Marvel UK Price Variants 16 16

[Get Marwood & I]

1 hour ago, mec3437 said:

@Get Marwood & I, this has been incredibly in-depth and interesting to read.  I don't know how long you have been researching and diving into the pence copies, but you've done a magnificent job.  I've only recently acquired a few pence copies of books.  Captain Marvel 25, Fantastic Four 59, and Avengers 196.  I did a little of my own research into it before making purchases.  But, as far as my collection goes, they are a nice addition, and something more unique than the standard cents copy.  The thrill of finding high grade pence copies interests me.  I know it isn't everyone's cup of tea, but to each their own.  I've seen people into Whitman copies, Canadian newsstand copies, and US newsstand copies, but the pence copies seem almost undervalued to me.  I feel like there would be less of them and the journey to the UK would take its toll on some books.  Again, though, fantastic read and look forward to more posts in this thread!

Hey, that's really kind of you to say mec3437. It's great to get feedback and to know that a few people are enjoying the research. I used to collect all things Spidey and have had, funnily enough, Whitmans (although you're technically not allowed to call them that), Canadians, US newsstands and directs in my time. And Australian copies and, of course, pence copies. The versions that move outside of US pricing are understandably going to attract less interest as the majority of collectors are US based and even those in the UK tend to favour the 'purity' of cents copies. But I have always liked a variant and so have spent years documenting them. I don't maintain to be an expert on pence books, but I do hope I have the most definitive lists of what exists for the seven publishers that produced them. And I do enjoy speculating on the reasons why some books may or may not exist.

I'm glad you dropped by - encouraging posts like yours keep me going. It can be a lonely pursuit, so its' nice to know others find it interesting. Cheers! Steve 

[Get Marwood & I]

...Oh, and we need to move back to 3,017 confirmed copies I'm afraid as a friend has spotted an error on my spreadsheet. Drat! 

[Get Marwood & I]

Here's a nice early 9d pence book in uncommonly good shape - Strange Tales #75 dated June 1960:

Lovely isn't it 

Gunsmoke Western #58 and Journey Into Mystery #58 jointly occupy the title of 'first two Marvel pence priced books', dated May 1960. Strange Tales #75 is joint 'second' with Patsy and Hedy #70, Patsy Walker #89, Two-Gun Kid #54 and Wyatt Earp #29, all dated June 1960. So one of the first seven pence books produced.

Here's a shot of the indicia - a type 1b as you can see, further to my earlier post about Thorpe & Porter indicia types:

And here's the back cover:

I don't usually post back cover scans, but this one had a nice little date stamp on it. Looks like it took 3 months to cross the ocean:

I like date stamps 

[Get Marwood & I]

On 11/28/2018 at 4:24 PM, Get Marwood & I said:

...Oh, and we need to move back to 3,017 confirmed copies I'm afraid as a friend has spotted an error on my spreadsheet. Drat! 

On the subject of numbers, those following this thread from the start will be aware of my 'missing list'. This was a list of books for which I believed an as yet undiscovered pence copy may have existed. Now that I have completed the L Miller indicia picture, the comparative gap analysis (i.e. the date scenarios where groups of books all miss the same titles) and the price font analysis, I'm fairly confident that there is only one potential pence book left to discover now. That book is Battle #70. It's the last issue in the title, so the odds should be stacked against it, but so is Wyatt Earp #29 and that has a pence copy. It has both 'fat' and 'tall' cents font copies, hence my belief that a pence copy may exist. 

So from this point, the missing list is officially retired.

If I'm right, and Battle #70 surfaces, the number of Marvel comics with pence printed prices will increase and then remain at 3,018. To recap, the current 3,017 figure assumes:

• I haven't made any further mistakes in the calculations on my tracking spreadsheet (they've recently been checked by a friend, hence the one book reduction)
• I haven't missed any titles
• The analysis as to why certain early books will not be found is robust

As with the recent Marvel Super Heroes find, there is always a chance that a further later dated book may appear but I think that was a one off. Only time will tell of course. The 3,017 by the way only covers standard comic size books. It excludes magazines, Treasury Editions (which I've summarised earlier in the thread) and oversize books. 

