Image Publisher Eric Stephenson Urges Comics Industry Not To Repeat Past Mistake 0

[Prince Namor]

Having backstock on the shelf is nice but its unimaginable that their goal at Image was to have books from October and November available in large quantities 3 to 4 months later, isn't it ?

 

It is? What creator WOULDN'T want their work available 3 to 4 to 12 months after it originally came out?

 

If I walk into a Book store and want a book by Chuck Palahniuk, whatever his latest work is will be on the shelf for over a year and maybe longer....

 

 

The kind trying to sell through and go to a 2nd printing.

 

If comic shops were like bookstores, maybe it could see it. Even more so if they were 2nd or later prints. I doubt anyone wants their 1st printing of a book sitting in the discount pile or the $1 box. Maybe I'm wrong and they consider it good exposure.

 

I wish kurtis wiebe still posted on the forums. He can confirm if he would prefer Peter panzerfaust or rat queens be available 4 months after release date.

 

Of course they would.

 

I still have Monstress #1's and #2's on my shelf with the #3's...... I WANT people to discover the book. (Incidentally, I also have ANAD Avengers #1's and Doctor Strange #1's and Thor #1's on my shelf as well)

 

If I can keep those in stock, I do as room permits. It's a sales tool that readers appreciate.

 

Having to track down a secondary market priced $30 copy of the #1? That will deter more readers than it will 'excite' the market.

 

[kimik]

Did Image completely stop releasing incentive variants and retailer variants?

 

I think they did around July 2015.

 

Does anyone know of any incentive variants or retailer variants released since they announced (around July 2015 I think) they were stopping or cutting way back on them?

 

Walking Dead 150 is Skybound so I guess Kirkman can do what he wants. But 150 only had one 1/0 incentive variant. The rest were regular cover price variants if you preordered.

 

 

WRT WD 150, it depends on what you consider the Ottley, Latour and Moore variants that were announced late to be. Sure, they were print to order, but aren't they still variants?

[kimik]

 

Image's unit share growth appears to have been roughly the same until the steep drop in 2015 which coincides with their decision to take the variants away from retailers. I'd be willing to wager that this continues in 2016. Marvel had substantial growth the same year.

 

While I'm not a fan of variants per se, I'm a huge fan of choice and options. Incentivized books may not do much for Image but I still believe it helped the retailers who took the time to help create, market, and ultimately sell the final product. It simply seems odd to me that the guy in charge worries and feels the need to "equal" everything out. Is he also going to go to the LCS and make sure they hold books for people so that everyone gets one ?

 

Marvel is having an excellent run with Star Wars and I personally think its well deserved based on the quality of most of those books. They were doing pretty well prior to that with new releases like GotG, Superior Spider-man, Infinity, X-men, Uncanny X-men, Age of Ultron, and the like. They seem to be gaining steam from the secondary market now relative to a year of 2 ago. Gwenpool, Spider-Gwen, Squirrel Girl, Ms. Marvel, Deadpool and others have drawn a lot more attention than any new Image book I can think of that came out this year.

 

Monstress looks to be a hit but issue #3 sold about as many copies as East of West #24. In fact, of the Image issues listed earlier in the thread, all except Monstress and Descender #1 can be found in multiples of 25 or more at Midtown. Even the titles that had an 8,000 copy print run. This is the 1st February in recent memory that I can recall that being the case. It appears that these books are collecting dust. Part of that could be the quality of the books relative to previous years. Monstress did go to a 3rd print but nothing else really sticks out.

 

Having backstock on the shelf is nice but its unimaginable that their goal at Image was to have books from October and November available in large quantities 3 to 4 months later, isn't it ? If they really want to change the market, they might work on getting books out on an as advertised schedule.

 

One last thing I've noticed. In every article, ES mentions all of the wonderful books and the talent which I agree, he has it. He seems to fail to mention Hickman, Dragotta, or East of West. Of books in the Image catalog that have made it to 20 issues, it is their 3rd best selling title. Is there a rift that and is that due to the delays or what caused them ? Anyone with inside info on the matter ?

