Is V for Vendetta possibly the most influential comic of our time? 1 1

[Aweandlorder]

First - PLEASE - I implore you to not get into politics here.

This is to question the impact of V, as a character, a symbol and a modern depiction of Guy Fawkes in our society today worldwide.

Is it possible that Alan Moore and David Lloyd's creation and design have now become a TREMENDOUS influential force on our society?

Has there ever been a comic book based character that has impacted us politically as much?

Again, lets not get into politics. Just wanted to get your opinion on the above questions. Thanks!

 

Edited August 23, 2017 by Aweandlorder

[kimik]

What about Captain America?

[Aweandlorder]

1 minute ago, kimik said:

What about Captain America?

Short of him slugging hitler on comic book covers, I havent seen any political groups depicting nor borrowing images of him to symbolize their movement

[kav]

Sometimes you see a Vendetta mask once in a while but mostly they just use them bandanna discount ninja things.

[1Cool]

I'd think Grimm Fairy Tales #1 is the most influential comic book of recent times.  Hot scantily clad woman on the cover with very little time spent on the actual story.  Seems to have been a segway into most modern books. 

[Aweandlorder]

5 minutes ago, kav said:

Sometimes you see a Vendetta mask once in a while but mostly they just use them bandanna discount ninja things.

Watching the news on several channels in the past few weeks I kept on hearing the moderators referrals to V for Vendetta on several occasions. I always thought that the mask was Guy Fawkes but apparently these reporters didnt think so

[mackenzie999]

3 minutes ago, 1Cool said:

...Hot scantily clad woman on the cover with very little time spent on the actual story...

Is this really a new development? I'm only half joking.

[Aweandlorder]

Maybe its because pronouncing fawkes could get you in trouble

[kav]

8 minutes ago, Aweandlorder said:

Watching the news on several channels in the past few weeks I kept on hearing the moderators referrals to V for Vendetta on several occasions. I always thought that the mask was Guy Fawkes but apparently these reporters didnt think so

Some news producer got a brainstorm is all they tend to do that MAYBE THIS WILL BOOST RATINGS!!

[Brock]

7 minutes ago, Aweandlorder said:

Watching the news on several channels in the past few weeks I kept on hearing the moderators referrals to V for Vendetta on several occasions. I always thought that the mask was Guy Fawkes but apparently these reporters didnt think so

It's definitely a Guy Fawkes mask.

I think it has had an impact, but I can't help but wonder if the movie didn't play a larger role than the original comic. Clearly, the movie took the image form the comic, but it was only after the movie had "popularized" the image of the mask as an anti-authoritarian symbol that it began to pop up other places. I think the current application of the image was cemented through its use by the hacker collective Anonymous, and it later migrated to things like Occupy Wall Street, and more recently the "Resist" movement.

I think, though, there's a long history of comic imagery being adopted (or co-opted) for political purposes. Hitler-bashing as has been pointed out, but more directly things like the use of the Punisher logo by members of the US military, the use of Pepe the Frog by members of the hard right, the use of Charlie Hebdo cartoons by both free speech activists and radical Islamists, or the use of "Canadian" characters like Superman by Canada Post as an expression of Canadian nationalism. Perhaps one of the most influential was the role of Superman (largely through its radio show) in diminishing the influence of the KKK in the 1940s.

In some instances (like Alan Moore and V for Vendetta), the political use seems to align with the intent of the creator, but in others (such as Matt Furie and Pepe the Frog) it can run counter to the creator's political views. Which (IMHO) just means that popular images and characters are fertile ground for piggybacking other messages to a broad audience, whether intended or not.

[ThothAmon]

To me the Guy Fawkes mask represents the individual standing up against tyranny and for individual liberty.  You know, limited government.  Obviously, the limitless government people see it as a symbol for them as well.  Hope this isn't political but given the topic it's a real tightrope. 

[Aweandlorder]

12 minutes ago, Brock said:

It's definitely a Guy Fawkes mask.

I think it has had an impact, but I can't help but wonder if the movie didn't play a larger role than the original comic. Clearly, the movie took the image form the comic, but it was only after the movie had "popularized" the image of the mask as an anti-authoritarian symbol that it began to pop up other places. I think the current application of the image was cemented through its use by the hacker collective Anonymous, and it later migrated to things like Occupy Wall Street, and more recently the "Resist" movement.

