Persistent Ebayer wants to deal privately

[Vger7]

Not true. If the issues from the music industry has revealed anything, it is that the workers get paid the same no matter how much profits a corporation brings in.

Profits go down, people lose jobs.

 

Except that eBay profits are not going down. They've been level for the longest time... but still not good enough for the shareholders which is why they spun off PayPal for those who want higher yield.

[Vger7]

Whoa... correction. Ebay is doing better than it's ever been:

 

http://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=EBAY+Interactive#symbol=EBAY;range=my

[Doohickamabob]

Not true. When eBay raises their prices, it's primarily for the sake of pleasing the shareholders, not to make up lost $$ from direct sales. It's hard to say how much $$ we are talking about but I can't imagine that the occasional direct sale would amount to much, especially when 95% of my sales do follow policy.

"Pleasing the shareholders" is another way of saying "maintaining profits." In any company, "shrink" or other areas of profit loss can add up, and they take it seriously enough to hire new workers and set up new departments just to offset it. You're right that it's a small percentage of the big number, but for billion-dollar companies those small percentage points really add up.

 

As well eBay is primarily a service, not a product so there isn't much in the way of rising cost to justify price hikes.

I'm not sure how this makes a big difference for your purposes, but it does highlight the analogy between stealing or shoplifting a material good versus the inherent theft of avoiding fees for a service already rendered. Regarding the price hikes being tied to profit loss from fee avoidance, or for any other company that factors in "shrink," I realize this is part of a bigger picture of how companies look at their profit/loss scenario, but it still plays a factor in the equation.

 

They also outsource to the third world. Is eBay unAmerican or unethical themselves for giving jobs to foreign workers? How about if these workers are underpaid? Don't answer this... I don't want us to get side track but it's food for thought.

You brought it up but don't want it discussed... Okay... It's a political question at this point, but pretty much most of corporate America has been part of this, and unfortunately that means many of them feel they have to be part of the process (of shipping jobs overseas) in order to stay competitive. Naturally a great many of them had a hand in lobbying for the trade laws etc. that made this possible at this scale. Unfortunately what you're also getting into here is the "two wrongs make a right" thought process that others have already brought up. If I use a company's services and I know that company has done things that are questionable, do I as an individual feel justified in taking advantage of the company in ways that I would find unethical if the company's past and present behaviors were above-board? Why would I let this question affect my behavior one way or another? My own decisions about ethics are not relativistic that way. It seems like you're arguing that people's personal ethics should incorporate situational relativism based on judgments about the parties with whom they're dealing.

 

The occupy wall street was a valid response from the masses. But the masses don't have the resources to combat inequality. The masses are unorganized but remain free to express themselves. Weather they choose fee avoidance or opt out of eBay all together to communicate their discontent is an individual choice.

Politics.... And I probably agree with you on some of this... But I will say that when a person avoids paying fees for a service, or violates pretty sensible company policies, that person probably shouldn't congratulate themselves much for stickin' it to the man.

 

• Many buyers have reneged on deals with me, but... because they are people, and it's only comics, and people often change their minds, I don't over react. I don't accuse them of being evil or slam them because they changed their mind. Yes, it's annoying but that's all it is.

Yep -- it's annoying...

 

They know this which is why they have a tolerance. Even back end deals do contribute to eBay's appeal and they still make money from our listings. Fee avoidance is just one perspective. But often, that 10% is all that's needed to complete sale. So if a direct deal happens, both seller and buyer are happy and will be back giving eBay more activity, most of which are well within their policy.The result is that they'll be able to sell more ads.

That's one way to look at it. Though I find that if 10% by making an off-site deal is what's needed to complete a sale, most of the time I could just as easily wait for another buyer to come along who is fine with the setup as it is. Also, maybe you can save a few bucks here and there by repeatedly making off-site deals, but there's going to be that one scam buyer who comes along and rips you off for a chunk of change, taking advantage of the lower transparency and reduced consequences of the situation, and that one ripoff will offset much of the advantage of doing the outside deals. It's easier, from my perspective, to just play within the rules, lobby for improvements I think make the system suck less, rather than finding what I consider to be shady methods to cut corners.

 

 

[Jeffro.]

Whoa... correction. Ebay is doing better than it's ever been:

 

http://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=EBAY+Interactive#symbol=EBAY;range=my

 

You know what's weird, is when I click on Vger7's email link in his Sig Line is says his email is rave505@aim.com. But when I search the Board for that email, it shows current user "SAGAT" as having posted that this was his email address. Vger7, do you have 2 IDs on this Board? Do you share an email with someone?

 

Vger,

Are you probation list member, SAGAT?

 

[Doohickamabob]

Whoa... correction. Ebay is doing better than it's ever been:

http://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=EBAY+Interactive#symbol=EBAY;range=my

 

This is generally irrelevant since we're discussing the principle when applied in general rather than the current reality of a single company. The consequences of your own line of reasoning here eventually becomes, "If the company is doing well, the ethical equation surrounding how one interacts with that company changes."

