How to spot restoration....? 17 17

[FFB]

Hey Jim,

 

Well first off I looked up that 3M Cleaner 08984. It isn't the same as just Naptha. The Napth i have used and seen used is at the hardware store and called VMP (or VM&P) Naptha. I've seen books left in it for quite a long time - over an hour - with no impact on the inks, not that I am recommending that long a soak.

 

As far as that Toluene stuff goes. I haven't used it but to be honest it doesn't sound like the best thing to me.

 

When you use Naptha, how does one avoid having it leave a tell-tale odor? I have read that when done correctly, there is no residual solvent odor. Are there ways other than odor to detect that a book has been solvent cleaned?

[PovertyRow]

Hey Jim,

 

Well first off I looked up that 3M Cleaner 08984. It isn't the same as just Naptha. The Napth i have used and seen used is at the hardware store and called VMP (or VM&P) Naptha. I've seen books left in it for quite a long time - over an hour - with no impact on the inks, not that I am recommending that long a soak.

 

As far as that Toluene stuff goes. I haven't used it but to be honest it doesn't sound like the best thing to me.

 

When you use Naptha, how does one avoid having it leave a tell-tale odor? I have read that when done correctly, there is no residual solvent odor. Are there ways other than odor to detect that a book has been solvent cleaned?

 

Just air-dried with PLENTY of ventilation. Repeat - PLEANTY OF VENTLIATION. And no sparks. Or flames. Or smoking. Or anything else that could cause combustion.

[jimm94]

Or anything else that could cause combustion.

 

Like beans?

[BSideLogan-migration]

hi,

this is my first post so i'll offer a quick intro before getting to the question. i haven't been a serious collector for almost 10 years. i still buy books when something catches my eye. i consider myself a Marvel man but have enjoyed some DC from time to time.

 

here's my problem: i purchased a NM X-Men 94 many years ago. as with most of my books, i read it once, mylared it and put it in a box. it's only now that i'm planning on grading and selling some of my books, that i've really looked at it and what i've discovered has chilled me.

 

i knew about the black magic marker dot at the bottom of the spine, but upon checking the inside cover, i discovered another 5 little yet unmistakable marker seep-through marks and a quarter inch fill in of a crease. drag.

 

how damaging is this grading and selling wise?

 

the book has white-off white pages but the cover colors are still bold and overall condition looks sweet. based on what i've been reading about grading, i was hoping for a possible 9.6-9.8. now i don't know if i should even bother grading it if a Restoration tag is the comic equivalent of a kiss of death.

 

sorry for the long post. first time anxiety.

 

Thanks.

[divad]

BSide,

 

Good story, but a real bummer. Sounds like a nice book - can you post a scan or give us a link? I take it you bought the book from a "reputable" dealer?

 

The seep-through marker and "filled in" crease will definitelly earn you the "coveted" lavender label. It's way too young a book to have received such treatment - unless you were really taken on it.

 

I'd keep it and enjoy it, or sell it with full disclosure to a willing buyer. Having it graded may only be a waste of time and money, in that it may only end up reducing its value.

 

You might consider grading it and keeping it, however, as the tide may change someday.

 

I know that I'd still be interested in it.

 

cheers,

[BSideLogan-migration]

i bought it around 15 years ago from a favorite comic store. it costed me $65. i think the Overstreet value was $104 at the time. how things change. i'm planning on finally buying a digicam within the next two weeks and will post pics. i may still grade it just for safety. maybe it'll be less of an issue in another 10 years, once the population has thinned out.

 

thanks for the feedback!

[rob_react]

Actually you might do okay as long as your grading is up to snuff. GPA for Slight (a) books is as follows:

 

SA (9.2) (2) $452.50 500/405 Marvel Comics 1 1975 1 Sep 2003

SA (9.0) - $399.00 - Marvel Comics 1 1975 1 Oct 2003

SA (8.5) (2) $185.75 218/153 Marvel Comics 1 1975 1 Sep 2003

 

Those are surprisingly high numbers for a restored bronze book.

[divad]

Actually you might do okay as long as your grading is up to snuff. GPA for Slight (a) books is as follows:

 

SA (9.2) (2) $452.50 500/405 Marvel Comics 1 1975 1 Sep 2003

SA (9.0) - $399.00 - Marvel Comics 1 1975 1 Oct 2003

SA (8.5) (2) $185.75 218/153 Marvel Comics 1 1975 1 Sep 2003

 

Those are surprisingly high numbers for a restored bronze book.

 

They are! I wonder how many are then broken out and resold raw as unrestored???

[rob_react]

Actually you might do okay as long as your grading is up to snuff. GPA for Slight (a) books is as follows:

 

SA (9.2) (2) $452.50 500/405 Marvel Comics 1 1975 1 Sep 2003

SA (9.0) - $399.00 - Marvel Comics 1 1975 1 Oct 2003

SA (8.5) (2) $185.75 218/153 Marvel Comics 1 1975 1 Sep 2003

 

Those are surprisingly high numbers for a restored bronze book.

