Is Carbo allowed back into NYCC? 5 5

[shadroch]

That's what I'm trying to find out.

[wombat]

The police report states that he knew the stolen goods were being brought back to his booth. How they know this doesn't seem clear.

[Dr Chaos]

If any of the stolen goods were made available for sale in his booth, I would think he would be responsible for the booth and his helpers.

[shadroch]

Didn't this happen after the show ended? During breakdown?

[Duffman_Comics]

Yes.

 

Way after the show closed and booths were being broken down. CCTV confirms this.

 

Still don't understand the earlier thread pulling . . .

[jason4]

Maybe mike didn't know what that guy was doing. I'm pretty sure carbo is doing well with his sales that he wouldn't need to steal. He could easily sell a 20k book. Patz was probably just doing this to try to impress carbo. I hope carbo comments soon and sets things straight if that is the case. Silence implies guilt though if he never comments.

[Buzzetta]

Maybe mike didn't know what that guy was doing. I'm pretty sure carbo is doing well with his sales that he wouldn't need to steal. He could easily sell a 20k book. Patz was probably just doing this to try to impress carbo. I hope carbo comments soon and sets things straight if that is the case. Silence implies guilt though if he never comments.

 

Carbo does not have any books of his own to sell buy has been known to put interested parties together in making deals on books.

 

Carbo sells replicas of vintage movie posters.

 

Carbo is/was a buying agent and advisor for Dave and Adams.

 

Carbo is a promote of his own shows and may be an advisor for others.

[wombat]

We only know what was in the police report. Which specifically stated that Mike knew the stolen goods were being brought back to his booth. We can speculate of if this is true or not, but one would think there must have been some kind of evidence to generate that statement.

[HarveySwick]

What happened to the other thread?

 

[wombat]

What happened to the other thread?

 

 

 

I meant why?

[Kizarny]

Maybe mike didn't know what that guy was doing. I'm pretty sure carbo is doing well with his sales that he wouldn't need to steal. He could easily sell a 20k book. Patz was probably just doing this to try to impress carbo. I hope carbo comments soon and sets things straight if that is the case. Silence implies guilt though if he never comments.

 

Would the police would have gone out of their way to say in the report that Carbonaro "knew these thefts were occurring and product was being brought back to his booth" if there wasn't something serious to back it up? Especially since given the value this report would likely be used in any attempts at legal recourse.

[comix4fun]

We only know what was in the police report. Which specifically stated that Mike knew the stolen goods were being brought back to his booth. We can speculate of if this is true or not, but one would think there must have been some kind of evidence to generate that statement.

 

 

 

I think there were two separate actions taken. One by the police, against Patz, who was working out of Carbonaro's booth, and another by Reed and Javits management against Patz and Carbonaro.

 

The article mentions Carbonaro, after interview with the police, knew what Patz did or was going to do and that the items were stolen. That may have come from Patz or Carbo. So the actions taken against Carbonaro, according the the article, may be something far more simple given that he wasn't the direct subject of the prosecution.

 

Being that Patz was working out of Carbonaro's booth, he undoubtedly had one of Carbonaro's convention badges. As SDCC, Reed and Wizard have all made clear, the booth owner is responsible for the actions of the people wearing that booth's badges at the show. If you sell your badges to random people and they commit a crime, break a rule, pull a fire alarm, run naked (except for the badge) through the convention, etc. the booth owner is going to run the risk of getting punished for being the catalyst for this person to be in attendance.

 

So, now you've got a criminal prosecution against Patz, who was most likely wearing a Carbonaro badge at the show, and Javits and Reed giving Carbo the death penalty for giving his badge to someone who used it to enter someone's booth without permission and remove items which resulted in a criminal prosecution and a subsequent plea deal.

 

And, yes, this was after the show ended but before the Eaglemoss booth was broken down. The "tradition of comic-con salvage" applies to the piles in the middle of the aisles, usually next to garbage cans, and NOT someone going into a booth that isn't broken down and helping themselves to items that are clearly not thrown away.

[Black_Adam]

I see that Patz took stuff, and brought it back to Carbos booth. Maybe I missed it but was it stated that Mike was present in the booth?

 

Guilty by association, apparently.

 

I'm no lawyer and I have never had any dealings with any of these individuals, but it is my understanding that no one was found guilty of anything.

 

Patz was accused of and charged with both grand larceny and possession of stolen property, but accepted an adjournment in contemplation of dismissal of all charges. This is not a conviction, per the interweb:

 

An ACD is not a guilty plea or an admission of guilt. The law is clear: "The granting of an adjournment in contemplation of dismissal shall not be deemed to be a conviction or an admission of guilt." N.Y. Criminal Procedure Law 150.55(8).

 

Additionally, none of the other individuals accused of being participants in the so-called "booth raid" were charged with any crimes.

 

NYCC has given these individuals a lifetime ban, that is a fact. But the assumption (and discussion) that they are guilty of criminal actions only one of them was charged with and none of them was convicted of, is doing them a disservice.

 

That is probably why the other thread was deleted.