 

[JAM_NYC]

Whoa... correction. Ebay is doing better than it's ever been:

 

http://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=EBAY+Interactive#symbol=EBAY;range=my

 

Are you probation list member, SAGAT?

[bcphillips119]

I think someone mentioned it earlier, but I would be interested to hear what those that have no issue with this think about someone asking for GPA data from someone else? Do you consider that wrong?

 

 

I pay for GPA monthly, it has helped me purchase several books. It even helps send offers to those on eBay who are priced over GPA.

[CAHokie]

 

Vger,

Are you probation list member, SAGAT?

 

And just like that, this thread got a lot more interesting.

[VintageComics]

Not true. If the issues from the music industry has revealed anything, it is that the workers get paid the same no matter how much profits a corporation brings in.

Profits go down, people lose jobs.

 

I find it shocking that so many people don't realize the relationship between expenses and prices. I don't think it always used to be that way. I think people used to think more of others than they do today. That sort of thinking is the reason why we can never have world peace. Everyone only thinks of themselves first and that is a race to zero.

 

I agree with Stu, eye for an eye would eventually leave everyone blind which is why nobody lives by that law anymore.

 

The more people skim illegally from companies the more it ends up costing everyone in the long run.

 

You have someone break into your car to steal the stereo so that you can make out with the insurance pay off because insurance companies are bad but this causes rates to go up so everyone pays for more, including you.

 

You steal people's music forcing artists to charge more for merchandise and tickets.

 

You skim sales off of eBay and they raise fees to make the same money.

 

Just because they factor business losses into the model does not mean it's OK to be responsible for those losses.

 

How much of our taxes just go towards paying the legal system to enforce the law? Every time you break a law, you're costing tax payers more money.

 

You don't pay your taxes because gubmint' is bad and they need to increase taxes to pay for all of the goods and service we receive from those taxes.

 

What was an eye opener for me was after watching Noam Chomsky's recent movie Requiem for the American Dream.

 

We enjoy terrific roads, welfare services for the poor, freedom, peaceful living and an infrastructure that keeps it all going. He said that when tax time comes, we should all be celebrating and wanting to pay our taxes to celebrate all of the terrific things those taxes pay for. Instead, people complain and try to avoid them. Why is that?

 

We've lost touch with reality.

[Buzzetta]

Roy, for the most part I agree. However in other instances, I feel that it has promoted positive change. Take music piracy. I believe that despite the numbers that the recording industry reports that the rampant online file sharing of music was healthier for music (as far as the artists were concerned.) Kanye West may have had the most stolen album last week but that also allowed his music and "brand" to reach a wider audience than if they had to pay for it. Kanye, despite his ego flaws, is a pretty smart guy given everything he has his hand in as more people are now exposed to other business ventures that he retains more control over than his music.

 

1 - Many people discovered music they would normally not have listened to.

2 - The old business model of how the recording industry was run is now ineffective in the face of how people acquire their music. People have drifted away from what was force-fed on the radio by Clear Channel and other media conglomerates. This forced longstanding artists to be more creative and gave a lot of smaller size bands a chance for a better opportunity to showcase their talent.

3 - Thanks to YouTube and other streaming sites both legal and illegal, I have even discovered new bands this year that I would never have heard of if not for which led me to either see them live or at least purchase their music.

 

 

[RidersRohan]

I think someone mentioned it earlier, but I would be interested to hear what those that have no issue with this think about someone asking for GPA data from someone else? Do you consider that wrong?

 

 

I pay for GPA monthly, it has helped me purchase several books. It even helps send offers to those on eBay who are priced over GPA.

 

What about sharing a GPA account with someone?

[Buzzetta]

 

What about sharing a GPA account with someone?

 

See now there are two takes on this.

 

1 - It is someone's research and property and you subscribe to an account which supplies you information from their research.

 

2 - It is news. If you have ever given someone the sports section, the classifieds, the market report or supplied any information from the newspaper, cut out a recipe from a magazine or provided any information from a publication then giving out a GPA quote should be reasonable similar.

 

 

[Junkdrawer]

If you go out of your way to avoid paying the fee for a service, then there's certainly a form of stealing going on.

Sometimes I avoid the toll road to avoid paying the toll. I drive a little extra but it never feels like stealing, but rather saving.

So you use Craigslist?

Not in the last 2 yrs

Well Craigslist would be the equivalent to what you wrote. Or some other service besides eBay. I'm talking about "avoiding the fee for a service that you've been using," not "avoiding the fee for a service by not using the service," which is equivalent to your non-toll-road example.

I drive home through the toll rd cause they only charge in bound. Thats stealing I guess.

Your analogy doesn't even make sense now. Avoid taking the LSAT...

The Tobin Bridge in Boston (a toll road) charges a passenger car $3.50 to cross it IN to Boston. No charge when leaving Boston. The one way toll was decided so as not to create a back up during the evening rush. Many drivers evade the toll by taking other routes in the morning only to Use the bridge later on for free. Some people use the bridge every day and never pay, some pay every day.