I think, though, there's a long history of comic imagery being adopted (or co-opted) for political purposes. Hitler-bashing as has been pointed out, but more directly things like the use of the Punisher logo by members of the US military, the use of Pepe the Frog by members of the hard right, the use of Charlie Hebdo cartoons by both free speech activists and radical Islamists, or the use of "Canadian" characters like Superman by Canada Post as an expression of Canadian nationalism. Perhaps one of the most influential was the role of Superman (largely through its radio show) in diminishing the influence of the KKK in the 1940s.

In some instances (like Alan Moore and V for Vendetta), the political use seems to align with the intent of the creator, but in others (such as Matt Furie and Pepe the Frog) it can run counter to the creator's political views. Which (IMHO) just means that popular images and characters are fertile ground for piggybacking other messages to a broad audience, whether intended or not.

Thanks, there are definitely many great points here. I think that for the most part, alot of the characters you have mentioned have been used in an instance or as a smaller movement. But it seems that with V, he seems to be depicted in more and more groups and even more so, he gets alot of news media attention. I cant tell you how many times Ive seen the by now popular Guy Fawkes mask (as depicted by David Lloyd) in news outlets on major networks and online. It begs the question, were all these activists influenced by the comic/movie, or Guy Fawkes himself. While one couldnt exist without the other, I cant remember Guy Fawkes making a comparable impact on any political movement previous to the comic (or better yet the movie as you mentioned) 

[kav]

I think it boils down to the mask made good TV, so the news producers showed it, then the protesters started saying well those are our masks I guess then more started wearing it etc.

[kav]

When something goes viral it just goes viral it's somewhat random.  Plenty of teens have said all kinds of idiotic stuff on Dr Phil but one chick says 'cash me outside den!' and it goes viral and now she's a millionaire celebrity.  If you go out in a field and pick a blade of grass then bring it back someone could ask Why did you pick THAT ONE?

[Aweandlorder]

1 minute ago, kav said:

I think it boils down to the mask made good TV, so the news producers showed it, then the protesters started saying well those are our masks I guess then more started wearing it etc.

Agree. But the fact that they used a mask that aligns with their movement as did the character in the comic/movie, is no pure coincidence. I would think that the character's actions, not just looks, influenced those parties 

[Aweandlorder]

1 minute ago, kav said:

When something goes viral it just goes viral it's somewhat random.  Plenty of teens have said all kinds of idiotic stuff on Dr Phil but one chick says 'cash me outside den!' and it goes viral and now she's a millionaire celebrity.  If you go out in a field and pick a blade of grass then bring it back someone could ask Why did you pick THAT ONE?

Yeah but V is more than just a meme. He is associated now with many activists. Anonymous being the most widely recognized and had been active for many years now

[kav]

2 minutes ago, Aweandlorder said:

Agree. But the fact that they used a mask that aligns with their movement as did the character in the comic/movie, is no pure coincidence. I would think that the character's actions, not just looks, influenced those parties 

The original guy who wore the mask and got caught on TV and started the trend probably knew what it meant.  Then it caught on.  I have no idea if the average protester does but I do recall when the original protests started, a TV anchor asked the leader 'what are you protesting' and he said 'we are working on figuring that out' so I don't think they all even know who or what guy fawkes is when they put on the mask.  It's just 'the protest mask and stuff'.

[Brock]

7 minutes ago, Aweandlorder said:

It begs the question, were all these activists influenced by the comic/movie, or Guy Fawkes himself. While one couldnt exist without the other, I cant remember Guy Fawkes making a comparable impact on any political movement previous to the comic (or better yet the movie as you mentioned) 

I think it's definitely the comic/movie having the influence rather than Guy Fawkes himself... Not even Moore was really going for Fawkes' pro-Catholic/anti-monarchist brand of extremism, and even if he was, most Americans have never heard of Guy Fawkes. I think it was more that he liked the idea of co-opting a vaguely anti-authoritarian image by adding a layer of creepiness to what was otherwise a childhood party prop. In this context, it's probably important to remember that V for vendetta was published first in Warrior, and intended primarily for a British audience. It was only later that it came to international attention with its reprinting by DC.

It's kind of like how Jason in the Friday 13th movies wears a hockey mask... the creepiness or unease comes from the hidden anonymity of the mask's wearer, rather than from trying to evoke a feeling of hockey players.

[kav]

1 minute ago, Brock said:

the creepiness or unease comes from the hidden anonymity of the mask's wearer, rather than from trying to evoke a feeling of hockey players.

Single greatest sentence I've ever read on the internet!!!!  

[Aweandlorder]

4 minutes ago, Brock said:

I think it's definitely the comic/movie having the influence rather than Guy Fawkes himself... