Marvel Australian Price Variants 7 7

[Get Marwood & I]

Morning 

Two new mildly interesting ones today. First up, Wolverine #100:

Priced at a whopping $4.90 this issue completes the second wave Wolverine set:

No #77 yet incidentally, as is common for the first wave Apr-94's.

Next up, Conan #253:

I do like a comic with a blank little box to the right of the price box. This Conan is slightly unusual as it is priced at $1.50:

Every other AUS May 1992 dated book that I have captured has made the transition to $1.80 at this point. 

Up to 1,160 now.

[To Many Jeffs]

ISO Amazing Spider-Man #365 Canadian price edition. Just found out about this version today and very interested in purchasing one.

[Get Marwood & I]

Afternoon Aussie Collectors of Earth 

I am the bearer of splendid APV news. I've been contacted by a chap called Gary Martin Jr, based in the US, who has been doing what I've been doing on the other side of the pond - gathering Marvel Australian Price Variant images!  We've shared spreadsheets and it looks like I have about 80 that he doesn't have. The good news for this thread is that he has over 100 that I don't! Hooray!

I have a lot of work to do to integrate his information into my files / spreadsheet but the highlights are:

• We will have in excess of 1,260 confirmed images when I have finished 
• Two new annuals
• Lots of titles will be 'completed'
• Lots of gaps will show as consistent (e.g. ASM) - Gary has been collecting images for a lot longer than me and he doesn't have any new non-annual titles which strengthens the robustness of our research here

And there are a few quirks to report too! I posted details of the Captain America #410 earlier, misprinted with the issue number 407. Well, it turns out someone in officialdom spotted the error:

 

Gary's input is going to be invaluable to this project. Once I have added his copies I will be able to speculate much more accurately which gaps are likely to be permanent and, therefore, how may APVs we can expect there to be. This is one of the benefits of posting here - others get to see it and dive in with their own input. 

So, a big round of applause for Mr Martin, who I 'm sure will join the thread soon 

 

 

[revat]

10 minutes ago, Get Marwood & I said:

Afternoon Aussie Collectors of Earth 

I am the bearer of splendid APV news. I've been contacted by a chap called Gary Martin Jr, based in the US, who has been doing what I've been doing on the other side of the pond - gathering Marvel Australian Price Variant images!  We've shared spreadsheets and it looks like I have about 80 that he doesn't have. The good news for this thread is that he has over 100 that I don't! Hooray!

I have a lot of work to do to integrate his information into my files / spreadsheet but the highlights are:

• We will have in excess of 1,260 confirmed images when I have finished 
• Two new annuals
• Lots of titles will be 'completed'
• Lots of gaps will show as consistent (e.g. ASM) - Gary has been collecting images for a lot longer than me and he doesn't have any new non-annual titles which strengthens the robustness of our research here

And there are a few quirks to report too! I posted details of the Captain America #410 earlier, misprinted with the issue number 407. Well, it turns out someone in officialdom spotted the error:

 

Gary's input is going to be invaluable to this project. Once I have added his copies I will be able to speculate much more accurately which gaps are likely to be permanent and, therefore, how may APVs we can expect there to be. This is one of the benefits of posting here - others get to see it and dive in with their own input. 

So, a big round of applause for Mr Martin, who I 'm sure will join the thread soon 

 

 

Incredible 

congrats to both of you!

[Get Marwood & I]

2 minutes ago, revat said:

Incredible 

congrats to both of you!

I've had such a great week on comics Revat! Gary's files have so many of our missing issues, I was grinning ear to ear the whole time going through them. Lot's of things to discuss too. Now to upload them all!  

[xcomic]

Fantastic news, way to go Steve & Gary!!

Courtesy of Arron, the below is the indicia page of his Captain America numbered on the cover with #407 but showing the cover artwork for #410, confirming that it is indeed #410.

Arron also shared with me these missing APVs that follow, which you now may already have confirmed from Gary but here they are anyway just in case!

