Question for Heritage and comiclink reps wrt Burkey admission
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In light of recent events where Burkey has admitted to shilling many consignments through one or more third parties, do your organizations plan on accepting future consignments from Mike? Do your organizations plan on allowing him to bid in your auctions?

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I want to know if he is going to keep doing it as he doesn't seem to think he is doing anything wrong. Amazing.

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In light of recent events where Burkey has admitted to shilling many consignments through one or more third parties, do your organizations plan on accepting future consignments from Mike? Do your organizations plan on allowing him to bid in your auctions?

 

Why wouldn't they? They are getting money from both the seller and the high bidder.

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In light of recent events where Burkey has admitted to shilling many consignments through one or more third parties, do your organizations plan on accepting future consignments from Mike? Do your organizations plan on allowing him to bid in your auctions?

 

Why wouldn't they? They are getting money from both the seller and the high bidder.

 

hm reputational risk? liability risk?

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In light of recent events where Burkey has admitted to shilling many consignments through one or more third parties, do your organizations plan on accepting future consignments from Mike? Do your organizations plan on allowing him to bid in your auctions?

 

Why wouldn't they? They are getting money from both the seller and the high bidder.

 

It is not just about money, Ankur. There might be ethical or legal considerations as well.

 

 

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True. But I wonder how often this is done with no one realizing it. If Mike sold the art privately without putting it on his site, it's highly likely that we wouldn't be having this discussion.

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In light of recent events where Burkey has admitted to shilling many consignments through one or more third parties, do your organizations plan on accepting future consignments from Mike? Do your organizations plan on allowing him to bid in your auctions?

 

Has anyone brought the other thread and his response to it to these parties you are interested in answering your question?

 

Also, party A can give artwork to party B to place at auction. It would be an easy walk around to still get items listed and sold if party A wasn't allowed to sell something.

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In light of recent events where Burkey has admitted to shilling many consignments through one or more third parties, do your organizations plan on accepting future consignments from Mike? Do your organizations plan on allowing him to bid in your auctions?

 

Has anyone brought the other thread and his response to it to these parties you are interested in answering your question?

 

Also, party A can give artwork to party B to place at auction. It would be an easy walk around to still get items listed and sold if party A wasn't allowed to sell something.

 

I believe that at least heritage is aware of it, but for reference then, the thread is here:

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=9106274#Post9106274

 

and Mike's post here (bolding is mine):

 

"BOY OH BOY........ Now I know why I don't get on this particular chat board that often......

 

I go to Las Vegas for a week to relax and bet on a few football games for the weekend....and I have to get calls from fellow art collectors telling me I'm being dogged on this website with claims that I have shady business practices and I'm doing backdoor deals with Heritage auctions, with screwing and cheating people over to boot.

 

firstly....I want everyone here to know...I'm the most open minded transparent guy when it comes to comic art and I'll always respond to any email if anyone ever has a question about ANYTHING art related....JUST ASK me and you will get a response........

 

so with that being said, I want to thank Glen Gold for starting all of this up (with a little help from a few misinformed others piling on)..... and instead of people being grown up and simply sending me a private email about this for a response, it has now blown up with very false accusations from others who have now made this like a comic art version of the JFK Conspiracy......lol

 

Firstly.... I buy, sell, and collect comic art....if I choose to sell art on my website....I Do it....If I choose to sell art at auction...I do it.... I have no special deal with heritage......every piece of art I give them has ZERO RESERVE...... that art still sells and heritage still gets their 19.5% buyers premium on top of whatever the gavel price is....

 

NOW......What everyone is speculating about and giving their non facts about......If I give them a piece of art that I feel is worth "X" dollars (ALL at no reserve..... ) and I see that my art I gave them coming up at auction at way less than the "X" dollars I feel its worth..... I will ask any collector I know to buy it and I will work out whatever trade or cash / trade deal I have to do for them to get that piece back if it sells for well below what "I FEEL" is market value, , and I'm happy to put it back on my website and pay the 19.5% heritage premium on top of the deal I do with the collector.

 

that is not bad business..... its called Being smart and knowing your art market enough to know what YOU feel something truly is worth when others do not.

 

in my latest Romitaman website update on January 14th on my website I put up 10 or so pieces of art which were from the MOST RECENT November heritage and Comic connect auctions that I owned for several years ....(.I felt the prices were low enough that I worked a deal with another collector to get them back because I felt they were very undervalued so we did a deal and I put them back on my website for sale on January 14th......... and in less than 5 days "7" of the pieces I had for YEARS on my website without sales now SOLD last week....so how is that bad business?