 

+1

 

You can also add in the fact that Image continues to put out new #1s which bump up initial sales and see a quick fall off as the quality of most is average at best (with some being unreadable). Image is producing too many sub-standard titles that fall off fast once the #1 speculative hype fades.

 

[Nexus]

Real talk:

 

http://icv2.com/articles/columns/view/33774/eric-stephenson-calls-revolutionary-transformation-comicspro

[james1miller]

Did Image completely stop releasing incentive variants and retailer variants?

 

I think they did around July 2015.

 

Does anyone know of any incentive variants or retailer variants released since they announced (around July 2015 I think) they were stopping or cutting way back on them?

 

Walking Dead 150 is Skybound so I guess Kirkman can do what he wants. But 150 only had one 1/0 incentive variant. The rest were regular cover price variants if you preordered.

 

 

WRT WD 150, it depends on what you consider the Ottley, Latour and Moore variants that were announced late to be. Sure, they were print to order, but aren't they still variants?

 

Yes they are still variants. But they are not incentive variants or retailer variants.

 

ES is talking about retailer and incentive variants specifically in his speech and trying to cut way back on them or cut them out completely. I don't really like equal ratio regular price variants either but I guess they don't "pad" the numbers as much as retailer or incentive variants do or sort of encourage smaller shops to order more copies of an issue, that they might not be able to sell or won't sell, just to qualify for a 1 and 50 or 1 and 100 incentive variant.

[jreezy]

Having backstock on the shelf is nice but its unimaginable that their goal at Image was to have books from October and November available in large quantities 3 to 4 months later, isn't it ?

 

It is? What creator WOULDN'T want their work available 3 to 4 to 12 months after it originally came out?

 

If I walk into a Book store and want a book by Chuck Palahniuk, whatever his latest work is will be on the shelf for over a year and maybe longer....

 

 

The kind trying to sell through and go to a 2nd printing.

 

If comic shops were like bookstores, maybe it could see it. Even more so if they were 2nd or later prints. I doubt anyone wants their 1st printing of a book sitting in the discount pile or the $1 box. Maybe I'm wrong and they consider it good exposure.

 

I wish kurtis wiebe still posted on the forums. He can confirm if he would prefer Peter panzerfaust or rat queens be available 4 months after release date.

 

Of course they would.

 

Really? I remember Kurtis saying that he was barely making enough to keep Peter panzerfaust going due to the small print runs. I think image's compensation compared to marvel or DC is different. I guess it's a trade off dealing with their own intellectual property and having the freedom to do what they want creatively? Creators at image would probably rather have books sell out at retailers versus books sitting on the shelf for months waiting for it to be discovered by future readers? Image has had a history of doing subsequent printings anyway with some books going as high as 5th printing.

 

Also, if readers do want to jump on board to discover books like Monstress , Saga or Peter Panzerfaust they can purchase image firsts? Don't they still do that?

 

 

[Jaydogrules]

Did Image completely stop releasing incentive variants and retailer variants?

 

I think they did around July 2015.

 

Does anyone know of any incentive variants or retailer variants released since they announced (around July 2015 I think) they were stopping or cutting way back on them?

 

Walking Dead 150 is Skybound so I guess Kirkman can do what he wants. But 150 only had one 1/0 incentive variant. The rest were regular cover price variants if you preordered.

 

 

WRT WD 150, it depends on what you consider the Ottley, Latour and Moore variants that were announced late to be. Sure, they were print to order, but aren't they still variants?

 

Yes they are still variants. But they are not incentive variants or retailer variants.

 

ES is talking about retailer and incentive variants specifically in his speech and trying to cut way back on them or cut them out completely. I don't really like equal ratio regular price variants either but I guess they don't "pad" the numbers as much as retailer or incentive variants do or sort of encourage smaller shops to order more copies of an issue, that they might not be able to sell or won't sell, just to qualify for a 1 and 50 or 1 and 100 incentive variant.