[Get Marwood & I]

30 minutes ago, xcomic said:

Fantastic news, way to go Steve & Gary!!

Courtesy of Arron, the below is the indicia page of his Captain America numbered on the cover with #407 but showing the cover artwork for #410, confirming that it is indeed #410.

103 titles, 1,255 confirmed issues and counting...

[Get Marwood & I]

OK, let's see what we've got 

I've made a first full pass of Gary's files and have added 95 new issues to my spreadsheet / files.

Here is the Current APV Confirmed Issue List link, showing 1,255 confirmed issues now of a maximum possible 1,704

I've added two new titles, both annuals:

  

 

That means we have ten confirmed annuals now, all priced at $4.75, all 1993 - Amazing Spider-Man #27, The Incredible Hulk #19, The Punisher #6, Silver Surfer #6, The Spectacular Spider-Man #13, The Mighty Thor #18, The Uncanny X-Men #17, X-Factor #8, X-Force #2 and X-Men #2. 

Here's one for @revat - Ravage #14:

  

Ravage #14 becomes only the fourth title to have an AUS April 1994 title confirmed. It also means we have to find #13 now 

Wolverine #57 remains conspicuous by it's absence:

I wonder if this means it will not exist:

  

Those 'official' looking stickers are becoming quite a thing aren't they...

I've filled a lot of titles, based on assumptions like April 1994 books being unlikely to exist, gaps where titles end together etc, so I will be speculating over the coming week what the overall total may end up being. There is the current total (1,255), the theoretical maximum (1,704) and the likely maximum, once the gaps etc have been accounted for.

I note that Gary had not found any non-annual title that I did not already have, which as I said earlier encourages me to have faith in the list of 103 that we now have. Missing two single issue annuals is quite easy to do given how comparatively scarce they are, whereas missing runs of a title are less so. And Gary did not have any of the 'missing' ASM issues which further supports my theory that they do not exist (where this whole journey began for me).

I'll post some more observations tomorrow.

All good fun 

[Get Marwood & I]

Hello 

According to the GCD, the title 'Avengers West Coast' ran for 55 issues from #48 to #102. Numbers 1-47 were called the altogether different 'West Coast Avengers', incidentally.

Accordingly, Avengers West Coast has 40 issues sitting in our AUS first wave date range - numbers 63 to, coincidentally, the final issue #102 which, having a US cover date of January 1994 means that it's AUS cover date would be three months later and be the last month of the first wave - the dreaded April 1994 for which only 4 titles currently have an AUS issue confirmed.

I now have a full run of 30 AUS images for issues 63 through to 92. Number 92 is AUS cover dated June 1993, the last month that titles were priced AUS $1.80. So the fact that all 30 of the first 30 issues have been found, none of the last possible ten issues have materialised, and that #92 was the last cover month at AUS $1.80 it would be reasonable to speculate that the AUS experiment ended there for this title.

 

Cage, Daredevil, The Fantastic Four and Nightstalkers all also appear to end at AUS Jun 1993 rather than make the jump to AUS $1.95 light speed. 

As things stand, I should be therefore able to reasonably mark the remaining ten AWC issues as 'NOAUS' and, in doing so, reduce the overall theoretical maximum by ten issues (currently at 1,704):

 

I plan to do that for all 103 titles over the coming weeks, but only for those where there is a reasonably strong case for doing so, like that above. If Avengers West Coast #94 turns up, brilliant, that will disprove the rationale and reopen the remaining ten. But I don't think it will. 

Once done, we should be able to say with a reasonable level of certainty the total number of AUS copies that may be out there. It will then be a simple case of seeing how long the figures last. The missing Amazing Spider-Man issues (340, 385 and 409) have been absent for over ten years, hence why they are already marked as 'NOAUS' on my spreadsheet:

 

I'll be interested to see where the final figure settles, once I have applied the theory to all 103 titles...

