Avengers 4 possible trimming 0

[marmat]

Avengers 4 possible trimming

Do you find any evidence of trimming?

I am not sure, but the right edge of the cover looks odd to me

[comicquant]

I'm definitely not an expert but from the way the corners curl upward with a straight edge it appears to have been trimmed.  Can you take a picture of the cross section so we can see how the outer edges of the pages line up?  If its been trimmed the outer edge is typically a 90 degree angle to the surface of the book.  

[marmat]

The book is not mine, I am in negotiation to buy it. The top and bottom edge look not as straight as the right edge

[zosocane]

Ask seller to give you a no-resto guarantee for a 90-day period, then send book to CGC.  Take no risks.

[marmat]

With this doubt about trimming, I'll probably not buy it.

I am not afraid about loosing my money, paypal would refund me if certified as trimming. I just don't want to handle the buying, shipping to CGC (I am in Spain) for around $50, and having back (more shipping cost) just to fight with the seller to send it back to him (again, more shipping)

[Bomber-Bob]

The top and bottom edges show obvious wear while the right edge is straight and sharp. I wouldn't buy this book.

[PhilipB2k17]

It's not "possible" trimming, it's probable. 

[rjpb]

It's really hard to say on these earlier Marvels. If it is trimmed, it's not by much, as the width of the artwork is in line with most other copies. Check images of slabbed copies, some are cut even tighter to the CCA stamp, while giving no extra art at the spine edge. There are Marvels from this era with funky, diagonal cuts as well. 

Nobody likes trimming, it feels like a cheat, and on a high grade book it's understandably a huge value killer, but honestly on lower grade books, if it's not obvious, it shouldn't be as critical as some make it out to be on older books, which can vary as much as a half inch across in width from the printers, when it comes to GA. 

This particular copy is tricky, as while it has a lot of dings and dents, much of looks like it could be pressed out, which would only be worth it if it were not trimmed. Page quality and color look nice, though.

It looks as if slabbed 4.0 copies sell for around $750 and up, raw maybe $100 less, and anything in at least GD starts at around $300 raw or slabbed. If i were buying to keep raw and in my collection, I might pay $500 or so, even with the chance it might be trimmed. Much more than that, and one might as well buy slabbed for the piece of mind, it's not as if there aren't always copies available.

 

[Bomber-Bob]

11 minutes ago, rjpb said:

It's really hard to say on these earlier Marvels. If it is trimmed, it's not by much, as the width of the artwork is in line with most other copies.

 

Trimming is always 'not by much'.  Unless it is a real amateur hack job, you cannot tell a trim from comparing it to other copies.  Trimming is best concealed when the book is roughed up, lots of dings and dents like this copy. I would not buy it.

[rjpb]

1 hour ago, Bomber-Bob said:

Trimming is always 'not by much'.  Unless it is a real amateur hack job, you cannot tell a trim from comparing it to other copies.  Trimming is best concealed when the book is roughed up, lots of dings and dents like this copy. I would not buy it.

The condition would also make trimming rather pointless. What damage could there have been in the potentially missing 1/16th or so of an inch that trimming would have improved the apparent grade?

[Bomber-Bob]

34 minutes ago, rjpb said:

The condition would also make trimming rather pointless. What damage could there have been in the potentially missing 1/16th or so of an inch that trimming would have improved the apparent grade?

Chips, tears, small stuff.  It's no different than a tiny CT, or a staple tuck, or a spine realignment. It's all small stuff.  Do you remember the micro trimming fiasco by Jason Ewert about 10 years ago ? The work was so miniscule that it was slipping by CGC.  

[rjpb]

47 minutes ago, Bomber-Bob said:

Chips, tears, small stuff.  It's no different than a tiny CT, or a staple tuck, or a spine realignment. It's all small stuff.  Do you remember the micro trimming fiasco by Jason Ewert about 10 years ago ? The work was so miniscule that it was slipping by CGC.  

I'm not saying someone wouldn't do it. There's some CT, tape and tear seal work I've seen done that had to be more of an OCD issue than anything else, and we've all seen "repair" that seems counterintuitive, like gluing paper on the inside of a cover for who know's what reason. The Ewert scandal was a result of the ridiculous multiples paid for ultra high grades over books a single grade increment down.  There's a lot more profit incentive to cheat when the FMV difference between two grades can be in the thousands. 

I totally get the reluctance to buy a raw book if there is anything funky looking about the cut, especially as the value can clearly take a hit if a book ends up in a purple label, but I've seen some pretty strange looking cuts end up with a blue label, books I would have thought were likely trimmed had I seen them raw, and I've seen some books that honestly look like a miscut get purple ones, which is why I'm reluctant to gauge trimming based on photos for all but the most obvious of cases. I trust that CGC is better than I am at catching it, but I wonder sometimes if it isn't a mental coin flip.

 

[Bomber-Bob]

Whenever I see a key that is not in a slab, I get suspicious.  

[comicquant]

And if its trimmed it may not stop there.  The more I look at the bright white of the book versus the amount of wear, the book may have been dipped.  There shouldn't be such a contrast between the two.  The interiors have that broken-down look to them as well.

Edited May 1, 2017 by comicquant