• When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.

Opinions on cva?
0

55 posts in this topic

12 hours ago, Tony S said:

CVA is GREAT service. For the blind. No one else could possibly need it.  

I can't see that being the case

2 hours ago, Jeffro. said:

I suppose it's similar to grading. Put in the time and do your research and you will become competent or even proficient in spotting comics with great eye appeal. I certainly don't need CVA to tell me what slabbed comic has the best eye appeal and I'm certainly not going to waste my money on such nonsense.  

There are many collectors who know how to grade and don't need CGC to confirm what they already know. The restoration check is helpful, but that aside, the experienced comic collector can trust their own judgement on structural condition and grade if they choose.

But not everyone has those skills. Those new to the hobby, or buying for investment purposes may not know the difference between a well centred 9.4 and, say, a mis-wrapped 9.4.  My ASM 129 has a significant mis-wrap. It's a 9.4 and I got it fairly cheaply, possibly because of the mis-wrap. If an investor dipped in, and saw two 9.4's, one with a CVA Exceptional sticker and one without, which would they prefer do you think? CVA gives them a hint.

If there were two similar looking Action Comics #1's out there, one an 8.0 with a CVA and one without, which would you prefer to own? If the answer is the CVA copy, then it follows that you might just pay a bit more for it, if you were in that purchasing field.

So CGC and CVA are not nonsense. They are a service with potential benefits to some. Use them. Don't use them. CVA stickers on the OP's books may pay for themselves and some, if the intent is to maximise resale value. But if there is no evidence of that being the case however, which sounds counter intuitive to me, then at least you'll have the pleasure of knowing you have a third party's confirmation that your book is a looker.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree with Jeffro that it's a complete waste of money. I know if my book looks good or not. If it catches on I'll be disappointed. I choose to not sell my books. In fact I've never sold a book. I only buy them so say I am given the option of buying one of two identical books one having the CVA sticker and one not, I would buy the issue without the sticker. I do not wish to support another layer of grading above and beyond what CGC and and similar services already offer. I feel like it holds the owner of a slabbed book hostage and the ransom is the little CVA sticker. It may sound extreme but that's how I feel.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

54 minutes ago, poppy73 said:

I agree with Jeffro that it's a complete waste of money. I know if my book looks good or not. If it catches on I'll be disappointed. I choose to not sell my books. In fact I've never sold a book. I only buy them so say I am given the option of buying one of two identical books one having the CVA sticker and one not, I would buy the issue without the sticker. I do not wish to support another layer of grading above and beyond what CGC and and similar services already offer. I feel like it holds the owner of a slabbed book hostage and the ransom is the little CVA sticker. It may sound extreme but that's how I feel.

With two books that are truly identical (or close enough to make the point), I would buy whichever one was priced better. If priced the same, I would look very carefully to see if there was a difference, and ignore whether one received the stupid CVA sticker or not. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Marwood & I said:

But not everyone has those skills. Those new to the hobby, or buying for investment purposes may not know the difference between a well centred 9.4 and, say, a mis-wrapped 9.4.  

My question for this would be, however, that if someone if brand new to the hobby and/or buying for investment purposes (many of whom, might be brand new to the hobby as well), then would they even understand what the CVA sticker is, or understand what it's "supposed" to represent?  The answer to that would be likely "no".  And the person in that case explaining to them would be almost certainly the person selling to them, who would have all the incentive to push the "value" of the CVA sticker, when people who have been in the hobby long enough (or people who do some level of research before investing heavily) would realize that they don't need a sticker to know what to spend money on, but simply a little knowledge and experience (or the guidance of someone they can trust who has that and won't charge them for it).

When I owned a shop -- way back in the 90's -- we had a lot of silver/bronze age on our walls (and we had a huge store, with a ton of room for wall display).  Above out new book section, we had on the walls the "hot books" of the time, a wall that was filled with -- you can guess already -- Gen 13, Danger Girl, Lady Death, etc.  I distinctly remember a young collector brand new to comics -- he was 14 or so -- who started coming into the store to buy books (his family had money to spend, apparently).  He pulled a full Gen13 mini-series off of the wall -- back when those books were selling fast and for good coin -- along with some other "hot" stuff to the register.  When I asked him if he had decided to get into those characters, he mentioned they were for "investing" for down the road.  I explained to his mother and he that there were probably better choices if he wanted to invest. and he ended up putting those books back and picking up a high grade ASM #121 instead from me, a decision that I'm sure benefited him much more down the road.  If we had fast forwarded to today, that would be exactly the type of collector who could gain "benefit" from a CVA sticker, but who frankly should have no use for it once they have the proper knowledge in hand (which you should want if you're actually thinking of investing in this hobby).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Marwood & I said:

I can't see that being the case

There are many collectors who know how to grade and don't need CGC to confirm what they already know. The restoration check is helpful, but that aside, the experienced comic collector can trust their own judgement on structural condition and grade if they choose.

But not everyone has those skills. Those new to the hobby, or buying for investment purposes may not know the difference between a well centred 9.4 and, say, a mis-wrapped 9.4.  My ASM 129 has a significant mis-wrap. It's a 9.4 and I got it fairly cheaply, possibly because of the mis-wrap. If an investor dipped in, and saw two 9.4's, one with a CVA Exceptional sticker and one without, which would they prefer do you think? CVA gives them a hint.

If there were two similar looking Action Comics #1's out there, one an 8.0 with a CVA and one without, which would you prefer to own? If the answer is the CVA copy, then it follows that you might just pay a bit more for it, if you were in that purchasing field.