 

 

[Get Marwood & I]

Afternoon  

I've been having a great time merging Gary Martin Jr's work in with my own and getting his take on things. I think he will pop in to say hello here soon. 

The current confirmed APV number is now 1,262, with an actual possible maximum of 1,701 eligible issues across the 103 titles:

 

I've added some new elements to my capture spreadsheet:

• Under the 'Issues in Cover Date Range' line I've added a new line called 'Expected AUS Issues in Cover Date Range'. This will allow me to differentiate between how many issues technically exist within the agreed date range, and how many of them I believe will turn up as AUS copies. I've made a start on that, hence the reduced number in the second from bottom key row above
• In the key, I've added two extra elements:
  • Where I have confirmation that an AUS copy exists, but cannot quite make out the AUS price, I note that price on the sheet as $TBC until a clearer copy emerges
  • Where I see multiple examples of a US edition with an 'official' looking AUS price sticker (X-Force #1 and 2 for example), I record those issues on the sheet as 'stickered'. They do not form part of the overall number in my research as a US copy with a price sticker, regardless of how official it looks, cannot be called a price variant. Only a printed price fits the criteria

I'm hoping to complete the gap review over the weekend at which point I should be able to say:

• How many APVs are currently confirmed to exist (1,262)
• For those confirmed titles, how many issues exist in the APV date window (1,701)
• And finally how may APVs are expected to exist, once the obvious gaps have been accounted for / discounted (somewhere between the above two figures!)

Obviously, all figures change as and when a new title is discovered but, as I said in an earlier post, I take heart that Gary only had 2 that I didn't (and they were both annuals).

See ya soon!

Current Confirmed APV Issue List

 

 

[Get Marwood & I]

On 11/17/2019 at 6:38 PM, Get Marwood & I said:

Those 'official' looking stickers are becoming quite a thing aren't they...

I want to give full credit to Gary Martin for what is about to follow. Though I was on the hunt so to speak, it was his input that crystallised the position I'm about to summarise. 

As we know, an AUS price variant can have one or more of the following printed characteristics:

1. A printed AUS price (duh!) in the price box
2. In respect of the first wave, a cover date 3 months later than the US copy
3. In the vast majority of cases, a barcode cover with no 'CC' (Curtis Circulation) in the price / date box
4. An AUS price in the barcode box
5. A barcode with a month number that corresponds to the AUS cover date (3 months later for the first wave), not the US cover date

Taking these five main defining aspects into account (there are a few other cosmetic exceptions), if we look at the various copies that have surfaced with 'official' looking price stickers on them we can see four types (so far):

Type 1 - Standard US Direct Edition with AUS Price Sticker

The example here is X-Force #2, for which no APV has yet surfaced but multiple copies with an AUS price sticker have. In each case that I have seen, the book is a standard US priced Direct Edition. These cannot be referred to as APVs in my opinion as they have no printed variations. Anyone could make that sticker. Accordingly, I do not include them in the APV numbers, but I do make reference to them on my spreadsheet as an indication as to why a printed APV may never surface:

 

Type 2 - Standard US Newsstand Edition with AUS Price Sticker

The example here is Wolverine #57, for which no APV has yet surfaced but a copy with an AUS price sticker has. In this case, the book appears to be a standard US newsstand edition. Subject to knowing what is under the AUS price sticker (it certainly looks like the US version), it has the same printed cover as the US edition with a barcode month number of '8' in line with the US copy. As with type 1, I do not include it in the numbers as it has no printed variations to set it apart:

  

 

Type 3 - AUS Price Sticker with US Price / Date Box but APV Barcode

The example here is X-Force #3, for which no copy has surfaced with a printed AUS price but multiple stickered copies have. In this case, the book has a US price / date box, covered by an AUS price sticker (Gary has seen under the sticker to confirm this, and sent me an image). However, the barcode is a printed AUS barcode as the month number is '01' representing the January AUS cover date, not '10' which represents the US October cover date. In this case, the book has a printed variation / difference, and was clearly produced with the intention of the book being an APV. So I do count this copy in my records as an official APV, despite the lack of printed AUS cover price. The printers clearly just forgot to change the price / date box! 