That being the case, there isn't much left to report on now. I've tried to cover every unique aspect of pence books, not only just what exists, and tried to make it entertaining on route. So this thread will likely dry up now as I have nothing left to post! 

I hope those of you that joined in found it interesting and I'm grateful for your input. 

My next task is to load all the missing images up to the GCD. I would have liked to post them here but the software doesn't lend itself to doing it in the structured manner I'd like. So keep an eye on the GCD next year, and you'll start to see them all appear.

In the meantime, I'll only post in this thread now if someone asks a question or if I get a particularly nice new copy to show off. Or of course if I or someone else finds a new book!

Never say never 

Cheers, Steve 

[Redshade]

4 hours ago, Get Marwood & I said:

On the subject of numbers, those following this thread from the start will be aware of my 'missing list'. This was a list of books for which I believed an as yet undiscovered pence copy may have existed. Now that I have completed the L Miller indicia picture, the comparative gap analysis (i.e. the date scenarios where groups of books all miss the same titles) and the price font analysis, I'm fairly confident that there is only one potential pence book left to discover now. That book is Battle #70. It's the last issue in the title, so the odds should be stacked against it, but so is Wyatt Earp #29 and that has a pence copy. It has both 'fat' and 'tall' cents font copies, hence my belief that a pence copy may exist. 

So from this point, the missing list is officially retired.

If I'm right, and Battle #70 surfaces, the number of Marvel comics with pence printed prices will increase and then remain at 3,018. To recap, the current 3,017 figure assumes:

• I haven't made any further mistakes in the calculations on my tracking spreadsheet (they've recently been checked by a friend, hence the one book reduction)
• I haven't missed any titles
• The analysis as to why certain early books will not be found is robust

As with the recent Marvel Super Heroes find, there is always a chance that a further later dated book may appear but I think that was a one off. Only time will tell of course. The 3,017 by the way only covers standard comic size books. It excludes magazines, Treasury Editions (which I've summarised earlier in the thread) and oversize books. 

That being the case, there isn't much left to report on now. I've tried to cover every unique aspect of pence books, not only just what exists, and tried to make it entertaining on route. So this thread will likely dry up now as I have nothing left to post! 

I hope those of you that joined in found it interesting and I'm grateful for your input. 

My next task is to load all the missing images up to the GCD. I would have liked to post them here but the software doesn't lend itself to doing it in the structured manner I'd like. So keep an eye on the GCD next year, and you'll start to see them all appear.

In the meantime, I'll only post in this thread now if someone asks a question or if I get a particularly nice new copy to show off. Or of course if I or someone else finds a new book!

Never say never 

Cheers, Steve 

I've said it before Steve but it's worth saying again: I am in awe of the time and effort it must have taken to do all the research for these pence threads of yours. Good luck with your uploading to the GCD, it would've been a shame not to publish these somewhere. Kind regards. Stephen,

[Get Marwood & I]

8 minutes ago, Redshade said:

I've said it before Steve but it's worth saying again: I am in awe of the time and effort it must have taken to do all the research for these pence threads of yours. Good luck with your uploading to the GCD, it would've been a shame not to publish these somewhere. Kind regards. Stephen,

Cheers Stephen!  We've still got Archie, Charlton, Dell, Gold Key and King ongoing, so the pence flag will continue to fly here for a while yet 

[nmtg9]

Steve, this has been a phenomenon effort.  You succeeded where Kev and I couldn't.

Do you have the'final' spreadsheet to share?

Neil

[Get Marwood & I]

12 hours ago, nmtg9 said:

Steve, this has been a phenomenon effort.  You succeeded where Kev and I couldn't.

Do you have the'final' spreadsheet to share?

Neil

Thanks Neil. PM incoming 

[1950's war comics]

On 12/3/2018 at 10:33 AM, Get Marwood & I said:

On the subject of numbers, those following this thread from the start will be aware of my 'missing list'. This was a list of books for which I believed an as yet undiscovered pence copy may have existed. Now that I have completed the L Miller indicia picture, the comparative gap analysis (i.e. the date scenarios where groups of books all miss the same titles) and the price font analysis, I'm fairly confident that there is only one potential pence book left to discover now. That book is Battle #70. It's the last issue in the title, so the odds should be stacked against it, but so is Wyatt Earp #29 and that has a pence copy. It has both 'fat' and 'tall' cents font copies, hence my belief that a pence copy may exist. 

