Eerie ashcan?
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126 posts in this topic

8 hours ago, SOLAR BOY said:

😩 this is an awesome mystery. Mine is passing all the tests.....where is that dude with the 63 criteria? Mine smells like cotton candy. Is that on his list? Haha 

One thing I can tell you for sure---your copy is different from all the others I've seen...

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12 hours ago, N e r V said:

In many ways the blue staple counterfeit is so important now to the history of this book it’s a badge of honor to own one. It’s not an exact copy but an original copy done “in-house” with its own original markings that separate it from any copy or replica that followed.

So though it’s not a true second printing since there wasn’t one but it’s as close as you could get. It’s also old itself now appearing about only a decade after the original. 

I think this statement is very debatable.  There are many indications that Jim Warren knew about and promoted a "special printing".  Your statement ignores this fact.  Was there also an unauthorized version produced by someone at Warren?  Yes, I believe there was.  But you speak with certainty on things you could not be certain about unless you were working at the Warren offices or have direct information from someone who was.

I'm just saying, I think you have to be careful about what you state as being known vs. what is supposition.  No matter how good the supposition is, it still has some uncertainty.  2c

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4 hours ago, The Lions Den said:

One thing I can tell you for sure---your copy is different from all the others I've seen...

You know as much or more about this than anyone (although you've always been very humble about it).  I'm curious- what's the most you would pay for any copy of Eerie 1?  More specifically, would you pay $1500 for a copy?  I know I wouldn't for the reasons I've stated before- there is just too much unknown and counterfeiters are very good at what they do.

If you're not comfortable answering, I understand.  Just thought I'd ask.

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38 minutes ago, Randall Dowling said:

You know as much or more about this than anyone (although you've always been very humble about it).  I'm curious- what's the most you would pay for any copy of Eerie 1?  More specifically, would you pay $1500 for a copy?  I know I wouldn't for the reasons I've stated before- there is just too much unknown and counterfeiters are very good at what they do.

If you're not comfortable answering, I understand.  Just thought I'd ask.

For you, Douglas, I'll answer just about anything...  :foryou:

I'm actually more interested in the history of the book than owning a copy of it. I'm very particular about my collection, and this book would be a bit of an aberration for me. I have examined various copies of it over the years, including the "blue staple" version, and to be brutally honest, I'm not impressed with it at all. I doubt Jim Warren himself really cared much about it except as a way to secure the title. Personally, I think Warren did some pretty sneaky stuff, but he certainly wasn't afraid to take risks and he was a great self-promoter. I admire him even though I don't always agree with his methods.  (worship)

To answer your question directly, I wouldn't pay much for any copy of this book except as an investment. And since it's difficult to determine if the book is genuine or not, it makes it even less desirable as such. What is desirable to me would be for CGC to certify it some day/year/decade, if only to make it easier for other collectors to complete their collections without the fear of being ripped off, but I'm afraid that ship has already sailed over the horizon...

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12 minutes ago, The Lions Den said:

For you, Douglas, I'll answer just about anything...  :foryou:

I'm actually more interested in the history of the book than owning a copy of it. I'm very particular about my collection, and this book would be a bit of an aberration for me. I have examined various copies of it over the years, including the "blue staple" version, and to be brutally honest, I'm not impressed with it at all. I doubt Jim Warren himself really cared much about it except as a way to secure the title. Personally, I think Warren did some pretty sneaky stuff, but he certainly wasn't afraid to take risks and he was a great self-promoter. I admire him even though I don't always agree with his methods.  (worship)

To answer your question directly, I wouldn't pay much for any copy of this book except as an investment. And since it's difficult to determine if the book is genuine or not, it makes it even less desirable as such. What is desirable to me would be for CGC to certify it some day/year/decade, if only to make it easier for other collectors to complete their collections without the fear of being ripped off, but I'm afraid that ship has already sailed over the horizon...

Very well said.  Thanks for your candor, sir.  Everything I know about the topic leads me to similar conclusions.  I understand @N e r V's frustrations about wanting this clarified.  I would like so also.  But, man, I've seen some very impressive counterfeiting in other collectibles that has given me a great deal of skepticism.  That included with the inconsistency of Warren's own recollection and the lack of clarity about the actual details of the first printing just leaves me cold when it comes to this book.

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2 minutes ago, Randall Dowling said:

Very well said.  Thanks for your candor, sir.  Everything I know about the topic leads me to similar conclusions.  I understand @N e r V's frustrations about wanting this clarified.  I would like so also.  But, man, I've seen some very impressive counterfeiting in other collectibles that has given me a great deal of skepticism.  That included with the inconsistency of Warren's own recollection and the lack of clarity about the actual details of the first printing just leaves me cold when it comes to this book.