  

 

Type 4 - AUS Price Sticker with AUS Price / Date Box 

The example here is Captain America #410, which I posted about earlier. In this case, the printers mistakenly printed the issue number as 407 and then added a correcting sticker. Effectively, two AUS versions of this book exist - stickered and unstickered - and both are confirmed AUS variants:

  

 

I'm going to carry on studying these stickered versions as they appear and the position may change if the contents under the sticker are not as expected (e.g. the Wolverine #57 could mirror the Captain America #407/410 scenario for example, though I doubt it based on what I can see around the edges of the sticker).

In the meantime, back to the probable APV issue count update...

 

 

[Get Marwood & I]

A quick interlude - as things stand, there are only 4 books with an AUS first wave April 1994 cover date (US January 1994):

1. Captain America #423
2. Ravage 2099 #14
3. Spider-Man 2099 #15
4. Web of Spider-Man #108

   

(Click to enlarge images)

48 of the 103 confirmed APV titles cross the April 1994 date. In my other research threads I have recently applied the idea of whether the 'on sale' dates have any bearing on why certain variant issues may not exist. It 'worked' for the Charlton CPVs, but not for the 1999/2000 Marvel Newsstand Price Variants.

Gary (him again) suggested it may have a bearing here on our APVs, so I did a review of all 48 eligible issues using Mikes Comics Newsstand for the 'on sale' dates. One issue here is that Mike's site has the on sale dates for the US copies of course, so we have to take a leap and work on the assumption that the AUS dates, with their 3 month shipping lag, followed the same sequencing. 

There are 5 'on sale' weeks for the books cover dated US Jan 94 / AUS April 94:

1. November 2 1993
2. November 9 1993
3. November 16 1993
4. November 23 1993
5. November 30 1993

Captain America #423, Web of Spidey #108 and Spidey 2099 #15 all were 'on sale' in the first week, November the 2nd. The fourth book, Ravage #14, was 'on sale' on the second week of the 9th November.

So we can kind of see that the AUS program may have wound up in the second week of the month.

Trouble is, 7 other of the eligible titles had a November 2 on sale date and a further 8 were in the second November 9 week. So it would be difficult to say that those 15 books were not produced as APVs as they have peers that did.

So I think there is something to it, but it does not definitely rule out any books from appearing at this stage. ASM #385 is a November 9 book, so that could technically exist given the other confirmed title for that month. But no one has seen one in all the years this has been going on so...

My summary therefore is there are 4 confirmed April 1994 APVs, of an actual maximum possible 48, but that relatively few more may surface given how long we have been looking. And if others do surface, they will likely be in the first two weeks 'on sale' bracket.

All good fun 

 

[xcomic]

2 hours ago, Get Marwood & I said:

So I do count this copy in my records as an official APV, despite the lack of printed AUS cover price.

Truly fascinating stuff, great to see these examples laid out.  This is the first time I've seen a "type 3" example -- that's quite awesome, and I completely agree with you that with this a printed difference (and clearly intended as an APV) that we must consider it one despite the mishap.

A reader I recently had a great email correspondence with about APVs turns out to have owned a newsstand decades back (a "newsagency" in the local terminology), and he let me know they were sometimes required to put stickers on various comic books and magazines -- at times because they were mispriced but he also mentioned censorship as another reason, with the rules about offensive materials varying by state.  (Although this may not have ever applied to APVs).

But an interesting tidbit he shared was that the distributors would supply the stickers to them, and their staff had to actually stick them on.  This would explain why sometimes we've seen copies lacking stickers, when the newstand staff missed any, either by mistake or on purpose (perhaps when a staff member themselves wanted to take a book home).

Cool stuff! :-)

- Ben

[Get Marwood & I]

3 minutes ago, xcomic said:

But an interesting tidbit he shared was that the distributors would supply the stickers to them, and their staff had to actually stick them on.  This would explain why sometimes we've seen copies lacking stickers, when the newstand staff missed any, either by mistake or on purpose (perhaps when a staff member themselves wanted to take a book home).

Cheers Ben - and it also explains why the stickers look so damn official! 

[masterlogan2000]

1 hour ago, Get Marwood & I said:

1 hour ago, xcomic said:

But an interesting tidbit he shared was that the distributors would supply the stickers to them, and their staff had to actually stick them on.  This would explain why sometimes we've seen copies lacking stickers, when the newstand staff missed any, either by mistake or on purpose (perhaps when a staff member themselves wanted to take a book home).

Cheers Ben - and it also explains why the stickers look so damn official! 

If this is proven to be true, that distributors themselves would supply the stickers, should those issues be included in the official listing?  Thoughts?

[Get Marwood & I]

8 minutes ago, masterlogan2000 said:

If this is proven to be true, that distributors themselves would supply the stickers, should those issues be included in the official listing?  Thoughts?

I would say no Masterlogan, as they can be replicated by anyone with a decent printer. For me, for a comic to be called a price variant it has to have a printed difference and, of course, be printed at the same time as the home original. A Mark JeweIers Insert copy for example isn't really a variant of the non-insert copy, as the insert can be removed or (if you're very skilful) added. Likewise a sticker can be removed or added.

It's great background information though, and helps to explain why some actual printed APVs don't (currently!) exist.

[Get Marwood & I]

4 hours ago, Get Marwood & I said:

Type 1 - Standard US Direct Edition with AUS Price Sticker

The example here is X-Force #2, for which no APV has yet surfaced but multiple copies with an AUS price sticker have. In each case that I have seen, the book is a standard US priced Direct Edition. These cannot be referred to as APVs in my opinion as they have no printed variations. Anyone could make that sticker. Accordingly, I do not include them in the APV numbers, but I do make reference to them on my spreadsheet as an indication as to why a printed APV may never surface:

X-Force #2 clearly had a few production issues.

Aside of the assumed failure to print APV copies, hence the stickered version here (nice shot)...

....and here (whoops, missed):

... every copy of the US Direct Edition has the remnants of the US Newsstand copy's 'cc 01766' Curtis Circulation code showing behind the UK 65p price:

 

 

What a muck up!

[Get Marwood & I]

OK, last AUS post for today (hooray you cry!) 

I've done a full first review of the spreadsheet and marked those books that I feel are obvious non-APV contenders accordingly. In doing so I found a few calculation errors.

The new figures are:

• 1,264 confirmed APVs
• 103 titles with one or more APV confirmed
• 1,699 actual issues in the date window (down from 1,701)
• 1,562 expected APV issues remaining following the first 'almost certain there will be no APV' pass

I believe the actual APV figure will still be significantly below 1,562, as it still includes the other 44 April 1994 books and a whole host of other scenarios where it is more likely than not that missing issues are missing by design.

So I'm going to give it another good while yet, to see what comes up, before I start knocking those off the list.

 

 

Here's one further example of books that may not exist.

Incredible Hulk has confirmed APVs for numbers 374 to 412. Every book has turned up in the first wave except #413 which, of course, is one of our absent April 1994 books. If we look at the second wave, only one book has surfaced - the last one, #447 (of which there are two versions incidentally):

 

It is quite common for a title with many first wave APVs to have no second wave books. So if it wasn't for #447, I would mark all ten books as 'NOAUS'. But as long as this one exists, the other 9 may:

 

They probably don't, but it's too early I feel to make that call.

We'll see. As it did with the missing ASM books, time will tell.

See ya next time for more 'Adventures in Tedium' 

[porcupine48]

Good work!A+

[Get Marwood & I]

29 minutes ago, porcupine48 said:

Good work!A+

APV+