 

They are! I wonder how many are then broken out and resold raw as unrestored???

 

You could say that for any restored book. Thing is, with most you would do far better than with these. With these you'd have to work hard to break even selling raw.

[1st-and-keys]

I have a question regarding "pressed" comics...I have seen it mentioned on the forums before but am not really sure what it is...how it's done...if it's restoration... or if it is detectable....can anyone point me to a link with some info or could someone explain it abit..thanks!!

[PovertyRow]

I have a question regarding "pressed" comics...I have seen it mentioned on the forums before but am not really sure what it is...how it's done...if it's restoration... or if it is detectable....can anyone point me to a link with some info or could someone explain it abit..thanks!!

 

You are in the link for it. Just read up a while.

[Sharkey]

Pov, I gotta tell you, your posts on this thread are the most informative things I've read in a long, long time. Wow. Thanks for enlightening me on the process of and detection of restoration.

[divad]

Pov, I gotta tell you, your posts on this thread are the most informative things I've read in a long, long time. Wow. Thanks for enlightening me on the process of and detection of restoration.

 

Wow! I better read this thread again

[Ric-migration]

1) Black light - yep - but do it in as dark a room as you can and edge the book towards the black light source and very slowly rotate it.

 

2) Trimmed. If you press the book flat on a hard smooth surface and look along the edge, if the edges are all even the book HAS been trimmed. If you still think the book is trimmed after it passes this test then open the book up to the centerfol. Try very gently pressing it flat and see if there are signs of cutting (lighter edge colors, slight roughness, differences in overall color)

 

I recently bought a Tales to Astonish #1 on ebay for a lot of money. After reading this forum, I am convinced the comicbook was CHOPPED on the right edge, perhaps at least trimmed top and bottom, but definately chopped on the right.

 

I wonder what pct. of guide a book is devalued when this happens.

 

POV, can you share your awesome insight?

 

I knew the book was too nice to be true, now I shall find out if the dealer will give me my $ back.

 

ALSO, what pct. of guide is a book lessened when it has had color touch?

 

I collect pre-hero atlas horror. Any comments are greatly appreciated in advance.

 

I used a regular white lightbulb on a regular lamp to find color touches on a few books, the reflection shows the different ink sometimes.

 

If anyone can provide a link to the best blacklight on the market, perhaps at least a good one, that would be nice. I would want this to find color touching. I have a blocklight bulb, but it doesn't help much at all, anyone have a suggestion why a blacklight bulb I bought at the store isn't much help at least to my untrained eye, or should it be mor obvious??

 

thanks, people -

Ric

 

ps. I answer any emails too, thank you.

Edited February 20, 2005 by Ric

[gcox-migration]

question...what about a slight fold/bend that has not broken the color or a warped area that has be ironed out....I assumed ironed....how is flatning/ironing detected and done?

[PovertyRow]

question...what about a slight fold/bend that has not broken the color or a warped area that has be ironed out....I assumed ironed....how is flatning/ironing detected and done?

 

Basically application of mild heat and pressure. Can it always be detected? Probably not. If it is at all done incorrectly there will be signs. Too muc heat over too long a duration can impactg paper color and ink. Also the inherent gloss. Also delineations outlining the tool used to apply the localized pressing.

 

And again - a clothes iron is just not the best tool!

[FFB]

Here's a little diagram I put together to show you how to tell if a book has been disassembled. This is a pretty extreme example and if a book is disassembled by a skilled professional it will not usually look like this. Still, this should give you an idea of what to look for.

 

[Yaw-migration]

Quick question.I read that CGC wants to spin off/partner with a pro restoration service.There are not a lot of books still around after the book burnings of the 50's.Very few books are in good shape. I feel a pro retorer will use the exact types of inks etc to match the original.We can't all buy a book in 1960 and keep it in a bag for 50 years.I have seen books thatwere professionally cleaned and pressed.The difference is amazing.If I have to use a high power magnifyer to spot a fix on a book,is it worth it to be that picky.

[KingOfRulers]

I've looked through this thread and the info is amazing. But, I do have a question that I did not find an answer for.

 

Can someone tell me the proper way and procedure to disassemble a book?

[Black Hawk]

I've looked through this thread and the info is amazing. But, I do have a question that I did not find an answer for.

 

Can someone tell me the proper way and procedure to disassemble a book?

I can't tell you the proper way but I can tell you what I've tried and how it worked.

 

I've played with bending the staples straight using my fingers and a set of micro jewler pliers that I found at the flee market. I used my fingers to ply the staples open and then used the pliers to staighten the stable out. I then played with taking each page out individually. I found that unless I was extremely careful I would sometimes endup making little tears near the stables. I then tried puling the staple slowly out with all the pages still intact. I used a flat thin pocket knife blade that I would place between the staple and the back of the book. I would then slowly "rock" the staple out. I ended up prefering this method as in my case in mnimized or eliminated the damage I was causing using the other method.

 

Putting the book back together was another problem. I have never found a method that I felt comfortable with in doing this.

Hope this helps in some small way.