So from this point, the missing list is officially retired.

If I'm right, and Battle #70 surfaces, the number of Marvel comics with pence printed prices will increase and then remain at 3,018. To recap, the current 3,017 figure assumes:

• I haven't made any further mistakes in the calculations on my tracking spreadsheet (they've recently been checked by a friend, hence the one book reduction)
• I haven't missed any titles
• The analysis as to why certain early books will not be found is robust

As with the recent Marvel Super Heroes find, there is always a chance that a further later dated book may appear but I think that was a one off. Only time will tell of course. The 3,017 by the way only covers standard comic size books. It excludes magazines, Treasury Editions (which I've summarised earlier in the thread) and oversize books. 

That being the case, there isn't much left to report on now. I've tried to cover every unique aspect of pence books, not only just what exists, and tried to make it entertaining on route. So this thread will likely dry up now as I have nothing left to post! 

I hope those of you that joined in found it interesting and I'm grateful for your input. 

My next task is to load all the missing images up to the GCD. I would have liked to post them here but the software doesn't lend itself to doing it in the structured manner I'd like. So keep an eye on the GCD next year, and you'll start to see them all appear.

In the meantime, I'll only post in this thread now if someone asks a question or if I get a particularly nice new copy to show off. Or of course if I or someone else finds a new book!

Never say never 

Cheers, Steve 

Atlas Battle #70 (Kirby cover) is one of my favorite comics from that run.....

[Get Marwood & I]

9 hours ago, 1950's war comics said:

Atlas Battle #70 (Kirby cover) is one of my favorite comics from that run.....

Yeah. Be nice if it had a pence copy. Cents copies are scarce enough though...

[Get Marwood & I]

On 12/3/2018 at 3:33 PM, Get Marwood & I said:

In the meantime, I'll only post in this thread now if someone asks a question or if I get a particularly nice new copy to show off. Or of course if I or someone else finds a new book!

You know that thing when you wait for a bus, and it doesn't come, but you carry on waiting, and it doesn't come, but you don't want to start walking because you know the minute you do it will come, so you carry on waiting, and it doesn't come, so you finally get up and start walking, and you keep looking back, and it doesn't come, and then just as you're too far away to run back, it comes?

Well this is a bit like that. 

Having said there is 'nothing new to say' on Marvel pence books, here's something new to say, courtesy of our friend and neighbour Thread Miller (nice chap, with an unusual first name spelling who few have heard of):

 

The title 'Amazing Adventures' has always been a puzzle as it has 9d pence copies for #5 and 6 only. There's no obvious reason why 1-4 weren't produced, as other titles at the time were. But thanks to the discovery that 1-4 have L Miller indicias, we can now see why:

 

We know from the Miller research that the presence of a Miller indicia means that Thorpe & Porter didn't pick up the title, and we know that the second Miller date tranche (Sep 1960 - Aug 1961) has books with only 10c cover prices (plus our new Sep dated #4). So Amazing Adventures 1-4 can't exist with 9d prices.

Another little bit of info on the 'what does / doesn't exist' debate.

See you next year 

 

[mikeyc67]

Hi Steve

Picked this L Miller Rawhide Kid up this week - didn't notice the stamp until arrived!

Mikey

[ADAMANTIUM]

2 minutes ago, mikeyc67 said:

Hi Steve

Picked this L Miller Rawhide Kid up this week - didn't notice the stamp until arrived!

Mikey

 took me a minute too. Nice spot for it though, finally a bookstore with some pizzazz!

[Get Marwood & I]

On 12/13/2018 at 11:06 PM, mikeyc67 said:

Hi Steve

Picked this L Miller Rawhide Kid up this week - didn't notice the stamp until arrived!

Mikey

Well done Mikey! I was the under bidder.  I already have a copy but mine doesn't have the 6d cover stamp so I thought I'd have a go. It's a great book with or without the Miller indicia 

[Get Marwood & I]

On 11/24/2018 at 2:36 PM, Get Marwood & I said:

Fun With Marvel Pence Variant Indicias Chapter One: The Thorpe & Porter Years

Morning 

Since I stated that this thread would dry up as there was 'nothing new to find / say', I've done nothing but find new things to say. Life's like that isn't it.

