900K reserve not met on Frazetta painting.

[Bronty]

Chris, in fairness, one bid... when hte auction house is invested in the result... not super convincing.

[comix4fun]

Chris, in fairness, one bid... when hte auction house is invested in the result... not super convincing.

 

 

 

Please. He wanted to see the money. He's seen it. Said it wouldn't sell. It sold.

 

In fairness we have a documented sale. Anything else is undocumented speculation and conspiracy theory.

 

Until there's something, anything, actually showing this isn't a $1million + sale Mitch has to eat his words and admit he's wrong. Period.

 

He's not doing that. Now he's saying the piece that wasn't worth $750k, and that $650k would be pushing it, won't resell for $1.25 million.

 

I've got a limit to my BS tolerance and we're several posts beyond it.

 

 

[Mmehdy]

Chris, in fairness, one bid... when hte auction house is invested in the result... not super convincing.

 

 

 

Please. He wanted to see the money. He's seen it. Said it wouldn't sell. It sold.

 

In fairness we have a documented sale. Anything else is undocumented speculation and conspiracy theory.

 

Until there's something, anything, actually showing this isn't a $1million + sale Mitch has to eat his words and admit he's wrong. Period.

 

He's not doing that. Now he's saying the piece that wasn't worth $750k, and that $650k would be pushing it, won't resell for $1.25 million.

 

I've got a limit to my BS tolerance and we're several posts beyond it.

 

 

a PT Barnum sale does not make "value"..does not create a floor...and finding somebody with another million dollars in his pocket for a non-conan painting..well good luck..yes the money was shown..to my surprise..and it still in my opinion was over value sale...I like the painting, just don't see a million dollar value or recovery by the buyer.

 

I do not believe any board member agrees that buying that painting for 1.075 mill and the prospect of getting say 1.25 mil if you resell thru the same venue was good deal, a great deal..more like freak of nature...when looking at where the painting was on the free market bidding prior to the gallery price minimum bid...in fact this was a gallery sale at a auction with no under bidder 100's of thousands of dollars away...this is not bs, its market reality...

[Bronty]

Chris,

 

Sure the other side is that a sale happened and I have no doubt that if Halperin was the buyer that he wrote the check. Of course , the 20% BP is a bit 'left pocket right pocket' if it goes to an entity he's an owner in, and I don't think it's a repeatable sale whomever the buyer was, but yes, a sale.

 

In Gene's terms the 'price' was 1m+ but I would put the 'value' (the repeatable figure..) at something closer to what Mitch was arguing... 600..700... that range. Purely an opinion I can't substantiate of course.

 

 

[comix4fun]

Chris, in fairness, one bid... when hte auction house is invested in the result... not super convincing.

 

 

 

Please. He wanted to see the money. He's seen it. Said it wouldn't sell. It sold.

 

In fairness we have a documented sale. Anything else is undocumented speculation and conspiracy theory.

 

Until there's something, anything, actually showing this isn't a $1million + sale Mitch has to eat his words and admit he's wrong. Period.

 

He's not doing that. Now he's saying the piece that wasn't worth $750k, and that $650k would be pushing it, won't resell for $1.25 million.

 

I've got a limit to my BS tolerance and we're several posts beyond it.

 

 

a PT Barnum sale does not make "value"..does not create a floor...and finding somebody with another million dollars in his pocket for a non-conan painting..well good luck..yes the money was shown..to my surprise..and it still in my opinion was over value sale...I like the painting, just don't see a million dollar value or recovery by the buyer.

 

I do not believe any board member agrees that buying that painting for 1.075 mill and the prospect of getting say 1.25 mil if you resell thru the same venue was good deal, a great deal..more like freak of nature...when looking at where the painting was on the free market bidding prior to the gallery price minimum bid...in fact this was a gallery sale at a auction with no under bidder 100's of thousands of dollars away...this is not bs, its market reality...