So CGC and CVA are not nonsense. They are a service with potential benefits to some. Use them. Don't use them. CVA stickers on the OP's books may pay for themselves and some, if the intent is to maximise resale value. But if there is no evidence of that being the case however, which sounds counter intuitive to me, then at least you'll have the pleasure of knowing you have a third party's confirmation that your book is a looker.

 

The difference being, that the appeal of graded books is that the buyer doesn't have to really worry about not just undisclosed restoration, but also not immediately obvious flaws that impact grade, and agree with the specific grade or not, it can be used to ballpark value in relation to other slabbed copies. Slabbing can give piece of mind to the buyer that the book in question isn't being seriously misrepresented, regardless of how it appears. CVA stickers serve no such function. It just says that a particular copy supposedly has superior eye appeal for the grade - something all but the most novice collectors can judge for themselves. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 6/13/2017 at 11:44 AM, Bigsexy said:

Thanks for the info , that was pretty much my train of thought also regarding cva

CVA is extremely valuable to pretty much any comic collector who doesn't have two eyes of his own. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 hours ago, Jeffro. said:

I suppose it's similar to grading. Put in the time and do your research and you will become competent or even proficient in spotting comics with great eye appeal. I certainly don't need CVA to tell me what slabbed comic has the best eye appeal and I'm certainly not going to waste my money on such nonsense.  

If you can access the book in hand, I totally agree with you. However, if viewing only online, I disagree. Especially with Comiclink where they never show the Back cover. In theory, the CVA sticker tells me the Back cover looks good. BTW, I would never purchase this service but I like it when buying.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 minutes ago, Bomber-Bob said:

 

10 hours ago, Jeffro. said:

I suppose it's similar to grading. Put in the time and do your research and you will become competent or even proficient in spotting comics with great eye appeal. I certainly don't need CVA to tell me what slabbed comic has the best eye appeal and I'm certainly not going to waste my money on such nonsense.  

If you can access the book in hand, I totally agree with you. However, if viewing only online, I disagree. Especially with Comiclink where they never show the Back cover. In theory, the CVA sticker tells me the Back cover looks good. BTW, I would never purchase this service but I like it when buying.

 

Fair point. I suppose it could be useful when you can't see the back cover

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 minutes ago, SteppinRazor said:

If you can't trust the CGC number grade, then what good is it?

Well, the technical grade doesn't always take eye appeal into account. You can have comics with sharp corners and no spine tics that grade out at 9.6 or 9.4 but also have a front to back miswrap. Lots of people don't want a book with a miswrap. There's also printers creases to contend with. Printer's creases often reduce the eye appeal of a comic but not the technical grade

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Jeffro. said:

Fair point. I suppose it could be useful when you can't see the back cover

I have a pet peeve against staple rust. When the staple(s) is precisely on the vertex, even a BC scan won't help ascertain a problem. You need to have a side view, which is never offered. I trust the presence of a CVA sticker indicates the staples are fine.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14 minutes ago, Jeffro. said:

Well, the technical grade doesn't always take eye appeal into account. You can have comics with sharp corners and no spine tics that grade out at 9.6 or 9.4 but also have a front to back miswrap. Lots of people don't want a book with a miswrap. There's also printers creases to contend with. Printer's creases often reduce the eye appeal of a comic but not the technical grade

BTW, you can often 'hide' a printer's crease by taking a pic of the book at a certain angle. Sometimes a printer's crease cannot be seen while looking straight at the book. You have to angle it in light to catch the reflection. I dislike printer's creases and avoid them but, if not hand, I may not see it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, poppy73 said:

I agree with Jeffro that it's a complete waste of money. I know if my book looks good or not. 

Pardon me sir but weren't you the one that posted about buying some NM books at a convention and didn't take the books out of the bag and board until getting home. At that point you were concerned about some markings. In light of that, I find your comments here humorous. Sorry. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, Jeffro. said:

Well, the technical grade doesn't always take eye appeal into account. You can have comics with sharp corners and no spine tics that grade out at 9.6 or 9.4 but also have a front to back miswrap. Lots of people don't want a book with a miswrap. There's also printers creases to contend with. Printer's creases often reduce the eye appeal of a comic but not the technical grade

That's more or less what I was saying earlier. CVA doesn't grade the grader. They just judge the eye appeal and composition.

If CGC gave a view on eye appeal alongside the structural grade, CVA would be out of business. 

As long as CGC ignores the composition / appearance, CVA will have a market.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Marwood & I said:

That's more or less what I was saying earlier. CVA doesn't grade the grader. They just judge the eye appeal and composition.

If CGC gave a view on eye appeal alongside the structural grade, CVA would be out of business. 

As long as CGC ignores the composition / appearance, CVA will have a market.

 

It's one of the reasons I dislike the CGC process. Judging a book on structural integrity alone, and ignoring eye appeal, means you can be disappointed with a 9.4 book when you find it miswrapped or miscut etc.

My ASM 121 is a 9.0 and it looks so much better than my 122 which is a 9.4. I find that odd. 

So I recognise that CGC and CVA have their place, but I prefer the old way of judging your books yourself. 

Offer me a CGC with a CVA and I'll take it. But resto aside, I don't require the expertise of either company.

In CGC's case, I personally find the subjectivity element on grading coupled with the absence of eye appeal rating alarming when a one point move can have such a huge financial impact.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
0