Every counterfeit book I've ever seen has specific differences from the original. The trick is in knowing what those differences are...  :preach:

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5 hours ago, Randall Dowling said:

I think this statement is very debatable.  There are many indications that Jim Warren knew about and promoted a "special printing".  Your statement ignores this fact.  Was there also an unauthorized version produced by someone at Warren?  Yes, I believe there was.  But you speak with certainty on things you could not be certain about unless you were working at the Warren offices or have direct information from someone who was.

I'm just saying, I think you have to be careful about what you state as being known vs. what is supposition.  No matter how good the supposition is, it still has some uncertainty.  2c

Randall there are a few interviews with James Warren where he states that the blue staples were identifying marks of the original counterfeit copy. I’ve posted some them on the boards earlier. Outside of Overstreet there has never been a mention by James Warren or anyone else working at Warren of a second printing. I’ve requested Overstreet to please “update” his listing to no avail over the years.

I’ve never owned a original as I said before but have had a few blue staple copies my first acquired in the 1980’s.  
 

Even if none of the above information was available to me in interviews with James Warren and Archie Goodwin I still   have a meeting as a youngster with Archie Goodwin in which he congratulated me on getting the counterfeit copy when I showed him my first copy of the blue staple in the 1980’s. I also can identify 2 collectors who sent in blue staple copies to Warren years ago and had them identified as counterfeit copies. I believe a boardie here also claimed to have theirs sent back as a counterfeit as well.

So yeah, I’m comfortable that the blue staple copy is indeed the original counterfeit. 
 

And no, I don’t wish to go around with boardies like yourself who I like and respect so I’ll let my statements stand on their own merits for others to decide.

I continue to research Eerie #1 both originals and counterfeits. 
 

I will say on the subject having seen an original and blue staple and other counterfeits that the original and blue staple edition look in hand like a “printed” editions whereas all other counterfeits I’ve seen to this point look “copied” in hand. As Oakman pointed out it’s what you can’t see in any scans.

Still friends...:foryou:

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3 hours ago, The Lions Den said:

Every counterfeit book I've ever seen has specific differences from the original. The trick is in knowing what those differences are...  :preach:

There’s another “trick” out there too that a restorer pointed out to me. I’m thinking of not sharing though in order not to give anyone ideas on how to build a better counterfeit if so inclined...

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1 hour ago, N e r V said:

Randall there are a few interviews with James Warren where he states that the blue staples were identifying marks of the original counterfeit copy. I’ve posted some them on the boards earlier. Outside of Overstreet there has never been a mention by James Warren or anyone else working at Warren of a second printing. I’ve requested Overstreet to please “update” his listing to no avail over the years.

I’ve never owned a original as I said before but have had a few blue staple copies my first acquired in the 1980’s.  
 

Even if none of the above information was available to me in interviews with James Warren and Archie Goodwin I still   have a meeting as a youngster with Archie Goodwin in which he congratulated me on getting the counterfeit copy when I showed him my first copy of the blue staple in the 1980’s. I also can identify 2 collectors who sent in blue staple copies to Warren years ago and had them identified as counterfeit copies. I believe a boardie here also claimed to have theirs sent back as a counterfeit as well.

So yeah, I’m comfortable that the blue staple copy is indeed the original counterfeit. 
 

And no, I don’t wish to go around with boardies like yourself who I like and respect so I’ll let my statements stand on their own merits for others to decide.

I continue to research Eerie #1 both originals and counterfeits. 
 

I will say on the subject having seen an original and blue staple and other counterfeits that the original and blue staple edition look in hand like a “printed” editions whereas all other counterfeits I’ve seen to this point look “copied” in hand. As Oakman pointed out it’s what you can’t see in any scans.

Still friends...:foryou:

I'm not saying that you're wrong, but it doesn't explain this (apologies, I just copied this from a previous thread).  If you blow up the image to read the first paragraph, Warren refers to "This issue measured 5 1/4" wide by 7 1/4" high and was printed on special paper, using special staples".  I've already mentioned that I've seen 2 different types of blue staples.  It seems reasonable that one (or both) of those books meets the criteria described in this ad.  I think it's at least a possibility that:

a) Warren did not recall the sequence of events clearly years later when he was interviewed (I really don't want to get into a conversation about memory but it's pretty widely known that even eye witness testimony in court can be sketchy).

or

b) Warren, as a marketing ploy, declared that someone had "counterfeited" Eerie 1 and to his surprise, got a visit by the FBI and has been in damage control ever since

or

c) During one of Jim Warren's absences, somebody at the company legitimately produced a version of the book as a promotion.

All I'm saying, is that there are other possibilities than what you feel certain of.  I'm not saying you're wrong.  I'm just saying that, for me, none of what you're putting forth closes the book on this subject.  I think it's very possible that Bob Overstreet knows something you don't.  That's all.

Warren Reward.jpg

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So I’ll add a couple things to that. Again I’m only putting forth what I know and as with anything not trying to change minds only sharing information.