[Jeffro.]

If you go out of your way to avoid paying the fee for a service, then there's certainly a form of stealing going on.

Sometimes I avoid the toll road to avoid paying the toll. I drive a little extra but it never feels like stealing, but rather saving.

So you use Craigslist?

Not in the last 2 yrs

Well Craigslist would be the equivalent to what you wrote. Or some other service besides eBay. I'm talking about "avoiding the fee for a service that you've been using," not "avoiding the fee for a service by not using the service," which is equivalent to your non-toll-road example.

I drive home through the toll rd cause they only charge in bound. Thats stealing I guess.

Your analogy doesn't even make sense now. Avoid taking the LSAT...

The Tobin Bridge in Boston (a toll road) charges a passenger car $3.50 to cross it IN to Boston. No charge when leaving Boston. The one way toll was decided so as not to create a back up during the evening rush. Many drivers evade the toll by taking other routes in the morning only to Use the bridge later on for free. Some people use the bridge every day and never pay, some pay every day.

 

Do you sign an agreement with the city of Boston or the State of Mass that you will always use the toll route, and then circumvent it?

 

That's what happens when you sign up for ebay, agree to their terms of service, and then break those terms of service by making deals off ebay, thus circumventing fees.

[Awax]

Roy, for the most part I agree. However in other instances, I feel that it has promoted positive change. Take music piracy. I believe that despite the numbers that the recording industry reports that the rampant online file sharing of music was healthier for music (as far as the artists were concerned.) Kanye West may have had the most stolen album last week but that also allowed his music and "brand" to reach a wider audience than if they had to pay for it. Kanye, despite his ego flaws, is a pretty smart guy given everything he has his hand in as more people are now exposed to other business ventures that he retains more control over than his music.

 

1 - Many people discovered music they would normally not have listened to.

2 - The old business model of how the recording industry was run is now ineffective in the face of how people acquire their music. People have drifted away from what was force-fed on the radio by Clear Channel and other media conglomerates. This forced longstanding artists to be more creative and gave a lot of smaller size bands a chance for a better opportunity to showcase their talent.

3 - Thanks to YouTube and other streaming sites both legal and illegal, I have even discovered new bands this year that I would never have heard of if not for which led me to either see them live or at least purchase their music.

 

 

After discovering these bands did you buy their music?

 

 

[PovertyRow]

I think someone mentioned it earlier, but I would be interested to hear what those that have no issue with this think about someone asking for GPA data from someone else? Do you consider that wrong?

 

 

I pay for GPA monthly, it has helped me purchase several books. It even helps send offers to those on eBay who are priced over GPA.

 

What about sharing a GPA account with someone?

 

When you sign up for GPA you agree to these terms.

 

The following terms and conditions govern your access to and use of the GPA for COMICS (GPA) proprietary directory (the "Materials") and Online Services (the "Online Services"):

 

1. SCOPE OF LICENSE GRANT

 

1.1 Single Copy Subscription Access: You ("User") are hereby granted a nonexclusive, nontransferable, limited license ("Subscription Access") to access and use the Materials and Online Services made available to you on this Web site by GPA, for purposes related to research and information gathering. Your right to use this site is personal to you and you may not sub-license, transfer, sell or assign these rights to any third party without our approval. Any attempt to do so will be void. This Subscription Access is a single copy license, and permits an individual subscriber to access and use the Materials and Online Services from one unique computer terminal or PDA of their choice. User agrees to maintain no more than one (1) concurrent online session per subscription purchased, and is therefore prohibited from accessing either the Materials or Online Services via a dual-modem connection (multilink). The User will be able to access the Online Service from one further unique computer terminial or PDA, on a non-concurrent basis. De-authorization of unique computer terminals or PDAs will be allowed on a limited basis per month for the purpose of authorizing use of Online Service from a further computer terminal or PDA (if the user is not able to access the Online Service from their regular computer terminal or PDA). The materials (including directories, lists, names, data, text, graphics, photographs, software, code and scripts) provided on this Web site are copyrighted, and unauthorized use of any of these materials and/or Online Services may violate copyright and/or other laws, including the 'Digital Millennium Copyright Act.' This Subscription Access includes, to the extent permitted by applicable law, the right to obtain a printout of Materials of the Online Services and to create a single printout of Materials via commands of the User Browser application. User shall be responsible for providing, at its own expense, all communications lines, hardware, software, Online Services and other materials and technology necessary for it to access the Materials and/or Online Services. GPA shall have no responsibility for any failure of such items or any failure or limitation of the Internet or other computer hardware or software. Only individual subscribers or those authorized by their subscribing organization may access and use the Materials and/or Online Services. Additional Materials may be added to or withdrawn from the Online Services, and may be otherwise changed without notice.