 

 

[MustEatBrains]

Maybe mike didn't know what that guy was doing. I'm pretty sure carbo is doing well with his sales that he wouldn't need to steal. He could easily sell a 20k book. Patz was probably just doing this to try to impress carbo. I hope carbo comments soon and sets things straight if that is the case. Silence implies guilt though if he never comments.

 

Would the police would have gone out of their way to say in the report that Carbonaro "knew these thefts were occurring and product was being brought back to his booth" if there wasn't something serious to back it up? Especially since given the value this report would likely be used in any attempts at legal recourse.

 

Doubt it. They conducted interviews/investigation so something most likely came up that prompted them to include that statement. Should be noted that the investigation was stated as "preliminary" which gives them room to change that should more info come to light.

[comix4fun]

I see that Patz took stuff, and brought it back to Carbos booth. Maybe I missed it but was it stated that Mike was present in the booth?

 

Guilty by association, apparently.

 

I'm no lawyer and I have never had any dealings with any of these individuals, but it is my understanding that no one was found guilty of anything.

 

Patz was accused of and charged with both grand larceny and possession of stolen property, but accepted an adjournment in contemplation of dismissal of all charges. This is not a conviction, per the interweb:

 

An ACD is not a guilty plea or an admission of guilt. The law is clear: "The granting of an adjournment in contemplation of dismissal shall not be deemed to be a conviction or an admission of guilt." N.Y. Criminal Procedure Law 150.55(8).

 

Additionally, none of the other individuals accused of being participants in the so-called "booth raid" were charged with any crimes.

 

NYCC has given these individuals a lifetime ban, that is a fact. But the assumption (and discussion) that they are guilty of criminal actions only one of them was charged with and none of them was convicted of, is doing them a disservice.

 

That is probably why the other thread was deleted.

 

 

 

Different standards. There's "not found guilty of anything" in court, because of a plea deal.

 

Everyone else is free to read the uncontested fact pattern and make up their own mind.

 

Video of a person matching the description of Patz entering the Eaglemoss booth.

Video of a person matching the description of Patz leaving the Eaglemoss booth with several items.

Video of a person matching the description of Patz carrying those Eaglemoss booth items back to Booth 1520.

Eaglemoss calling security and detailing a list of items stolen from their booth.

The police and convention security investigate the theft, viewing video, interviewing several parties.

Those parties implicate Patz and Carbonaro.

In the midst of these interviews Patz is in possession of most of the items identified by Eaglemoss as stolen.

Those items are recovered from Patz.

Patz agrees to a plea bargain which keeps the possibility of conviction for several crimes off of his record.

Patz and Carbonaro are banned from Reed shows and the Javits center permanently.

 

 

So, yeah, simply because no one was convicted of a crime we should not discuss that it's possible, given these facts, that one occurred.

 

[comix4fun]

Maybe mike didn't know what that guy was doing. I'm pretty sure carbo is doing well with his sales that he wouldn't need to steal. He could easily sell a 20k book. Patz was probably just doing this to try to impress carbo. I hope carbo comments soon and sets things straight if that is the case. Silence implies guilt though if he never comments.

 

Would the police would have gone out of their way to say in the report that Carbonaro "knew these thefts were occurring and product was being brought back to his booth" if there wasn't something serious to back it up? Especially since given the value this report would likely be used in any attempts at legal recourse.

 

Doubt it. They conducted interviews/investigation so something most likely came up that prompted them to include that statement. Should be noted that the investigation was stated as "preliminary" which gives them room to change that should more info come to light.

 

 

Actually, that report of from Javits security, who was present during the police investigation.

They included the results of those interviews. They did so most likely to provide context to their decision to ban both Patz AND Carbonaro.

[MustEatBrains]

Maybe mike didn't know what that guy was doing. I'm pretty sure carbo is doing well with his sales that he wouldn't need to steal. He could easily sell a 20k book. Patz was probably just doing this to try to impress carbo. I hope carbo comments soon and sets things straight if that is the case. Silence implies guilt though if he never comments.

 

Would the police would have gone out of their way to say in the report that Carbonaro "knew these thefts were occurring and product was being brought back to his booth" if there wasn't something serious to back it up? Especially since given the value this report would likely be used in any attempts at legal recourse.

 

Doubt it. They conducted interviews/investigation so something most likely came up that prompted them to include that statement. Should be noted that the investigation was stated as "preliminary" which gives them room to change that should more info come to light.

 

 

Actually, that report of from Javits security, who was present during the police investigation.

The included the results of those interviews. They did so most likely to provide context to their decision to ban both Patz AND Carbonaro.

 

Makes sense.

[comicwiz]

Didn't this same exact thing happen to Barbara Streisand's house?

 

Threads that just magically disappear should be called the.... "Carbonaro Effect".

 

 

 

 

[ChiSoxFan]

If you sell your badges to random people and they commit a crime, break a rule, pull a fire alarm, run naked (except for the badge) through the convention, etc. the booth owner is going to run the risk of getting punished for being the catalyst for this person to be in attendance.

 

That badge had better be in a lanyard ...

[Bird]

Didn't this same exact thing happen to Barbara Streisand's house?

 

Threads that just magically disappear should be called the.... "Carbonaro Effect".

 

 

 

 

 

I prefer to consider them carbonated.