First my history with Eerie #1 came about as a kid. Prior to that ad you have up there for the reward in Warren magazines my family clipped a local article (I believe it ran in either the San Diego Union or Tribune at the time) that had a heading of the FBI looking for the Eerie #1 counterfeiter. That article appeared before the reward ads came out and was my introduction and fascination with the ash can. Seeing the Warren ads above only renew my nostalgia for it. The original article that ran in the local papers at the time had a photo of the ash can. It just seemed so cool. Much later Overstreet had their listing in the guide listing the counterfeit possibility.

So first about Overstreet. I love the guide. Bought my first one in 1976 but was aware of it since 1974 the year after I started collecting. Over the years I got him to update a few things after writing regularly (well I assume it was me...:nyah:). Still he was always slow, lazy, busy or whatever to ever update to accurate information. Forget about Eerie #1 for the moment and understand the Overstreet guide is still full of inaccurate information. Much of which has been there for many, many years now. This point has been discussed on the boards here and elsewhere many times. I asked him again to update his information on Eerie #1 in the last couple of years. I’m thinking he doesn’t do much if any updating these days because the guide seems to motor on outdated. In the past I’ve gotten responses back from him so I’m pretty sure if he knew something he would have replied at least once. 
 

Also I would have to ask if he knew something why has no one else mentioned it ever? There’s multiple articles with both James Warren and Archie Goodwin talking about the blue staples and other markers on the counterfeit. These go back to the late 70’s when it first became topic. They weren’t that old then. I’ve been collecting magazines and fanzines recently that have interviews with them and others at Warren for more background information. Several comments on the counterfeit but nada on a second printing.

 

The special paper and staples were talked about before. It was special but only in the sense of it being now identifying (there’s a clue in there too if you look :wink: ). Like many boardies on previous threads I take it as typical hyperbole of the time. I bought the Kiss magazine from Marvel at the time thinking it was full of Kiss blood.lol Remember that?

 

Anyway this topic as you and other points out makes the rounds. I’ll continue to research it because I like the history behind it. As I said it literally goes back to my childhood so owning an original first print is still a grail for me. Doesn’t mean I’ll ever own one though. Posting all this only makes me sad too because I really liked the times I got to speak with Archie Goodwin. A really interesting guy gone way to soon. If I knew then what I know now I’d have asked him many more questions about Warren but I was more interested in his Marvel work at the time. 
 

Finally I found one of the articles I posted before. This one is from Comic Artist #4 in 1999 and also appeared in the Warren companion. James Warren was around 68 years old at the time for anyone interested in his memory status. It’s pretty similar to previous interviews done a decade or so earlier....

 

 

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On 6/9/2020 at 4:51 PM, Randall Dowling said:

I'm not saying that you're wrong, but it doesn't explain this (apologies, I just copied this from a previous thread).  If you blow up the image to read the first paragraph, Warren refers to "This issue measured 5 1/4" wide by 7 1/4" high and was printed on special paper, using special staples".  I've already mentioned that I've seen 2 different types of blue staples.  It seems reasonable that one (or both) of those books meets the criteria described in this ad.  I think it's at least a possibility that:

a) Warren did not recall the sequence of events clearly years later when he was interviewed (I really don't want to get into a conversation about memory but it's pretty widely known that even eye witness testimony in court can be sketchy).

or

b) Warren, as a marketing ploy, declared that someone had "counterfeited" Eerie 1 and to his surprise, got a visit by the FBI and has been in damage control ever since

or

c) During one of Jim Warren's absences, somebody at the company legitimately produced a version of the book as a promotion.

All I'm saying, is that there are other possibilities than what you feel certain of.  I'm not saying you're wrong.  I'm just saying that, for me, none of what you're putting forth closes the book on this subject.  I think it's very possible that Bob Overstreet knows something you don't.  That's all.

Warren Reward.jpg

It might just be a bit of "all of the above" when it comes to Jim Warren. 🤔

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2 hours ago, eccomic said:

With further adieu I present my FIRST STATE Eerie # 1 Ashcan with provenance from the Publisher himself James Warren and signed by the man himself.

Awesome!

Now get out your magnifying glass, micrometer & tape measure because I think you will be asked a TON of questions about this!

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6 hours ago, eccomic said:

Yeah that’s funny in fact I did take the measurements and it’s exactly 7 1/4 inches high by 5 1/4 inches wide

This is 100% a first state  ashcan And the strongest provenance  I have ever seen

I'll say! You cant much more provenance than that.

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6 hours ago, eccomic said:

Yeah that’s funny in fact I did take the measurements and it’s exactly 7 1/4 inches high by 5 1/4 inches wide

This is 100% a first state  ashcan And the strongest provenance  I have ever seen

I would rather have this copy than anything that is supposed to be "9.6" or other high grades.  Awesome book, sir!  (thumbsu

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