 

1.2 Access and Use Restrictions: Except as specifically provided in Section

 

1.1, User is prohibited from downloading, storing, reproducing, transmitting, displaying, copying, distributing, selling, renting or using the Materials. Except as specifically provided herein, User may not access or use the Materials or Online Services in any fashion that infringes the copyrights or proprietary interests therein. User may not remove or obscure the copyright notice or other notices posted in conjunction with the Materials, nor modify the Materials in any manner. User may not distribute, sublicense, assign or transfer any rights to use the Materials, either in whole or part, to any third party. User may not decompile, disassemble, reverse engineer or otherwise manipulate any software, code, applets, images, photographs, or scripts in order to derive any source code. "Mirroring" or making available any portion of this Web site by another server is strictly prohibited. User may not decompile, disassemble, rent, lease, loan, sell, sublicense, or create derivative works from the Materials. User may not use any network monitoring or discovery software to determine the site architecture, or extract information about usage or users. User may not use any software robot, spider, electronic agent, other automatic device or manual process to monitor or copy this Web Site or the Materials without GPA's prior written permission. User may not use or otherwise export or re-export the Web Site, Materials or Online Services in violation of the export control laws and regulations of the United States of America.

 

1.3 Passwords: GPA will provide User with the ability to assign one user ID and password to enable User to access certain or all portions of the Materials, depending upon the subscription selected. User shall be solely responsible for the confidentiality and use of such user IDs and passwords. User shall immediately notify GPA if it becomes aware of any loss or theft of a password or any unauthorized use of a password, user ID, or of the Materials. User shall not use any password or other means to attempt to access portions of the Materials or Online Services for which GPA has not issued User a password. GPA may de-activate any password at any time at its sole and unfettered discretion.

 

2. OWNERSHIP OF PROPRIETARY RIGHTS

The Materials made available by GPA in connection with this Subscription Access, together with all modifications, and revisions thereto and all copyrights, trademarks, patents, trade secrets, lists, software, text, images and other intellectual and proprietary rights, title and interest relating thereto, shall at all times be and remain the property of GPA. The provisions of this clause shall survive the termination of this Agreement.

 

3. CONFIDENTIAL INFORMATION

 

3.1 Definition: "Confidential Information" shall mean any confidential or other proprietary information disclosed by GPA to the User hereunder, including, but not limited to, directories, lists, reports, analysis, pricing, Online Services plans, specifications, manuals, training materials, brochures, software designs and code, user names, passwords, materials, documents, and other business or technical information.

 

3.2 Restrictions: User agrees (a) not to disclose, directly or indirectly, to any third party any portion of the Confidential Information without the prior written consent of GPA; (b) to take reasonably necessary precautions to protect the confidentiality of the Confidential Information received hereunder and exercise at least the same degree of care in safeguarding the Confidential Information as the User would with its own confidential information; and © promptly advise GPA in writing upon learning of any unauthorized use or disclosure of the Confidential Information.

 

4. DISCLAIMER OF WARRANTIES, LIMITATION OF LIABILITY AND INDEMNIFICATION

 

4.1 THE MATERIALS AND ONLINE SERVICES ARE PROVIDED "AS IS," WITH NO WARRANTIES WHATSOEVER. GPA HEREBY DISCLAIMS ALL WARRANTIES, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING, WITHOUT LIMITATION, ANY IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY OR FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. IN NO EVENT SHALL GPA BE LIABLE, EXCEPT FOR WILLFUL ACTS, FOR ANY DAMAGES TO USER OR ANY OTHER PARTY WHATSOEVER, INCLUDING, WITHOUT LIMITATION, CONSEQUENTIAL, INCIDENTAL OR SPECIAL DAMAGES OR DAMAGES FOR LOST PROFITS OR LOSSES RESULTING FROM BUSINESS INTERRUPTION OR LOSS OF DATA, REGARDLESS OF THE FORM OF ACTION OR LEGAL THEORY UNDER WHICH THE LIABILITY MAY BE ASSERTED, EVEN IF ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OR LIKELIHOOD OF SUCH DAMAGES.

 

4.2 User agrees to indemnify, defend and hold harmless, GPA, its affiliates, and their respective officers, directors, employees, agents, licensors, representatives, and third party providers to this Web site from and against all losses, expenses, damages and costs, including reasonable attorneys' fees, resulting from any violation of this Agreement by User.

 

5. TERM

The Initial Term of this Agreement shall be as stated in the Order ("Initial Term"). The Initial Term shall begin upon commencement of Online Services to User, provided, however, no Online Services shall commence unless and until GPA receives and accepts a completed Order from User, plus payment in full for Online Services to be rendered during the Initial Term. GPA reserves the right to reject any submitted Order for any or no reason prior to written acceptance thereof by GPA. After the Initial Term, unless otherwise agreed to by the parties, this Agreement shall automatically renew for successive terms of equal length as the Initial Term unless terminated or cancelled by either party only as provided in Paragraph 6 below. The Initial Term plus all successive renewal periods during which Online Services is provided shall be collectively referred to as the "Term."

 

6. NOTICE

User may cancel their subscription at any time though the GPA website. It is incumbent upon the User to provide all necessary details when cancelling. Cancellations are effective immediately, however User will be able to access the Materials and Online Services for the remainder of the current billing Term.

 

7. MISCELLANEOUS

If User breaches any term or condition of this Subscription Access, GPA may, in addition to any other remedies available at law or equity, deny User access to the Materials and Online Services, as well as to any other Web sites owned and/or operated by GPA. In the event that any term or condition of this Subscription Access shall, in whole or in part, be determined to be invalid, unenforceable or void for any reason, such determination shall only affect the portion of such term or condition determined to be invalid, unenforceable or void, and shall not in any way affect the remaining terms and conditions herein. Any waiver, modification, or amendment of any term or condition of this license will be effective only if in writing and signed by GPA and User. These terms and conditions (and any modifications thereto) constitute the entire agreement between GPA and User with regard to the subject matter hereof, and supersede all prior understandings and agreements, whether written or oral, as to such subject matter. Nothing contained in these terms and conditions shall be deemed to constitute either party as the agent or representative of the other party, or both parties as joint ventures or partners for any purpose.

 

[RidersRohan]

I think someone mentioned it earlier, but I would be interested to hear what those that have no issue with this think about someone asking for GPA data from someone else? Do you consider that wrong?

 

 

I pay for GPA monthly, it has helped me purchase several books. It even helps send offers to those on eBay who are priced over GPA.

 

What about sharing a GPA account with someone?

 

When you sign up for GPA you agree to these terms.

 

The following terms and conditions govern your access to and use of the GPA for COMICS (GPA) proprietary directory (the "Materials") and Online Services (the "Online Services"):

 

1. SCOPE OF LICENSE GRANT

 

1.1 Single Copy Subscription Access: You ("User") are hereby granted a nonexclusive, nontransferable, limited license ("Subscription Access") to access and use the Materials and Online Services made available to you on this Web site by GPA, for purposes related to research and information gathering. Your right to use this site is personal to you and you may not sub-license, transfer, sell or assign these rights to any third party without our approval. Any attempt to do so will be void. This Subscription Access is a single copy license, and permits an individual subscriber to access and use the Materials and Online Services from one unique computer terminal or PDA of their choice. User agrees to maintain no more than one (1) concurrent online session per subscription purchased, and is therefore prohibited from accessing either the Materials or Online Services via a dual-modem connection (multilink). The User will be able to access the Online Service from one further unique computer terminial or PDA, on a non-concurrent basis. De-authorization of unique computer terminals or PDAs will be allowed on a limited basis per month for the purpose of authorizing use of Online Service from a further computer terminal or PDA (if the user is not able to access the Online Service from their regular computer terminal or PDA). The materials (including directories, lists, names, data, text, graphics, photographs, software, code and scripts) provided on this Web site are copyrighted, and unauthorized use of any of these materials and/or Online Services may violate copyright and/or other laws, including the 'Digital Millennium Copyright Act.' This Subscription Access includes, to the extent permitted by applicable law, the right to obtain a printout of Materials of the Online Services and to create a single printout of Materials via commands of the User Browser application. User shall be responsible for providing, at its own expense, all communications lines, hardware, software, Online Services and other materials and technology necessary for it to access the Materials and/or Online Services. GPA shall have no responsibility for any failure of such items or any failure or limitation of the Internet or other computer hardware or software. Only individual subscribers or those authorized by their subscribing organization may access and use the Materials and/or Online Services. Additional Materials may be added to or withdrawn from the Online Services, and may be otherwise changed without notice.

 

1.2 Access and Use Restrictions: Except as specifically provided in Section

 

1.1, User is prohibited from downloading, storing, reproducing, transmitting, displaying, copying, distributing, selling, renting or using the Materials. Except as specifically provided herein, User may not access or use the Materials or Online Services in any fashion that infringes the copyrights or proprietary interests therein. User may not remove or obscure the copyright notice or other notices posted in conjunction with the Materials, nor modify the Materials in any manner. User may not distribute, sublicense, assign or transfer any rights to use the Materials, either in whole or part, to any third party. User may not decompile, disassemble, reverse engineer or otherwise manipulate any software, code, applets, images, photographs, or scripts in order to derive any source code. "Mirroring" or making available any portion of this Web site by another server is strictly prohibited. User may not decompile, disassemble, rent, lease, loan, sell, sublicense, or create derivative works from the Materials. User may not use any network monitoring or discovery software to determine the site architecture, or extract information about usage or users. User may not use any software robot, spider, electronic agent, other automatic device or manual process to monitor or copy this Web Site or the Materials without GPA's prior written permission. User may not use or otherwise export or re-export the Web Site, Materials or Online Services in violation of the export control laws and regulations of the United States of America.