 

I usually lower the prices a little also from their previous listed prices from years ago when I put the art back up for sale.....it certainly costs me "alot of money" and art to do this but its worth it for me in the long run as it actually helps "ME" get a better feel for how strong or non strong parts of comic art market is also.

 

Now..... its great see that some of our ASTUTE art collators here on this website figured out that art on my website was also sold on heritage...or previously in a comic connect auction.....so I say congrats for figuring that out......however i've been doing this for over 14 YEARS.

 

i've given heritage over 2500 pieces of art over the years to auction off.... and i've worked out numerous deals with other collectors to get a hundred or so back if I felt the prices at auction were undervalued and I could sell it for more on my website in the future if I just give it time......

 

Glen gold was the first guy to finally figure this out (kudos to him for that) but Bad Kudos to Glen for choosing post it all on a public forum whereby my reputation gets unfairly tarnished by people not in the know who are now questioning if I'm cheating people and doing backhanded deals with heritage in the process.

 

I usually don't give vital Comic Art Business advice to others in our collecting field but I'll do it here right now for everyone to read........ "WHAT SOMETHING SELLS FOR AT AUCTION DOES NOT MEAN THAT'S WHAT ITS WORTH...IT JUST MEANS IT SOLD FOR THAT PRICE ON THAT PARTICULAR DAY!"

 

I laugh when I hear collectors posting all the time about why something is priced at a certain price...or being offered at that price, when it sold AT AUCTION for less.....

 

I've spent over 3.5 MILLION DOLLARS at heritage since 2002 buying artwork strictly for resale....yet people keep going through auction archives to tell me and everyone else what an art "should" be worth based on auctions...lol

auctions are like a mini price guide if you even want to call it that...but its just a guide!! 1 of a kind items not set in stone in any guide!

 

Just as an example ...

I bought the McFarlane Spiderman #3 cover at heritage auction for 28k or so right after the ASM 328 and Spiderman 1 covers sold for 647k and 360k each.......... I put it the Spiderman 3 cover on my website 1 month after the auction for 52k and I sold it in less than 1 day.........so tell me...is the Spiderman #3 cover still worth 28k it sold for at auction or 52K+?

 

a few years ago...... I bought an ASM McFarlane Spiderman splash for 14k at auction which had marker used for the background areas around Spiderman's body and it was fading some from the marker background....... more than a couple people on this very site said the guy who bought it (ME) was stupid for paying so much for a faded splash.....I put it on my website for 22k right after I got it from the auction house and sold it within 24 hours of listing it for sale ....... so is this splash worth 14k or 22k?

 

I have about 100 other examples like these 2 above....

but the bottom line here is....do is do your homework to understand the comic art market if you ant to become a serious collector..and don't be jealous and badmouth others in the process.

 

my whole point here is.... at least with me and my Romitaman website....if you have any questions EVER about any art on my website..JUST ASK...... I'll answer you..... I promise.

 

I don't really think its fair for people to make very misinformed accusations like the guy AOKARTMAN who said I was getting a better rate from heritage than others, and that I can buy any art back I sell through them with zero or low premium taken away....that is just downright lying and shameful by people who either have some personal vendetta or just think its COOL to talk about people behind a keyboard and not to them directly. (I probably know you personally but I don't know this name you hide behind)

 

ok that's my little rant...and hopefully everything is somewhat cleared up....

 

and by the way.......since I'm not allowed to share art for sale in this forum...

I will....Is this against site rules.....

 

I did a great deal recently and I'm getting in 4 great Early super key John Byrne pieces of Marvel art from the 1970's including a KILLER COVER....... and 2 killer very early iron fist battle pages from marvel premiere 25 and Iron Fist #2 and a killer FIRST STARLORD BYRNE/AUSTIN page from marvel Premiere #11 that is LIGHTS OUT GORGEOUS, that have never EVER been on the collecting market........I also just got in a nice George Wilson TUROK painted cover.....

 

and I'm getting in 2 superb 1991 INFINITY GAUNTLET pages from issue 3 by Perez and issue 6 by Lim....and 2 incredibly detailed gene Colan inked by Bill Everett Spiderman pages from captain America #137!!!

 

and a nice 1983 Dan Decarlo betty and veronica bikini cover!

 

also getting in some TOP NOTCH Simon Bisley, Michael Turner and David finch covers and pinups!

 

also 2 john Romita cap pages will be coming in from the 140's.....

 

and the best of all is that.......I didn't put them in heritage and then get them back from heritage and we didn't do any backhanded deals for zero % premiums. lol

 

these are not on my website yet but I will be receiving these above art pieces shortly..... if anyone wants to contact me privately about these please feel free to do so privately..... .........PRIVATELY.......lol..... mikeburkey@aol.com and

http://www.romitaman.com

 

thanks

Mike "

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I go to Las Vegas for a week to relax and bet on a few football games for the weekend....and I have to get calls from fellow art collectors telling me I'm being dogged on this website with claims that I have shady business practices and I'm doing backdoor deals with Heritage auctions, with screwing and cheating people over to boot.

 

He really comes off as a Bond villain here.

 

Sorry to interrupt your spending of other people's money betting on football and partying

 

Disgraceful

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Here's his follow up post (bolding is mine):

 

Originally Posted By: romitaman

"Maybe others will hide and run away when people call them names behind a keyboard thinking they personally are judge and jury .... but I'm very open for a good debate so long as the grade school comments and pictures are left in other forums for the children in the room.

That being said..... lets have this debate on shilling....

 

in my opinion...... A shiller bids SOLELY to make someone else pay more...PERIOD!!!

 

there are no shillers In a "NO RESERVE AUCTION" because if you win it...well..YOU WIN IT.....

 

please tell me how someone is a blatant shiller then they WIN the auction?

 

i've never in my life shilled an auction I didn't plan on winning...period!!!!

 

 

I was honest on here and said I had someone bid on some my pieces in a NO RESERVE AUCTION because I'd rather get that piece back realizing the market was not strong for that piece....AND pay the 20% buyers premium in top of that versus having my piece sell for a song....I'll hang onto it.

 

if people want to call names and question ethics now... that's their business...

 

I had several friends contact me privately who told me to not even comment on this because they said this forum will be very 1 sided and they themselves didn't even want to comment because people will just keep commenting and calling names and trying to ruin people's reputations if they comment.

 

I feel my 27 years collecting as well as dealing in comic art here speaks for itself.

 

if this thread bothers anyone reading this to the point that they don't want to do business with me...then don't buy from me....or trade with me..... its pretty simple... and I wont be mad or angry in return...... i've never ever told a person they couldn't deal with me...even when a deal went sour......

 

heck I'd even sell a page of art to matt stock again......but I'd make sure his funds were good before his art ships.

 

no one is forced to deal with anyone in this hobby and business.

 

I love this hobby immensely, and I also know that no matter what you do, and no matter how hard you try .....there are ALWAYS going to be people that don't like you...especially in a hobby where envy and jealousy play a big part of it with these valuable one of kind items.

 

I myself envy alot of people who have great art I wish I owned...but I'm never EVER jealous of anyone for what they have. I'm very blessed to have gotten into this hobby in 1989 and I'll be a part of it for the rest of my life...

 

I'll probably not be responding much anymore on this thread as it probably will not matter much.....

I'm ready for the pitchforks.... lol

 

Mike"

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In light of recent events where Burkey has admitted to shilling many consignments through one or more third parties, do your organizations plan on accepting future consignments from Mike? Do your organizations plan on allowing him to bid in your auctions?

 

Why wouldn't they? They are getting money from both the seller and the high bidder.

 

Seriously? Do you have any ethics. I guess as long as consignor and seller makes money then its a mutually beneficial arrangement, screw the buyer, right. :makepoint:

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It's Market Manipulation pure and simple.

 

Piece A is bought by Dealer at $5000

 

It is put up to auction. Dealer thinks it worth $15K. Bidding is less than Dealer thinks is worth, so dealer wins it at $8K.

 

Dealer now has $14K+ into the piece. Lists it for sale at $15K. Sells it for that (breaks even or makes a few bucks). Comparable pieces, whose FMV before the shill wins the piece were $7500-ish or so, all now rise up. Dealer just happens to have quite a few of those (all bought closer to the initial number of 5K). The rising tide raises all the other boats.

 

Let's say this was happening on a select few pieces from a select few artists.

 

Here's the hypothetical scenario:

 

Kirby or Romita piece X follows the example above. Comparable pieces rise in value and a group of collectors are now priced out. "Well, I can't afford a Kirby or Romita or Ditko. Maybe I'll get a Colan or a Kane instead." The completion for those becomes more fierce and those pages end up jumping in price.

 

In the meantime we're on here posting about the "explosion of prices" in the market over the last 10-15 years. meh

 

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In light of recent events where Burkey has admitted to shilling many consignments through one or more third parties, do your organizations plan on accepting future consignments from Mike? Do your organizations plan on allowing him to bid in your auctions?

 

Why wouldn't they? They are getting money from both the seller and the high bidder.

 

Seriously? Do you have any ethics. I guess as long as consignor and seller makes money then its a mutually beneficial arrangement, screw the buyer, right. :makepoint:

 

its not whether ankur has ethics that is the question. the question really is if heritage as an auction house chooses ethics over fees. :makepoint:

Edited by eewwnuk

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In light of recent events where Burkey has admitted to shilling many consignments through one or more third parties, do your organizations plan on accepting future consignments from Mike? Do your organizations plan on allowing him to bid in your auctions?

 

Question for the group: will any of these revelations, and what the auction houses may or may not do in response, affect your willingness to bid in the upcoming auctions?

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I know that "reserves" have such an ugly stigma to them.

 

Many bidders refuse to nudge their bids up to hit a reserve, in hopes that the piece doesn't hit the reserve and then the seller is then pitched on lower offers or buyers hope it'll be re-solicited at a lower price.

 

So, I understand the concern for not using reserves and the appeal of the No Reserve auctions where bidders know a piece is guaranteed to sell, "going, going, gone!" and will find a new home.

 

It's that aspect that I like no reserves and am personally willing to roll the dice, feast or famine... but then again, I don't have pieces valued in the tens of thousands of dollars nor an acquisition cost of a piece I want to guarantee covering. I do love the fact that with a no reserve auction the marketplace generally does take care of the value, 'tho of course if an auction is not well publicized, prices can be disappointing,butr if there were 2 passionate buyers, it could be elating to a seller to see abnormal pricing above and beyond expectations.

 

Mike's system sound simply like what might be called a "safety net reserve" or using a golf term, a mulligan, where if things aren't going the way anticipated, he's able to rectify it and essentially everyone in theory walks away happy. He gets his piece back, the auction house gets their fees, no harm, no foul. Of course the underbidder(s) contending for the piece may have legitimate concern and complaints of it not being a true fair marketplace environment, so I can see that standpoint too.

 

I'll be forthright myself 'tho in that I've always had very pleasant experiences with Mike, in fact a few of my favorite pieces I've bought from him at reasonable prices, and he's always been gracious to speak with and deal with, so I hate to see too much negativity towards him and this news wouldn't impact my future support of buying from him or even bidding on Heritage (I actually only bid what I'm comfortable with anyway).

 

 

Edited by AKA Rick

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In light of recent events where Burkey has admitted to shilling many consignments through one or more third parties, do your organizations plan on accepting future consignments from Mike? Do your organizations plan on allowing him to bid in your auctions?

 

Question for the group: will any of these revelations, and what the auction houses may or may not do in response, affect your willingness to bid in the upcoming auctions?

 

no qualms personally, but if it starts getting oddly high i will bow out.

 

I might not be playing in the field where this stuff occurs, though.

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No he doesn't. He will have the original $5,000 plus 20% of $8,000 (the buyer's premium) or about $6,600 into the piece since he'll get paid the net proceeds from the auction. Yet, everyone will see $8,000 as the market comparable when, in fact, it is not a true comparable.

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In light of recent events where Burkey has admitted to shilling many consignments through one or more third parties, do your organizations plan on accepting future consignments from Mike? Do your organizations plan on allowing him to bid in your auctions?

 

Question for the group: will any of these revelations, and what the auction houses may or may not do in response, affect your willingness to bid in the upcoming auctions?

 

no qualms personally, but if it starts getting oddly high i will bow out.

 

I might not be playing in the field where this stuff occurs, though.

 

Seems like it's happening to everything from 3-figure pieces to low 5-figure pieces. My guess is that the higher up in price you go, shillers will be less likely to risk getting stuck with their piece and covering the BP.

 

From here on out, I'm only buying big ticket items. :idea:

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In light of recent events where Burkey has admitted to shilling many consignments through one or more third parties, do your organizations plan on accepting future consignments from Mike? Do your organizations plan on allowing him to bid in your auctions?

 

Question for the group: will any of these revelations, and what the auction houses may or may not do in response, affect your willingness to bid in the upcoming auctions?

 

Yes. Even though I always suspected this type of stuff went on, seeing it admitted to has made me skittish and I am going to lower some of my bids accordingly.

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