 

Retailers don't have to "pad" anything. If they don't want to qualify for the variants no one is forcing them to up their orders.

 

What this is actually about is depriving higher volume retailers from having the option of ordering the variants as well, so that small time shops don't feel the pressure to up their orders to compete on a larger scale. So nobody should be able to order a variant because a small time retailer feels butt-hurt about not having enough of a customer base to justify ordering enough books to qualify ?

 

That is just unnecessary and inappropriate.

 

-J.

[the authority]

Having backstock on the shelf is nice but its unimaginable that their goal at Image was to have books from October and November available in large quantities 3 to 4 months later, isn't it ?

 

It is? What creator WOULDN'T want their work available 3 to 4 to 12 months after it originally came out?

 

If I walk into a Book store and want a book by Chuck Palahniuk, whatever his latest work is will be on the shelf for over a year and maybe longer....

 

 

The kind trying to sell through and go to a 2nd printing.

 

If comic shops were like bookstores, maybe it could see it. Even more so if they were 2nd or later prints. I doubt anyone wants their 1st printing of a book sitting in the discount pile or the $1 box. Maybe I'm wrong and they consider it good exposure.

 

I wish kurtis wiebe still posted on the forums. He can confirm if he would prefer Peter panzerfaust or rat queens be available 4 months after release date.

 

Of course they would.

 

Really? I remember Kurtis saying that he was barely making enough to keep Peter panzerfaust going due to the small print runs. I think image's compensation compared to marvel or DC is different. I guess it's a trade off dealing with their own intellectual property and having the freedom to do what they want creatively? Creators at image would probably rather have books sell out at retailers versus books sitting on the shelf for months waiting for it to be discovered by future readers? Image has had a history of doing subsequent printings anyway with some books going as high as 5th printing.

 

Also, if readers do want to jump on board to discover books like Monstress , Saga or Peter Panzerfaust they can purchase image firsts? Don't they still do that?

 

 

They do...and they're considerably cheaper than the originals. Image is pushing numbers stating that there are x number of issues and there are but they are sitting on shelves. Explain the need for a 2nd printing of We Stand on Guard ( which is put out by Image heavy hitter BKV ) and maybe I'll buy the product is selling well at the retail store level.

 

We Stand on Guard #1 is available by the hundreds yet they have additional printings.

 

http://www.midtowncomics.com/store/search.asp?pl=16&q=We+stand+on+guard

 

And you can literally buy the 1st print #1, 100 copies at a time at DCBS at a discount from cover price 7 months after it came out. The numbers on Comichron and Icv2 look great but are they real ?

[james1miller]

Real talk:

 

http://icv2.com/articles/columns/view/33774/eric-stephenson-calls-revolutionary-transformation-comicspro

 

Good stuff.

[the authority]

Real talk:

 

http://icv2.com/articles/columns/view/33774/eric-stephenson-calls-revolutionary-transformation-comicspro

 

Good stuff.

 

 

The writer took a condescending tone in the article with comments like readers and customers and trying to separate the 2 types of customers. Most of us happen to be both. Another comment that leads me to disregard any argument this guy would present in those with less discerning tastes. Really ? So he knows what you find enjoyable and worthy of reading ? Have him order your food, pick your car, and clothes in your wardrobe while he's at it.

 

 

[ygogolak]

Real talk:

 

http://icv2.com/articles/columns/view/33774/eric-stephenson-calls-revolutionary-transformation-comicspro

 

Good stuff.

 

 

The writer took a condescending tone in the article with comments like readers and customers and trying to separate the 2 types of customers. Most of us happen to be both. Another comment that leads me to disregard any argument this guy would present in those with less discerning tastes. Really ? So he knows what you find enjoyable and worthy of reading ? Have him order your food, pick your car, and clothes in your wardrobe while he's at it.

 

 

Do you think this was the writers opinion or his interpretation of ES?

In other words, people who want good comics have lots of places to go, but the people who want “bad comics” (variants, gimmicks and the like) have to shop at the comic store.

 

I ask because just as there are people who buy a comic for the story, there are people that buy a comic because of the artwork. There are a number of artists who ONLY do cover work now. Just like completionist's for a series, there are people who want all of an artists work.

[the authority]

Real talk:

 

http://icv2.com/articles/columns/view/33774/eric-stephenson-calls-revolutionary-transformation-comicspro

 

Good stuff.

 

 

The writer took a condescending tone in the article with comments like readers and customers and trying to separate the 2 types of customers. Most of us happen to be both. Another comment that leads me to disregard any argument this guy would present in those with less discerning tastes. Really ? So he knows what you find enjoyable and worthy of reading ? Have him order your food, pick your car, and clothes in your wardrobe while he's at it.

 

 

Do you think this was the writers opinion or his interpretation of ES?

In other words, people who want good comics have lots of places to go, but the people who want “bad comics” (variants, gimmicks and the like) have to shop at the comic store.

 

I ask because just as there are people who buy a comic for the story, there are people that buy a comic because of the artwork. There are a number of artists who ONLY do cover work now. Just like completionist's for a series, there are people who want all of an artists work.

 

It seemed to me that his opinion was largely the same as ES. In my collection, its all about the stories and art. I don't have the RRP for East of West #1, even though its my favorite book. I'd rather read 100 new issues for than invest my money in a book for a cover. I'm even selling off my original art to certain books because it just isn't me. I'm a story and character driven collector. I feel and know even, that i don't speak for everybody on anybody else for that matter on what is good for them to spend their money on. The problem I have with the writer and ES is that they seem to think they know what we should be buying than we do. Choices are great. I'm sure many people at DC and Marvel thought we shouldn't be buying and reading Image books when they opened shop. They didn't get what we liked either imo.

 

 

 

Edited February 24, 2016 by The Authority

[rjrjr]

 

Image's unit share growth appears to have been roughly the same until the steep drop in 2015 which coincides with their decision to take the variants away from retailers. I'd be willing to wager that this continues in 2016. Marvel had substantial growth the same year.

 

While I'm not a fan of variants per se, I'm a huge fan of choice and options. Incentivized books may not do much for Image but I still believe it helped the retailers who took the time to help create, market, and ultimately sell the final product. It simply seems odd to me that the guy in charge worries and feels the need to "equal" everything out. Is he also going to go to the LCS and make sure they hold books for people so that everyone gets one ?

 

Marvel is having an excellent run with Star Wars and I personally think its well deserved based on the quality of most of those books. They were doing pretty well prior to that with new releases like GotG, Superior Spider-man, Infinity, X-men, Uncanny X-men, Age of Ultron, and the like. They seem to be gaining steam from the secondary market now relative to a year of 2 ago. Gwenpool, Spider-Gwen, Squirrel Girl, Ms. Marvel, Deadpool and others have drawn a lot more attention than any new Image book I can think of that came out this year.

 

Monstress looks to be a hit but issue #3 sold about as many copies as East of West #24. In fact, of the Image issues listed earlier in the thread, all except Monstress and Descender #1 can be found in multiples of 25 or more at Midtown. Even the titles that had an 8,000 copy print run. This is the 1st February in recent memory that I can recall that being the case. It appears that these books are collecting dust. Part of that could be the quality of the books relative to previous years. Monstress did go to a 3rd print but nothing else really sticks out.

 

Having backstock on the shelf is nice but its unimaginable that their goal at Image was to have books from October and November available in large quantities 3 to 4 months later, isn't it ? If they really want to change the market, they might work on getting books out on an as advertised schedule.

 

One last thing I've noticed. In every article, ES mentions all of the wonderful books and the talent which I agree, he has it. He seems to fail to mention Hickman, Dragotta, or East of West. Of books in the Image catalog that have made it to 20 issues, it is their 3rd best selling title. Is there a rift that and is that due to the delays or what caused them ? Anyone with inside info on the matter ?

 

+1

 

You can also add in the fact that Image continues to put out new #1s which bump up initial sales and see a quick fall off as the quality of most is average at best (with some being unreadable). Image is producing too many sub-standard titles that fall off fast once the #1 speculative hype fades.

 

That seems true of all publishers, not just Image though. There is a reason Marvel, DC, etc. are constantly restarting their titles at #1.

Edited February 25, 2016 by rjrjr

[rjrjr]

Real talk:

 

http://icv2.com/articles/columns/view/33774/eric-stephenson-calls-revolutionary-transformation-comicspro

 

Good stuff.

 

 

The writer took a condescending tone in the article with comments like readers and customers and trying to separate the 2 types of customers. Most of us happen to be both. Another comment that leads me to disregard any argument this guy would present in those with less discerning tastes. Really ? So he knows what you find enjoyable and worthy of reading ? Have him order your food, pick your car, and clothes in your wardrobe while he's at it.

 

 

Do you think this was the writers opinion or his interpretation of ES?

In other words, people who want good comics have lots of places to go, but the people who want “bad comics” (variants, gimmicks and the like) have to shop at the comic store.

 

I ask because just as there are people who buy a comic for the story, there are people that buy a comic because of the artwork. There are a number of artists who ONLY do cover work now. Just like completionist's for a series, there are people who want all of an artists work.

 

It seemed to me that his opinion was largely the same as ES. In my collection, its all about the stories and art. I don't have the RRP for East of West #1, even though its my favorite book. I'd rather read 100 new issues for than invest my money in a book for a cover. I'm even selling off my original art to certain books because it just isn't me. I'm a story and character driven collector. I feel and know even, that i don't speak for everybody on anybody else for that matter on what is good for them to spend their money on. The problem I have with the writer and ES is that they seem to think they know what we should be buying than we do. Choices are great. I'm sure many people at DC and Marvel thought we shouldn't be buying and reading Image books when they opened shop. They didn't get what we liked either imo.

 

 

 

I like choice too, which is why I wish publishers would just move to the model where comic shops can order any of the variants they can sell. No incentives. I want to be able to buy the covers I like, but the publishers make it prohibitively expensive for me to do so. I could care less if a cover is a 1 of 10, 1 of 20, or 1 of 1000. I want to be able to buy the covers I like without paying through the nose for them.

[Jaydogrules]

Real talk:

 

http://icv2.com/articles/columns/view/33774/eric-stephenson-calls-revolutionary-transformation-comicspro

 

Good stuff.

 

 

The writer took a condescending tone in the article with comments like readers and customers and trying to separate the 2 types of customers. Most of us happen to be both. Another comment that leads me to disregard any argument this guy would present in those with less discerning tastes. Really ? So he knows what you find enjoyable and worthy of reading ? Have him order your food, pick your car, and clothes in your wardrobe while he's at it.

 

 

Do you think this was the writers opinion or his interpretation of ES?

In other words, people who want good comics have lots of places to go, but the people who want “bad comics” (variants, gimmicks and the like) have to shop at the comic store.

 

I ask because just as there are people who buy a comic for the story, there are people that buy a comic because of the artwork. There are a number of artists who ONLY do cover work now. Just like completionist's for a series, there are people who want all of an artists work.

 

It seemed to me that his opinion was largely the same as ES. In my collection, its all about the stories and art. I don't have the RRP for East of West #1, even though its my favorite book. I'd rather read 100 new issues for than invest my money in a book for a cover. I'm even selling off my original art to certain books because it just isn't me. I'm a story and character driven collector. I feel and know even, that i don't speak for everybody on anybody else for that matter on what is good for them to spend their money on. The problem I have with the writer and ES is that they seem to think they know what we should be buying than we do. Choices are great. I'm sure many people at DC and Marvel thought we shouldn't be buying and reading Image books when they opened shop. They didn't get what we liked either imo.

 

 

 

I like choice too, which is why I wish publishers would just move to the model where comic shops can order any of the variants they can sell. No incentives. I want to be able to buy the covers I like, but the publishers make it prohibitively expensive for me to do so. I could care less if a cover is a 1 of 10, 1 of 20, or 1 of 1000. I want to be able to buy the covers I like without paying through the nose for them.

 

I want to be able to buy a Tec 27 without paying through the nose for one too. I would also like to buy a Picasso lithograph on the cheap. Or a bottle of Dom Perignon. But I can't. The overwhelming majority of variants that are released aren't worth much more than cover price regardless of they're initial ratio upon release. The ones that are become so due to the same market forces that determine "value" of every other collectible- supply and demand.

 

-J.

 

 

[Iceman399]

Real talk:

 

http://icv2.com/articles/columns/view/33774/eric-stephenson-calls-revolutionary-transformation-comicspro

 

Good stuff.

 

 

The writer took a condescending tone in the article with comments like readers and customers and trying to separate the 2 types of customers. Most of us happen to be both. Another comment that leads me to disregard any argument this guy would present in those with less discerning tastes. Really ? So he knows what you find enjoyable and worthy of reading ? Have him order your food, pick your car, and clothes in your wardrobe while he's at it.

 

 

Do you think this was the writers opinion or his interpretation of ES?

In other words, people who want good comics have lots of places to go, but the people who want “bad comics” (variants, gimmicks and the like) have to shop at the comic store.

 

I ask because just as there are people who buy a comic for the story, there are people that buy a comic because of the artwork. There are a number of artists who ONLY do cover work now. Just like completionist's for a series, there are people who want all of an artists work.

 

It seemed to me that his opinion was largely the same as ES. In my collection, its all about the stories and art. I don't have the RRP for East of West #1, even though its my favorite book. I'd rather read 100 new issues for than invest my money in a book for a cover. I'm even selling off my original art to certain books because it just isn't me. I'm a story and character driven collector. I feel and know even, that i don't speak for everybody on anybody else for that matter on what is good for them to spend their money on. The problem I have with the writer and ES is that they seem to think they know what we should be buying than we do. Choices are great. I'm sure many people at DC and Marvel thought we shouldn't be buying and reading Image books when they opened shop. They didn't get what we liked either imo.

 

 

 

I like choice too, which is why I wish publishers would just move to the model where comic shops can order any of the variants they can sell. No incentives. I want to be able to buy the covers I like, but the publishers make it prohibitively expensive for me to do so. I could care less if a cover is a 1 of 10, 1 of 20, or 1 of 1000. I want to be able to buy the covers I like without paying through the nose for them.

 

I want to be able to buy a Tec 27 without paying through the nose for one too. I would also like to buy a Picasso lithograph on the cheap. Or a bottle of Dom Perignon. But I can't. The overwhelming majority of variants that are released aren't worth much more than cover price regardless of they're initial ratio upon release. The ones that are become so due to the same market forces that determine "value" of every other collectible- supply and demand.

 

-J.

 

 

Apples to helmets.

 

Can you show me some variants where the reason a variant cover took off that didn't have a ratio that took off for being a better cover and not based on "rarity" or some other determining factor?

[ygogolak]

 

I want to be able to buy a Tec 27 without paying through the nose for one too. I would also like to buy a Picasso lithograph on the cheap. Or a bottle of Dom Perignon. But I can't. The overwhelming majority of variants that are released aren't worth much more than cover price regardless of they're initial ratio upon release. The ones that are become so due to the same market forces that determine "value" of every other collectible- supply and demand.

 

-J.

 

 

Apples to helmets.

 

Can you show me some variants where the reason a variant cover took off that didn't have a ratio that took off for being a better cover and not based on "rarity" or some other determining factor?

 

Huh, can you show me any comic that has done that?

[Iceman399]

 

I want to be able to buy a Tec 27 without paying through the nose for one too. I would also like to buy a Picasso lithograph on the cheap. Or a bottle of Dom Perignon. But I can't. The overwhelming majority of variants that are released aren't worth much more than cover price regardless of they're initial ratio upon release. The ones that are become so due to the same market forces that determine "value" of every other collectible- supply and demand.

 

-J.

 

 

Apples to helmets.

