you are willing to go beyond what I consider to be honest and ethical behavior to get the most when you sell.

[Badger]

a bump from 1.8 to 2.5 bumps the price at least 50% in grade. 2.0 in Overstreet is $1300, 4.0 is $2600. A 1.8 might be about $$800-1000, but a 2/2.5 would be $1300-$1800. Good- to Good+ may seem minor (to OA collectors who've on since moved beyond this silly funny book business) but it's a huge difference!

 

Point well taken. But on the talking point about it not appearing to be a huge difference, I find GA books tend to play by a different set of rules anyway. CGC giving glue on covers a blue pass was probably my earliest introduction to this grey area of collecting. The most recent though was being told by some well-heeled dealers and collectors that ads being cut out from a GA book barely effects the grade and value, even though I consider them to be incomplete. I've certainly seen the rarity factor push a GA books value above guide price, even in low grades.

 

Maybe when they are selling, but not when they are buying. I've owned a few GA books with clipped coupons that didn't effect story pages, and had to sell them at at least 50% below what they would have realized complete, and that's for VG-F books, I imagine its worse for higher grade. I could see it having minimal effect on 1.5-2.0 books, as all sorts of factors come into play when pricing those.

 

Yeah, a clipped coupon -- much less a missing ad page -- gets a big hit from CGC (except maybe, as you note, at the lowest grade levels) or gets you a qualified label if it's otherwise a high grade book. The value would be much lower than for an intact copy of the same book.

 

Maybe what the dealer was saying was something along the lines of: "This is a very scarce book, so even though it has a clipped coupon, I can still get guide price for it." I can see that happening.

I would very seriously consider not doing business with any dealer who tried "clipped coupon does not affect grade" with me. Now, the dealer is welcome to price in whatever range they think they will find a buyer; I do not have to buy at their asking price. Of course, I'm not known for walking away form books that I want. I've sold a couple of Timelys at significantly above guide value even with slight restoration. It all depends upon rarity and demand.

[MR SigS]

Had he stuck to the seller who took his money we'd probably still be on that topic.

 

I'm actually interested in this myself - any information like an email address on this person. I have no doubt that if this persons done this on CAF, they may try to perpetrate their next scam on another site.

 

All I have is their name which is listed in the first post. I have not received any further correspondence from them. No tracking or refund had been provided to date.

 

And when anyone here is selling, they will want to get the most they can. Nothing abnormal about that. And as I said, the buyer of the book agreed with my grade and was thrilled to own it. Looking at my CAF for sale gallery, I've sold very few pieces over the last 13 years, so the statements that I am benefiting from the site without paying for s premium membership are false.

 

I do not need to explain myself further. My family and patients know the type of person I am, and that is good enough for me.

 

The kind of guy who would have the gall to start this thread right after you sold your Cap #74.

Link

 

We probably do it every day without realizing it, but if you knew someone had done something dishonest for financial gain while trampling others in their path, would you still do business with them? Has this hobby become so cut throat that people will sink to new lows for financial gain?

 

Thoughts?

 

I for one would not, will not regardless of what the said dealer has. And I feel that these type of practices are severely hurting the hobby.

 

 

Wow!