Persistent Ebayer wants to deal privately

[Turtle]

Almost always make my offers privately - especially on more expensive books. I usually offer just a bit more than they would walk away with after eBay fees. I get a better deal and the seller gets more money and everyone's happy..ebay makes enough money nickel and diming . I see no issue with it as long as the communication is polite. If the answer is "no" then the answer is "no". If I don't get a response I suspect the seller is uncomfortable with it and I don't ask again. I sell my items the same way .

 

I've never understood this argument. People use this argument when pirating movies, software, etc. too. I'm pretty sure I've heard this argument for the Paypal Personal argument, as well.

 

Since when is it up to the consumer to determine when a business has made sufficient money that it is now ok to break their terms of service but use the service anyway...in effect stealing from them?

 

I usually ignore these offers. Maybe I'm making assumptions, but these offers often use "text speak" ("u" instead of "you", "pls" instead of "please", for example) and that just leads me to believe they're often members of a younger generation.

 

Rationalize away...it's still wrong.

[october]

I get a ton of those messages. I never respond. They are a pretty big nuisance actually.

 

PP is also right about the garbled English.

[MetalPSI]

Garbled is putting it mildly

[HarveySwick]

If I see a book on eBay, I will always email the seller and ask if they're a member here.

 

1) I like to know who I'm dealing with if possible and 2) I can PM the seller here and try to work out a deal minus fees.

[GM8]

Dealing off ebay is a win/win if both buyer and seller are comfortable with it. The first time I was offered to trade this way I was annoyed and turned them down right away. Then when I thought about it, the seller gets lower fees and I get a lower price with paypal protection - good deal. So long as the other party has a lot of great feedback I will do these transactions if prompted.

 

As far as ethics, its not right of course. Ebay doesn't get their 10% +, which is ridiculous but that's besides the point. They were the middle men so they deserve the fee.

 

In the end, ebay sees this as a cost of doing business. That's why they monitor all communications and reject messages where information is exchanged to facilitate these deals. That's also why they charge such high fees to make up for the losses due to "off market" transactions.

 

I consider it useful in moderation.

[roscoPcoltrane]

I get it..nothing is black and white and everyone on this planet has a moral gauge they navigate with. "Wrong" is such a subjective term that we all use to justify our actions on the small stuff while judging others recklessly . It's "wrong" that he takes home work supplies for his kids..it's "wrong" that he coasts through stop signs...it's "wrong" that he adds a little extra to his expenses at tax time or is milking welfare in his new Mercedes ? Sure, they're all violations of some policy or law. Do I steal or scam tax payers with welfare loopholes or even scam people on Ebay..never. Where do i draw the line on ethical behavior ...probably much quicker than most ...I have a moral compass that I look at every day in the mirror. I actually give away more comics to people with less than me than I save with my off site purchases.

Ebay is a tool...that's all. There are fees to use it and it opens up a whole new world that didn't exist 20 yrs ago. People were running scams since the dawn of time and its the chance you take whenever you buy from someone you know nothing about. But I see zero issue with saving a few hundred dollars and still paying a fair price where everyone's happy (even Ebay while still assessing their fees somewhere). Nobody pays asking price for anything in life..not cars, houses or comics. Is Ebay losing 12% of their potential net earnings..sure..are they still making money hand over fist..yes. Who am I to decide they've made enough ? nobody special, but if there is a tool that allows me to access things that I want and I can get them at a good price with a happy seller then i will continue to do so .

some people have to follow every rule no matter how small, some bend them and some break them...at the end of the day, do i really waste time complaining about who's scamming whom? nah, I look for opportunity to enjoy something at a reasonable cost to me then I hug my kids and enjoy my life. If the hammer drops, i simply step out of the way and move forward. I don't screw Jonny Q. Seller and if I get screwed..good for you ..you got me.

[krighton]

you're not 100% guaranteed to get your money back just because you pay with paypal. I had a guy never send his item but he drained all his accounts on paypal and I got nothing.

[Keysnruns]

Here is a recent off eBay scam that happened to me. I sold 2 high grade books, an early ASM and a Doc strange 169. The buyer convince me to sell off eBay, he took the books, then immediately complained that one book was retouched. I told him I would only take back the entire sale, of both books, not just one. After that, radio silence. It turns out he filed a PayPal dispute for which PayPal then echoed my requirements, to send back both books.

 

But guess what... he sent back retouched lower grade of the exact same issues. The moment the books arrived, which was confirmed by tracking information, PayPal automatically refunded my buyer the entire amount of his sale even though he returned to me nearly worthless books.

 

I had to file an Internet crime complaint (IC3) and go through several weeks of negotiations with PayPal (including filing an appraisal of the returned books) to finally get refunded.. So while the PayPal dispute process supports both parties, it by default supports the buyer much more than the seller. I did get my money back, most of it anyway, but beware that the off eBayer's are maybe trying to scam you by replacing your high grade books with garbage and waiting to see if they can keep the difference. Looking forward to staying on eBay more.

[InvstmntComcSuply]

You dance with the one who brung ya

[KPR Comics]

Compartmentalize, rationalize, justify all you want, making the deal off site is wrong. Ebay fees too high? Really. for 10-12% you reach thousands, tens of thousands, potentially millions of people. And to do that, it takes all of a minute to type in a description and upload pictures. It's a convenience fee that in my opinion, is worth every penny.