 

 

Yet, a mismanaged non-sale does indicate value? You based your entire estimate of this piece on that.

 

Market reality is the piece sold, you said it wouldn't.

 

Market sales happen all the time with an asking price and a willing buyer. Most sales in the world are done in this fashion and not in an auction setting.

 

You could have admitted you misjudged the value on this piece (since this sale carries as much weight as the "comps" you used to set your own value) but you didn't. That tells everyone pretty much everything they need to know.

 

 

[tth2]

And I hope you got the context of that conversation. Mitch was trying to equate the Spiderman to At the Earth's Core...or put it in the same arena. Yet they differ in size, composition, and strata for frazetta. That's where the Chinese boy with bowl came from. It wasn't a put down of your piece as much as not every frazetta being a million bucks.

I prefer Spiderman to ATEC.

 

I understand why other people rate ATEC higher, particularly after they run the pieces through their Gene P. Pritchard art valuation algorithms, but I prefer Spiderman.

[comix4fun]

And I hope you got the context of that conversation. Mitch was trying to equate the Spiderman to At the Earth's Core...or put it in the same arena. Yet they differ in size, composition, and strata for frazetta. That's where the Chinese boy with bowl came from. It wasn't a put down of your piece as much as not every frazetta being a million bucks.

I prefer Spiderman to ATEC.

 

I understand why other people rate ATEC higher, particularly after they run the pieces through their Gene P. Pritchard art valuation algorithms, but I prefer Spiderman.

 

 

 

At some level it's a personal choice.

 

It only really becomes a question of A or B when you see them next to each other.

 

I believe the size of the Spiderman piece is much smaller than the ATEC.

 

Size does matter in art....compare ASM or FF page prices pre and post size change. It can make a difference in the market as well.

[delekkerste]

I prefer Spiderman to ATEC.

 

Would you still prefer it if you learned that it isn't Peter Parker that's killing the spider in the painting? Or if someone told you that Mark Rothko didn't do the color field background?

 

[MrBedrock]

 

Spider Man is Boris' Chinese Boy with Bowl

Totally agree

 

 

Bronty really really LOVES Boris' Chinese Boy with Bowl.

I'm lovin' me some Spiderman right now. I did have some pho earlier today. Bronty is A-Ok in my book. See you in Chicago?

 

 

Yes, sir.

 

And I hope you got the context of that conversation. Mitch was trying to equate the Spiderman to At the Earth's Core...or put it in the same arena. Yet they differ in size, composition, and strata for frazetta. That's where the Chinese boy with bowl came from. It wasn't a put down of your piece as much as not every frazetta being a million bucks.

Totally got it, and I agree. They are all different. No illusions that this one will ever be valued the same as any of Frazetta's other works. Higher than some, much much less than others.

[Silver Surfer]

Mitch your notion of what a piece of art is worth might as well come straight out of your arse. How do you explain when a piece of fine art sells for $100M+. Are you going to say "at $80M it's a deal but I just can't see it being worth $100M". I think all these mega dollar sales are ridiculous but for people with the cash to burn I don't think they really give a damn.

 

Mitch you can't take it with you when your gone so enjoy this stuff for what it is. The only PT Barnum act I see is your desire to make "I told you so predictions", who cares.

[tth2]

And I hope you got the context of that conversation. Mitch was trying to equate the Spiderman to At the Earth's Core...or put it in the same arena. Yet they differ in size, composition, and strata for frazetta. That's where the Chinese boy with bowl came from. It wasn't a put down of your piece as much as not every frazetta being a million bucks.

I prefer Spiderman to ATEC.

 

I understand why other people rate ATEC higher, particularly after they run the pieces through their Gene P. Pritchard art valuation algorithms, but I prefer Spiderman.

 

 

 

At some level it's a personal choice.

 

It only really becomes a question of A or B when you see them next to each other.

 

I believe the size of the Spiderman piece is much smaller than the ATEC.

 

Size does matter in art....compare ASM or FF page prices pre and post size change. It can make a difference in the market as well.

Of course, and size is definitely one of the factors that tilts most people generally in favor of ATEC.

 

But in my opinion it doesn't make it 3 times more valuable than Spiderman, and on a purely aesthetic basis, I prefer Spiderman.

[Bronty]

 

Spider Man is Boris' Chinese Boy with Bowl

Totally agree

 

 

Bronty really really LOVES Boris' Chinese Boy with Bowl.

I'm lovin' me some Spiderman right now. I did have some pho earlier today. Bronty is A-Ok in my book. See you in Chicago?

 

 

Yes, sir.

 

And I hope you got the context of that conversation. Mitch was trying to equate the Spiderman to At the Earth's Core...or put it in the same arena. Yet they differ in size, composition, and strata for frazetta. That's where the Chinese boy with bowl came from. It wasn't a put down of your piece as much as not every frazetta being a million bucks.

Totally got it, and I agree. They are all different. No illusions that this one will ever be valued the same as any of Frazetta's other works. Higher than some, much much less than others.

 

Fwiw of the recent sales I feel like you got the best value

[delekkerste]

But in my opinion it doesn't make it 3 times more valuable than Spiderman, and on a purely aesthetic basis, I prefer Spiderman.

 

Page 88 of the Tim Evans-Pritchard handbook says that a larger, more desirable Frazetta cannot be more than 1.67x more valuable as a smaller Frazetta, as long as the latter example is preferred by both the most vocal fan and most vocal critic of Boris Vallejo's artwork.

[tth2]

But in my opinion it doesn't make it 3 times more valuable than Spiderman, and on a purely aesthetic basis, I prefer Spiderman.

 

Page 88 of the Tim Evans-Pritchard handbook says that a larger, more desirable Frazetta cannot be more than 1.67x more valuable as a smaller Frazetta, as long as the latter example is preferred by both the most vocal fan and most vocal critic of Boris Vallejo's artwork.

It`s very simple. I`m always right, and Bronty, like a broken clock, is right twice a cycle.

[Hekla]

..... as long as the latter example is preferred by both the most vocal fan and most vocal critic of Boris Vallejo's artwork.

isn't this getting into 'Crossing the Streams' territory?

[Bronty]

But in my opinion it doesn't make it 3 times more valuable than Spiderman, and on a purely aesthetic basis, I prefer Spiderman.

 

Page 88 of the Tim Evans-Pritchard handbook says that a larger, more desirable Frazetta cannot be more than 1.67x more valuable as a smaller Frazetta, as long as the latter example is preferred by both the most vocal fan and most vocal critic of Boris Vallejo's artwork.

It`s very simple. I`m always right, and Bronty, like a broken clock, is right twice a cycle.

 

Wow you must be in a good mood today to allow that someone else is right twice a day. Thanks!

[comix4fun]

But in my opinion it doesn't make it 3 times more valuable than Spiderman, and on a purely aesthetic basis, I prefer Spiderman.

 

Page 88 of the Tim Evans-Pritchard handbook says that a larger, more desirable Frazetta cannot be more than 1.67x more valuable as a smaller Frazetta, as long as the latter example is preferred by both the most vocal fan and most vocal critic of Boris Vallejo's artwork.

It`s very simple. I`m always right, and Bronty, like a broken clock, is right twice a cycle.

 

Wow you must be in a good mood today to allow that someone else is right twice a day. Thanks!

 

 

I feel like this is one of those special moments on the boards where we all find our common ground.

 

[Bronty]

nice

[MrBedrock]

Fodder for you math nerds to do your calculations...

 

Spiderman is 16 X 20.

At The Earth's Core is 21 X 29

[comix4fun]

Fodder for you math nerds to do your calculations...

 

Spiderman is 16 X 20.

At The Earth's Core is ?

 

 

21.5"x29.5"

 

 

 

so 320 sq inches vs. 634.25 sq inches

 

 

Edit...for exactness