 

Can you show me some variants where the reason a variant cover took off that didn't have a ratio that took off for being a better cover and not based on "rarity" or some other determining factor?

 

Huh, can you show me any comic that has done that?

 

Not sure if my wording is off, or if you are confused as to my point.

 

I can't think of a single 1:1 variant that took off (a book with multiple covers that 1 cover took off simply because it was better than the rest). The variants that do take off are associated with manufactured rarity.

 

There are all kinds of books that take off that don't have rarity simply because of their cover art.

[WoWitHurts]

 

I want to be able to buy a Tec 27 without paying through the nose for one too. I would also like to buy a Picasso lithograph on the cheap. Or a bottle of Dom Perignon. But I can't. The overwhelming majority of variants that are released aren't worth much more than cover price regardless of they're initial ratio upon release. The ones that are become so due to the same market forces that determine "value" of every other collectible- supply and demand.

 

-J.

 

 

Apples to helmets.

 

Can you show me some variants where the reason a variant cover took off that didn't have a ratio that took off for being a better cover and not based on "rarity" or some other determining factor?

 

Huh, can you show me any comic that has done that?

 

Not sure if my wording is off, or if you are confused as to my point.

 

I can't think of a single 1:1 variant that took off (a book with multiple covers that 1 cover took off simply because it was better than the rest). The variants that do take off are associated with manufactured rarity.

 

There are all kinds of books that take off that don't have rarity simply because of their cover art.

 

Does it not really boil down to popularity/demand versus supply? Rarity alone does not dictate worth.

 

Sometimes the demand for a variant comes from completionists wanting it for their collection regardless of how it looks. Or people who collect variants in general. Yes they are manufactured rarity but so is anything where demand outstrips supply.

 

I was an ASM collector and pursued all variants until recently. It got to be cost prohibitive to continue so I sold all of my variants save for ASM 667 Dell otto and 678 Venom cover. So from my point of view Marvel killed it for me and made it impossible to collect what I wanted to collect. So I stopped.

[Iceman399]

 

I want to be able to buy a Tec 27 without paying through the nose for one too. I would also like to buy a Picasso lithograph on the cheap. Or a bottle of Dom Perignon. But I can't. The overwhelming majority of variants that are released aren't worth much more than cover price regardless of they're initial ratio upon release. The ones that are become so due to the same market forces that determine "value" of every other collectible- supply and demand.

 

-J.

 

 

Apples to helmets.

 

Can you show me some variants where the reason a variant cover took off that didn't have a ratio that took off for being a better cover and not based on "rarity" or some other determining factor?

 

Huh, can you show me any comic that has done that?

 

Not sure if my wording is off, or if you are confused as to my point.

 

I can't think of a single 1:1 variant that took off (a book with multiple covers that 1 cover took off simply because it was better than the rest). The variants that do take off are associated with manufactured rarity.

 

There are all kinds of books that take off that don't have rarity simply because of their cover art.

 

Does it not really boil down to popularity/demand versus supply? Rarity alone does not dictate worth.

 

Sometimes the demand for a variant comes from completionists wanting it for their collection regardless of how it looks. Or people who collect variants in general. Yes they are manufactured rarity but so is anything where demand outstrips supply.

 

I was an ASM collector and pursued all variants until recently. It got to be cost prohibitive to continue so I sold all of my variants save for ASM 667 Dell otto and 678 Venom cover. So from my point of view Marvel killed it for me and made it impossible to collect what I wanted to collect. So I stopped.

 

Of course. Popularity! That is often what causes a book to skyrocket.

 

However as Chuck and Image have suggested, get away from this idea of forcing retailers to buy these other books in order to qualify for the "rare" books. Print copies that end up being used as giveaways because the store wants to keep their one local customer super happy and get in the 1:200 rare variant, which leaves the store with 125 copies of a book they won't sell. If the 667 variant was a 1:1 ratio with the other cover at the time you would have both right now, you would have 2 copies of 667 simply because you wanted both covers. Now you can't because you have been priced out of the market by a retailer incentive book