 

1.3 Passwords: GPA will provide User with the ability to assign one user ID and password to enable User to access certain or all portions of the Materials, depending upon the subscription selected. User shall be solely responsible for the confidentiality and use of such user IDs and passwords. User shall immediately notify GPA if it becomes aware of any loss or theft of a password or any unauthorized use of a password, user ID, or of the Materials. User shall not use any password or other means to attempt to access portions of the Materials or Online Services for which GPA has not issued User a password. GPA may de-activate any password at any time at its sole and unfettered discretion.

 

2. OWNERSHIP OF PROPRIETARY RIGHTS

The Materials made available by GPA in connection with this Subscription Access, together with all modifications, and revisions thereto and all copyrights, trademarks, patents, trade secrets, lists, software, text, images and other intellectual and proprietary rights, title and interest relating thereto, shall at all times be and remain the property of GPA. The provisions of this clause shall survive the termination of this Agreement.

 

3. CONFIDENTIAL INFORMATION

 

3.1 Definition: "Confidential Information" shall mean any confidential or other proprietary information disclosed by GPA to the User hereunder, including, but not limited to, directories, lists, reports, analysis, pricing, Online Services plans, specifications, manuals, training materials, brochures, software designs and code, user names, passwords, materials, documents, and other business or technical information.

 

3.2 Restrictions: User agrees (a) not to disclose, directly or indirectly, to any third party any portion of the Confidential Information without the prior written consent of GPA; (b) to take reasonably necessary precautions to protect the confidentiality of the Confidential Information received hereunder and exercise at least the same degree of care in safeguarding the Confidential Information as the User would with its own confidential information; and © promptly advise GPA in writing upon learning of any unauthorized use or disclosure of the Confidential Information.

 

4. DISCLAIMER OF WARRANTIES, LIMITATION OF LIABILITY AND INDEMNIFICATION

 

4.1 THE MATERIALS AND ONLINE SERVICES ARE PROVIDED "AS IS," WITH NO WARRANTIES WHATSOEVER. GPA HEREBY DISCLAIMS ALL WARRANTIES, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING, WITHOUT LIMITATION, ANY IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY OR FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. IN NO EVENT SHALL GPA BE LIABLE, EXCEPT FOR WILLFUL ACTS, FOR ANY DAMAGES TO USER OR ANY OTHER PARTY WHATSOEVER, INCLUDING, WITHOUT LIMITATION, CONSEQUENTIAL, INCIDENTAL OR SPECIAL DAMAGES OR DAMAGES FOR LOST PROFITS OR LOSSES RESULTING FROM BUSINESS INTERRUPTION OR LOSS OF DATA, REGARDLESS OF THE FORM OF ACTION OR LEGAL THEORY UNDER WHICH THE LIABILITY MAY BE ASSERTED, EVEN IF ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OR LIKELIHOOD OF SUCH DAMAGES.

 

4.2 User agrees to indemnify, defend and hold harmless, GPA, its affiliates, and their respective officers, directors, employees, agents, licensors, representatives, and third party providers to this Web site from and against all losses, expenses, damages and costs, including reasonable attorneys' fees, resulting from any violation of this Agreement by User.

 

5. TERM

The Initial Term of this Agreement shall be as stated in the Order ("Initial Term"). The Initial Term shall begin upon commencement of Online Services to User, provided, however, no Online Services shall commence unless and until GPA receives and accepts a completed Order from User, plus payment in full for Online Services to be rendered during the Initial Term. GPA reserves the right to reject any submitted Order for any or no reason prior to written acceptance thereof by GPA. After the Initial Term, unless otherwise agreed to by the parties, this Agreement shall automatically renew for successive terms of equal length as the Initial Term unless terminated or cancelled by either party only as provided in Paragraph 6 below. The Initial Term plus all successive renewal periods during which Online Services is provided shall be collectively referred to as the "Term."

 

6. NOTICE

User may cancel their subscription at any time though the GPA website. It is incumbent upon the User to provide all necessary details when cancelling. Cancellations are effective immediately, however User will be able to access the Materials and Online Services for the remainder of the current billing Term.

 

7. MISCELLANEOUS

If User breaches any term or condition of this Subscription Access, GPA may, in addition to any other remedies available at law or equity, deny User access to the Materials and Online Services, as well as to any other Web sites owned and/or operated by GPA. In the event that any term or condition of this Subscription Access shall, in whole or in part, be determined to be invalid, unenforceable or void for any reason, such determination shall only affect the portion of such term or condition determined to be invalid, unenforceable or void, and shall not in any way affect the remaining terms and conditions herein. Any waiver, modification, or amendment of any term or condition of this license will be effective only if in writing and signed by GPA and User. These terms and conditions (and any modifications thereto) constitute the entire agreement between GPA and User with regard to the subject matter hereof, and supersede all prior understandings and agreements, whether written or oral, as to such subject matter. Nothing contained in these terms and conditions shall be deemed to constitute either party as the agent or representative of the other party, or both parties as joint ventures or partners for any purpose.

So, if I open up my GPA account on my laptop, while my friend is looking over my shoulder, it appears that I am doing nothing wrong.

[bababooey]

Just in case Stu's question with regard to the sig line email to vger7 gets poofed with all the follow up posts.

 

It's also been posted as a contact under both accounts .

 

sagat

 

vger7

 

 

[VintageComics]

George has repeatedly said that he doesn't mind if people share a bit in 'one off' situations but let's just put ourselves into his shoes. If you were making a living from a business that you invested time and money into, how would you feel if you found out people were sharing behind the scenes and cheating you out of honest money that you were entitled to?

[PovertyRow]

I think someone mentioned it earlier, but I would be interested to hear what those that have no issue with this think about someone asking for GPA data from someone else? Do you consider that wrong?

 

 

I pay for GPA monthly, it has helped me purchase several books. It even helps send offers to those on eBay who are priced over GPA.

 

What about sharing a GPA account with someone?

 

When you sign up for GPA you agree to these terms.

 

 

The following terms and conditions govern your access to and use of the GPA for COMICS (GPA) proprietary directory (the "Materials") and Online Services (the "Online Services"):

 

1. SCOPE OF LICENSE GRANT

 

1.1 Single Copy Subscription Access: You ("User") are hereby granted a nonexclusive, nontransferable, limited license ("Subscription Access") to access and use the Materials and Online Services made available to you on this Web site by GPA, for purposes related to research and information gathering. Your right to use this site is personal to you and you may not sub-license, transfer, sell or assign these rights to any third party without our approval. Any attempt to do so will be void. This Subscription Access is a single copy license, and permits an individual subscriber to access and use the Materials and Online Services from one unique computer terminal or PDA of their choice. User agrees to maintain no more than one (1) concurrent online session per subscription purchased, and is therefore prohibited from accessing either the Materials or Online Services via a dual-modem connection (multilink). The User will be able to access the Online Service from one further unique computer terminial or PDA, on a non-concurrent basis. De-authorization of unique computer terminals or PDAs will be allowed on a limited basis per month for the purpose of authorizing use of Online Service from a further computer terminal or PDA (if the user is not able to access the Online Service from their regular computer terminal or PDA). The materials (including directories, lists, names, data, text, graphics, photographs, software, code and scripts) provided on this Web site are copyrighted, and unauthorized use of any of these materials and/or Online Services may violate copyright and/or other laws, including the 'Digital Millennium Copyright Act.' This Subscription Access includes, to the extent permitted by applicable law, the right to obtain a printout of Materials of the Online Services and to create a single printout of Materials via commands of the User Browser application. User shall be responsible for providing, at its own expense, all communications lines, hardware, software, Online Services and other materials and technology necessary for it to access the Materials and/or Online Services. GPA shall have no responsibility for any failure of such items or any failure or limitation of the Internet or other computer hardware or software. Only individual subscribers or those authorized by their subscribing organization may access and use the Materials and/or Online Services. Additional Materials may be added to or withdrawn from the Online Services, and may be otherwise changed without notice.

 

1.2 Access and Use Restrictions: Except as specifically provided in Section

 

1.1, User is prohibited from downloading, storing, reproducing, transmitting, displaying, copying, distributing, selling, renting or using the Materials. Except as specifically provided herein, User may not access or use the Materials or Online Services in any fashion that infringes the copyrights or proprietary interests therein. User may not remove or obscure the copyright notice or other notices posted in conjunction with the Materials, nor modify the Materials in any manner. User may not distribute, sublicense, assign or transfer any rights to use the Materials, either in whole or part, to any third party. User may not decompile, disassemble, reverse engineer or otherwise manipulate any software, code, applets, images, photographs, or scripts in order to derive any source code. "Mirroring" or making available any portion of this Web site by another server is strictly prohibited. User may not decompile, disassemble, rent, lease, loan, sell, sublicense, or create derivative works from the Materials. User may not use any network monitoring or discovery software to determine the site architecture, or extract information about usage or users. User may not use any software robot, spider, electronic agent, other automatic device or manual process to monitor or copy this Web Site or the Materials without GPA's prior written permission. User may not use or otherwise export or re-export the Web Site, Materials or Online Services in violation of the export control laws and regulations of the United States of America.

 

1.3 Passwords: GPA will provide User with the ability to assign one user ID and password to enable User to access certain or all portions of the Materials, depending upon the subscription selected. User shall be solely responsible for the confidentiality and use of such user IDs and passwords. User shall immediately notify GPA if it becomes aware of any loss or theft of a password or any unauthorized use of a password, user ID, or of the Materials. User shall not use any password or other means to attempt to access portions of the Materials or Online Services for which GPA has not issued User a password. GPA may de-activate any password at any time at its sole and unfettered discretion.

