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9.8 with so many issues -- is this common?
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38 posts in this topic

9.8 with so many issues -- is this common?

Someone posted a book the other day with a 9.8 grade with grader notes. I was surprised such a high grade had grader notes so I inquired as to what the notes were.

They were as follows:

  • very light spine stress lines to cover
  • very light staple recessed top of spine
  • very light wear right top of back cover

Doesn't this seem like a high amount of notes for a book? This was a 9.4 that was sent to CCS for pressing and came back as a 9.8 with these notes.

 

 

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Could any of those be manufacturer defects, or do we know if other 9.8s of the same book share those defects?

Personally, I have been surprised a couple of times by what passed on a 9.8. For example, a couple of years ago I was looking for a nice NM copy of Saga 6.  I bought a couple of raw "NM+" copies off of eBay, and wasn't surprised to find that they had several spine dings when they arrived, because, you know, eBay.

So I finally decided to just bite the bullet and get a CGC 9.8. When it arrived, it had several of the same white color breaking ticks on the spine, like at least 5 or 6 of them. So, at that point I wasn't sure if this was a common printing defect for the book, or if it was just a coincidence.

I've since then seen 9.8's of the same book without any spine dings, so I'm not sure what to think.

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29 minutes ago, F For Fake said:

Could any of those be manufacturer defects, or do we know if other 9.8s of the same book share those defects?

Personally, I have been surprised a couple of times by what passed on a 9.8. For example, a couple of years ago I was looking for a nice NM copy of Saga 6.  I bought a couple of raw "NM+" copies off of eBay, and wasn't surprised to find that they had several spine dings when they arrived, because, you know, eBay.

So I finally decided to just bite the bullet and get a CGC 9.8. When it arrived, it had several of the same white color breaking ticks on the spine, like at least 5 or 6 of them. So, at that point I wasn't sure if this was a common printing defect for the book, or if it was just a coincidence.

I've since then seen 9.8's of the same book without any spine dings, so I'm not sure what to think.

It is not common but it does happened.  It seems like other sellers get all the luck with books that passed for 9.8 when I buy off Ebay.   I have to admit that I received books that were 9.8 that I submitted and thought were 9.6 for sure.  It kind of evens out.  Grading is subjective!!!  It is not an exact science.  

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a 10.0 should be perfect.  A 9.8 should have a few defects, nothing major.  A  perfect book should never be a 9.8 but a 9.9 or 10.0

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9.8's aren't perfect, but they also shouldn't have 5 to 6 color-breaking spine ticks. I've since sold that book (for less than I paid, probably because it was a fugly 9.8) or I'd post pics.

As always, we must buy the book, not the grade. That book was just another reminder of the lesson.

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39 minutes ago, newshane said:

9.8 does not equal flawless.

I think this is a huge problem in the current collector market. I was at a show recently and over heard a collector arguing that the 9.8 he wanted to buy was not a true 9.8 because there where some small flaws.

Not sure if everyone understands that 9.8 is not 10, maybe because so few people see 10s, even 9.9s and assume that 9.8 is perfect.

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4 hours ago, newshane said:

9.8 does not equal flawless.

It should. IMO, a 9.9 or 10.0 should be flawless + some outstanding qualities like perfect centering, razor sharp edges, perfect staple placement, etc.

If I were to receive a 9.8 with spine ticks and/or staple problems, I would not be happy.

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34 minutes ago, Lethal_Collector said:

I owned a CGC 10 with a printing defect where the corner atop the spine had frays of fiber poking out (shrug)

 

Jerome

Really? I thought 9.9 and 10's couldn't have any sign of anything really. (if that makes sense) I had to talk to a grader once because of manufacturing defect on a book. I pointed it out and he said that it was acceptable to get a 9.8 but due to the defect it couldn't receive anything higher regardless of the spine,corners, or anything else that was perfect on the book.

I've had both 9.9's and 10's, very far and inbetween and couldn't tell you why. I submitted perfect copies of Batman #21 Lenticular covers for onsite grading. No visible scruff on the back lower right corner that was evident on hundreds of books. I submitted 5 thinking they were absolutely perfect only to get them as 9.8's. (shrug) 

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48 minutes ago, Zacreth said:
1 hour ago, Lethal_Collector said:

I owned a CGC 10 with a printing defect where the corner atop the spine had frays of fiber poking out (shrug)

 

Jerome

Really? I thought 9.9 and 10's couldn't have any sign of anything really. (if that makes sense) I had to talk to a grader once because of manufacturing defect on a book. I pointed it out and he said that it was acceptable to get a 9.8 but due to the defect it couldn't receive anything higher regardless of the spine,corners, or anything else that was perfect on the book.

I've had both 9.9's and 10's, very far and inbetween and couldn't tell you why. I submitted perfect copies of Batman #21 Lenticular covers for onsite grading. No visible scruff on the back lower right corner that was evident on hundreds of books. I submitted 5 thinking they were absolutely perfect only to get them as 9.8's. (shrug) 

You've kind of pointed out the reasoning for the questions in this thread.  The grading is half-azzed random about 20+% of the time.  I crack out a lot of slabs, and I'm always amazed at the variation in grading...., +/- and otherwise.  Granted the books I've cracked are not 9.8-10, but 9.6 down.

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1 hour ago, Chunky Butterfield said:

Borock himself has said a 10.0 isn't necessarily perfect.

Yes and Borock now works for another company whose grading is suspect. By definition, how can a 10.0 be anything but perfect ? I suspect that  the 10.0 referenced above with a top corner flaw happened after grading.

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1 minute ago, Chunky Butterfield said:

I should have mentioned that he said that in a Wizard article when he was CGC president/head grader.

He probably made that comment to cover his behind in case they missed something on a 10.0 .

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If what constitutes a 9.6 vs 9.8 or how many cb-spine ticks a 9.4 can have were widely known and generally agreed upon, there'd be no reason to have 3rd party graders. 

I have a graded 9.6 with eight cb-spine ticks and a couple tiny non-cb ticks as well. Have seen plenty of 9.8s also with a couple cb-spine ticks as well. If I sold them on the bay raw and called them "NM+" a lot of people would get upset that it's not "perfect".

 

Edited by jcjames
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4 hours ago, Lethal_Collector said:

I owned a CGC 10 with a printing defect where the corner atop the spine had frays of fiber poking out (shrug)

 

Jerome

It seems like this might make sense if the fibers are from the actual cutting of the pages when printed.  I have a couple of never read, worthless randoms that have those because we bought the book, bagged it, and let be.  They are extraneous, not part of the rectangle of the page, if that makes sense.  Like extra fibers, not frays from the corner.

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37 minutes ago, SteppinRazor said:

It seems like this might make sense if the fibers are from the actual cutting of the pages when printed.  I have a couple of never read, worthless randoms that have those because we bought the book, bagged it, and let be.  They are extraneous, not part of the rectangle of the page, if that makes sense.  Like extra fibers, not frays from the corner.

I wasn't sure what to make of them, and still wonder to this day.  But I thought for something to get a 9.9 or 10 everything had to be flawless, even manufacturing issues.

 

Jerome

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