 

[Vger7]

Right or wrong based on what? Man made laws don't necessarily mean these rules are moral, and certainly not the laws from a corporation who's rules are set up so that they can make as much money as they can... Well you know what? I want to make as much money as I can as well.

 

It's an individual decision but keep in mind that eBay and PayPal is a cash cow. They make additional money off your listings that you paid for by way of ads. Like most stuff on the web, our comments, our activity and our eBay listings IS the content.

 

EBay and PayPal is also a monopoly, which in itself is unethical... according to the law anyways. The other much smaller auction sites may help validate eBay, but it's all a technicality because, lets face it... eBay has no real competition. Craigslist? Kijiji? Maybe, but they are also partly owned by eBay because that's what monopolies do. All this means is that eBay and PayPal is allowed to make up bogus fees. How much is too much?

[Jeffro.]

Compartmentalize, rationalize, justify all you want, making the deal off site is wrong. Ebay fees too high? Really. for 10-12% you reach thousands, tens of thousands, potentially millions of people. And to do that, it takes all of a minute to type in a description and upload pictures. It's a convenience fee that in my opinion, is worth every penny.

 

The first time I sold a bunch of stuff on ebay and got my first invoice from ebay indicating how much they were charging me, I almost fell off my chair. However, I agree with everything you said. There really is no market like ebay. If you want to play, you have to pay.

 

[roscoPcoltrane]

fair enough KP

[Jeffro.]

Right or wrong based on what? Man made laws don't necessarily mean these rules are moral, and certainly not the laws from a corporation who's rules are set up so that they can make as much money as they can... Well you know what? I want to make as much money as I can as well.

 

It's an individual decision but keep in mind that eBay and PayPal is a cash cow. They make additional money off your listings that you paid for by way of ads. Like most stuff on the web, our comments, our activity and our eBay listings IS the content.

 

EBay and PayPal is also a monopoly, which in itself is unethical... according to the law anyways. The other much smaller auction sites may help validate eBay, but it's all a technicality because, lets face it... eBay has no real competition. Craigslist? Kijiji? Maybe, but they are also partly owned by eBay because that's what monopolies do. All this means is that eBay and PayPal is allowed to make up bogus fees. How much is too much?

 

Be that as it may, when you sign up for ebay, you agree to their terms of service and their rules.

[Turtle]

 

EBay and PayPal is also a monopoly, which in itself is unethical...

 

[Vger7]

Right or wrong based on what? Man made laws don't necessarily mean these rules are moral, and certainly not the laws from a corporation who's rules are set up so that they can make as much money as they can... Well you know what? I want to make as much money as I can as well.

 

It's an individual decision but keep in mind that eBay and PayPal is a cash cow. They make additional money off your listings that you paid for by way of ads. Like most stuff on the web, our comments, our activity and our eBay listings IS the content.

 

EBay and PayPal is also a monopoly, which in itself is unethical... according to the law anyways. The other much smaller auction sites may help validate eBay, but it's all a technicality because, lets face it... eBay has no real competition. Craigslist? Kijiji? Maybe, but they are also partly owned by eBay because that's what monopolies do. All this means is that eBay and PayPal is allowed to make up bogus fees. How much is too much?

 

Be that as it may, when you sign up for ebay, you agree to their terms of service and their rules.

 

But being a monopoly means we have no choice but to sign up if we want to buy and sell our books. Being in a position of power does not make ones actions just. Lest you think that Prince John was a more ethical person than Robin Hood. I'm not saying I'm Robin Hood but there is a difference between morals versus laws, especially if those laws are paid for by corporations.

[Turtle]

I get it..nothing is black and white and everyone on this planet has a moral gauge they navigate with. "Wrong" is such a subjective term

 

Ok...how about this:

 

Rationalize away...it's still against the terms of service to which you agreed.

 

I have a moral compass that I look at every day in the mirror.

 

Ok, I know it wasn't your intention, but this one caught me. If you did this, wouldn't you go in the complete opposite direction of where you wanted to go...metaphorically speaking?

[Turtle]

But being a monopoly means we have no choice but to sign up if we want to buy and sell our books. Being in a position of power does not make ones actions just. Lest you think that Prince John was a more ethical person than Robin Hood. I'm not saying I'm Robin Hood but there is a difference between morals versus laws, especially if those laws are paid for by corporations.

 

I think you're still missing it.

 

Monopoly - exclusive control of a commodity or service in a particular market, or a control that makes possible the manipulation of prices.

 

You are free to buy/sell books on a multitude of different sites and avoid ebay altogether. By definitition, Ebay is not a monopoly.

[KPR Comics]

How is ebay a monopoly? There are plenty of other avenues to sell. HA, Clink, facebook (ugh), MCS, CS Boards, cons, craigslist, your own website, consignment, ...

I get that you don't like their fees, but casting ebay as some evil, morally bankrupt corporation, is misplaced. And saying that it's ok to cheat their system b/c they're a profit seeking body is misguided.

[Doohickamabob]

Here's the offer I find annoying:

 

"Hello I want to buy your item but I can't bid because I'm traveling so can you make me a deal?"