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CAPTAIN MARVEL starring Brie Larson (3/8/19)
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2,795 posts in this topic

18 minutes ago, @therealsilvermane said:

Clearly your sense of comic book history is shaped by comicsgate and not by actual comic book history. Comic books, particularly since the 1960’s, reflected and addressed the social justice issues of the time. The Black Panther and Falcon, both co-created by Stan Lee, were reflections of 60’s Civil Rights. The famed Green Lantern Green Arrow series by Denny O’Neil and Neal Adams touched on a different social justice issue every month, like workers rights and racism in America. Ms Marvel was born out of Stan Lee’s awareness of the women’s independence movement in the 1970’s. The Uncanny X-Men have always been a metaphor for civil rights whether Stan Lee or Chris Claremont wrote them. It’s an issue that absolutely has a place in a comic collector forum. The “problem” for studios today who are trying to increase the audience demographic for super-hero comic book movies, is that there still aren’t enough major characters that represent different genders or races, to appeal to that wider demographic. For Marvel, after Carol Danvers and Black Widow, there aren’t any more major solo female characters. After Panther and Falcon, there aren’t anymore major black heroes. DC has the same issue. After Wonder Woman and Supergirl, they have to turn to villains like Catwoman or Harley Quinn.

It’s worth noting that comics always struggled with their attempts to diversify, which they did for MARKET SHARE reasons, while movies, also after bigger MARKET SHARES and demographics (NOT agendas) has succeeded tremendously. 

Marvel Studios only goal with Black Panther and Captain Marvel was to increase their PROFITS. Both are HUGE successes paving the way for a diversified future. 

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1 hour ago, Chuck Gower said:

It’s worth noting that comics always struggled with their attempts to diversify, which they did for MARKET SHARE reasons, while movies, also after bigger MARKET SHARES and demographics (NOT agendas) has succeeded tremendously. 

Marvel Studios only goal with Black Panther and Captain Marvel was to increase their PROFITS. Both are HUGE successes paving the way for a diversified future. 

Well, I'd like to think that Stan Lee had not only profits in mind when he created Black Panther and Falcon, but was also thinking of a greater responsibility to the public. Many of us have read his famous soapbox about bigotry, I'd like to take him at his word. And I do. I'm a huge fan of his Silver Surfer series from the late 60's in which the hero, and thus Stan, waxed poetic about world and social issues. The series didn't sell well, and was soon cancelled, but Stan has consistently said it's his best work outside Spider-Man. And it was Stan who pushed for more solo female titles in the 70's, creating characters like Ms Marvel and Spider-Woman. Stan himself came out of his executive office for one month to write the origin of She-Hulk. Again, I'd like to think Stan did this not only for market share of female readers, but for a greater responsibility.

Edited by @therealsilvermane
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28 minutes ago, @therealsilvermane said:

Well, I'd like to think that Stan Lee had not only profits in mind when he created Black Panther and Falcon, but was also thinking of a greater responsibility to the public. Many of us have read his famous soapbox about bigotry, I'd like to take him at his word. And I do. I'm a huge fan of his Silver Surfer series from the late 60's in which the hero, and thus Stan, waxed poetic about world and social issues. The series didn't sell well, and was soon cancelled, but Stan has consistently said it's his best work outside Spider-Man. And it was Stan who pushed for more solo female titles in the 70's, creating characters like Ms Marvel and Spider-Woman. Stan himself came out of his executive office for one month to write the origin of She-Hulk. Again, I'd like to think Stan did this not only for market share of female readers, but for a greater responsibility.

Well... no question it was Stan AND Jack wanting to be topical, but it’s not like the character got his own comic to start.

And Stan is the one who chose to make the Panthers face mask a full mask, thus disguising his skin color. He worried about the reaction. 

It’s warranted for the time, and I still think it took guts to have the character in the first place, but... Stan was touring a LOT of college campus’ at the time and seeing a LOT of diverse faces out there...

It was being topical AND thinking it could be a successful sales idea...

Stan was an idea guy. But those ideas had to make money. 

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12 hours ago, MYNAMEISLEGION said:

Aaaaaand welcome to the ignore user club, you’re childish posts today are proof positive you have zero to contribute to this thread or this board.