 

2. OWNERSHIP OF PROPRIETARY RIGHTS

The Materials made available by GPA in connection with this Subscription Access, together with all modifications, and revisions thereto and all copyrights, trademarks, patents, trade secrets, lists, software, text, images and other intellectual and proprietary rights, title and interest relating thereto, shall at all times be and remain the property of GPA. The provisions of this clause shall survive the termination of this Agreement.

 

3. CONFIDENTIAL INFORMATION

 

3.1 Definition: "Confidential Information" shall mean any confidential or other proprietary information disclosed by GPA to the User hereunder, including, but not limited to, directories, lists, reports, analysis, pricing, Online Services plans, specifications, manuals, training materials, brochures, software designs and code, user names, passwords, materials, documents, and other business or technical information.

 

3.2 Restrictions: User agrees (a) not to disclose, directly or indirectly, to any third party any portion of the Confidential Information without the prior written consent of GPA; (b) to take reasonably necessary precautions to protect the confidentiality of the Confidential Information received hereunder and exercise at least the same degree of care in safeguarding the Confidential Information as the User would with its own confidential information; and © promptly advise GPA in writing upon learning of any unauthorized use or disclosure of the Confidential Information.

 

4. DISCLAIMER OF WARRANTIES, LIMITATION OF LIABILITY AND INDEMNIFICATION

 

4.1 THE MATERIALS AND ONLINE SERVICES ARE PROVIDED "AS IS," WITH NO WARRANTIES WHATSOEVER. GPA HEREBY DISCLAIMS ALL WARRANTIES, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING, WITHOUT LIMITATION, ANY IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY OR FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. IN NO EVENT SHALL GPA BE LIABLE, EXCEPT FOR WILLFUL ACTS, FOR ANY DAMAGES TO USER OR ANY OTHER PARTY WHATSOEVER, INCLUDING, WITHOUT LIMITATION, CONSEQUENTIAL, INCIDENTAL OR SPECIAL DAMAGES OR DAMAGES FOR LOST PROFITS OR LOSSES RESULTING FROM BUSINESS INTERRUPTION OR LOSS OF DATA, REGARDLESS OF THE FORM OF ACTION OR LEGAL THEORY UNDER WHICH THE LIABILITY MAY BE ASSERTED, EVEN IF ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OR LIKELIHOOD OF SUCH DAMAGES.

 

4.2 User agrees to indemnify, defend and hold harmless, GPA, its affiliates, and their respective officers, directors, employees, agents, licensors, representatives, and third party providers to this Web site from and against all losses, expenses, damages and costs, including reasonable attorneys' fees, resulting from any violation of this Agreement by User.

 

5. TERM

The Initial Term of this Agreement shall be as stated in the Order ("Initial Term"). The Initial Term shall begin upon commencement of Online Services to User, provided, however, no Online Services shall commence unless and until GPA receives and accepts a completed Order from User, plus payment in full for Online Services to be rendered during the Initial Term. GPA reserves the right to reject any submitted Order for any or no reason prior to written acceptance thereof by GPA. After the Initial Term, unless otherwise agreed to by the parties, this Agreement shall automatically renew for successive terms of equal length as the Initial Term unless terminated or cancelled by either party only as provided in Paragraph 6 below. The Initial Term plus all successive renewal periods during which Online Services is provided shall be collectively referred to as the "Term."

 

6. NOTICE

User may cancel their subscription at any time though the GPA website. It is incumbent upon the User to provide all necessary details when cancelling. Cancellations are effective immediately, however User will be able to access the Materials and Online Services for the remainder of the current billing Term.

 

7. MISCELLANEOUS

If User breaches any term or condition of this Subscription Access, GPA may, in addition to any other remedies available at law or equity, deny User access to the Materials and Online Services, as well as to any other Web sites owned and/or operated by GPA. In the event that any term or condition of this Subscription Access shall, in whole or in part, be determined to be invalid, unenforceable or void for any reason, such determination shall only affect the portion of such term or condition determined to be invalid, unenforceable or void, and shall not in any way affect the remaining terms and conditions herein. Any waiver, modification, or amendment of any term or condition of this license will be effective only if in writing and signed by GPA and User. These terms and conditions (and any modifications thereto) constitute the entire agreement between GPA and User with regard to the subject matter hereof, and supersede all prior understandings and agreements, whether written or oral, as to such subject matter. Nothing contained in these terms and conditions shall be deemed to constitute either party as the agent or representative of the other party, or both parties as joint ventures or partners for any purpose.

 

So, if I open up my GPA account on my laptop, while my friend is looking over my shoulder, it appears that I am doing nothing wrong.

 

Interesting question. I have to wonder if this comes into play (in the first paragraph):

 

(By the way, I put the agreement in spoiler tags as it is getting too long to keep quoting)

 

"Your right to use this site is personal to you and you may not sub-license, transfer, sell or assign these rights to any third party without our approval. Any attempt to do so will be void. This Subscription Access is a single copy license, and permits an individual subscriber to access and use the Materials and Online Services from one unique computer terminal or PDA of their choice. "