Here's my latest pence acquisition, Journey into Mystery #60, 9d printed copy:

 

Nice isn't it.

I purchased it because the ebay listing photos showed a tiny smidgen of the indicia page and the alarm bells rang. Here is the indicia page:

 

Looking closely, it's not like the other three types of indicia that I outlined in my earlier research posts. It's unique for three reasons:

1. It has the big bold T&P writing, and the original US indicia details (unlike all the others produced between May 1960 and December 1960 which only have the big bold T&P writing)
2. It's the only Marvel book to have this type of indicia
3. It's the only September 1960 Marvel book to have this type of indicia - a summary of the others:
   • Gunsmoke Western #60 (10c L Miller indicia)
   • Kid Colt Outlaw #92 (No pence copy believed to exist due to the 'bold cents font scenario' outlined earlier in this thread)
   • Love Romances #89 (No pence copy believed to exist due to the 'bold cents font scenario' outlined earlier in this thread)
   • Millie The Model #98 (No pence copy believed to exist due to the 'bold cents font scenario' outlined earlier in this thread)
   • Tales to Astonish / Tales of Suspense #11 (No pence copies believed to exist due to the font / gap scenarios outlined earlier in this thread)
   • Teen-Age Romance #79 (No pence copy believed to exist due to the 'bold cents font scenario' outlined earlier in this thread)
4. It has 'Thorpe' spelled incorrectly

Sorry, four reasons of uniqueness (no Count this time, or Spanish Inquisition jokes)

So this issue is unique

 

It means I have to update my summary chart and here's the first draft of it:

 

We now have five types of variant pence indicias - one Miller and four T&Ps.

All good fun, if you like that kind of thing 

 

 

 

 

[Get Marwood & I]

Afternoon 

Here's a list of the first 20 confirmed Marvel pence priced variants which I put together a while ago whilst investigating indicias. They go in alpha order by title where there are multiples in the same month of course - GW#58 and JIM #58 are joint first etc

I have a few myself happily, and may go for the full set in the new year. It's something to do isn't it 

  

    

  

 

[Get Marwood & I]

Here is an updated 'key pence dates' list, which I posted long ago at the start of this thread.

As well as a few changes, I've added in the when the regional UK indicias started / stopped and also the same for the cover months:

 

When pence variants first appeared they had two differences to their US counterparts - cover price and a regional / UK indicia. They actually started with cover months - here's an early example, Strange Tales #75 from June 1960:

 

For issues indicia dated April/May 1961, the cover month was removed, we are told to accommodate the time it took to ship the comics to the UK. Here's Tales to Astonish #19 from May 1961, to illustrate the missing cover month:

 

From Aug/Sep 1965, after a short break in pence copies, the cover month returned along with an increased price - 9d to 10d. Here's Tales of Suspense #69  from September 1965 to illustrate:

 

It's handy to know these things given the fact that unscrupulous people are seemingly quite prepared to try to pass off pence copies as cents copies by removing the cover prices (see my recent CGC graded ASM #1 example). If you know what to look for, you can have up to three differences to help you in such scenarios (price, date and indicia) depending on the date of the issue.

All good fun 

[Get Marwood & I]

On 12/15/2018 at 12:12 PM, Get Marwood & I said:

We now have five types of variant pence indicias - one Miller and four T&Ps.

It's never ending! I've found another type that isn't any of the above! Back to the drawing board, again.... 

I don't know. Never count your pence chickens before they've roosted their indicia variations. I've always said it. Belt and braces coming up soon.... 

[mec3437]

Is there a good venue for buying pence variants?  I've bought from eBay, 30th Century Comics but some sellers are hit and miss with grading.  I'm usually looking for VF+ and higher.  I have one contact in the UK, but he's struggled in helping as well.  It could just be a patience game.

[Get Marwood & I]

On 12/19/2018 at 2:25 AM, mec3437 said:

Is there a good venue for buying pence variants?  I've bought from eBay, 30th Century Comics but some sellers are hit and miss with grading.  I'm usually looking for VF+ and higher.  I have one contact in the UK, but he's struggled in helping as well.  It could just be a patience game.

Yep, it's not easy to find high grade early pence books any more. A patience game it is.