Someone doesn't have a sense of humor. That's disappointing.

Edited by TwoPiece
Not sure that I care if someone who can't properly use "you're" correctly ignores me.
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5 hours ago, @therealsilvermane said:

$9.5 mil to catch Wonder Woman, can she do it once Endgame drops? I think so.

i expect her to be pretty big a deal in endgame; that should send lots of people who haven't yet seen it to the theater to catch up.  i think it gets a little endgame bump.

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On 4/23/2019 at 2:05 PM, @therealsilvermane said:

The Uncanny X-Men have always been a metaphor for civil rights whether Stan Lee or Chris Claremont wrote them.

And more specifically Stan modeled Professor X's preference for cooperating with humanity after Martin Luther King's preference for non-violence and cooperation between people of all races, whereas he modeled Magneto's belief in mutant empowerment over humanity after Malcolm X's belief that white people would never accept black people.

Edited by fantastic_four
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On 4/23/2019 at 11:00 AM, MYNAMEISLEGION said:

5BD40679-BAE3-4FD5-BD2A-613E58AC45C4.jpeg

I really miss people using the term chauvinist; I try to use it as much as I can to remind people it exists.  Social media has bred a penchant for exaggerating everything, and the word "misogynist" is used today in the same way the word "chauvinist" was used back then.  Chauvinism is bias towards or against a group of people, but the word misogyny--or misandry (hatred of men) or misanthropy (hatred of all people)--is far stronger than that and implies hatred of women.  People's penchant for exaggerating everything has changed the word misogyny to mean what chauvinism used to mean, which leaves us with no great word to describe people who truly do hate one gender or both.

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1 minute ago, fantastic_four said:

I really miss people using the term chauvinist; I try to use it as much as I can to remind people it exists.  Social media has bred a penchant for exaggerating everything, and the word "misogynist" is used today in the same way the word "chauvinist" was used back then.  Chauvinism is bias towards or against a group of people, but the word misogyny--or misandry (hatred of men) or misanthropy (hatred of all people)--is far stronger than that and implies hatred of women.  People's penchant for exaggerating everything has changed the word misogyny to mean what chauvinism used to mean, which leaves us with no great word to describe people who truly do hate one gender or both.

Exaggerating is in. It seems everyone now is using words like ‘amazing’ or ‘epic’ or ‘shocking’ or ‘outrageous’. It’s too much imo. Not everything is at a level 12. 

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4 minutes ago, bentbryan said:

Exaggerating is in. It seems everyone now is using words like ‘amazing’ or ‘epic’ or ‘shocking’ or ‘outrageous’. It’s too much imo. Not everything is at a level 12. 

How about the gag-inducing, "amaze-balls"?

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1 hour ago, bentbryan said:

Exaggerating is in. It seems everyone now is using words like ‘amazing’ or ‘epic’ or ‘shocking’ or ‘outrageous’. It’s too much imo. Not everything is at a level 12. 

I also am sick of people using the word "racist."  Racism is a spectrum, and we're all somewhere on it.  Far fewer people are the at the end of the spectrum of complete racial objectivity than think they are.  So you think that person over there is a racist because of <insert reason here>?  Well, are you living in an area where you're a minority in that area?  Have you dated and married people of a different race, and have you had mixed-race children yet?  If not, then perhaps there's still a thread or two of racism in you, too?  hm  Institutional segregation ended half a century ago, yet 80% or more of the major races in America have mostly self-segregated themselves into racially heterogeneous neighborhoods.  Much of that is more related to fleeing crime and poverty than race, but they're all wrapped together due to the history of slavery and Jim Crow, and the fact remains that voluntary racial segregation is still the reality of life for the great majority of people in America.

Racism is a relative concept.  Everyone who uses it about someone else tends to think that other person is more racist than they are, yet most of the people who use it are also more racist than someone else, too.  It's counterproductive to use the term except when describing a clearly extreme example of it.  There are much more appropriate and less inflammatory words to use that are FAR more effective in changing whoever you're trying to change in labeling someone as a racist.

Edited by fantastic_four
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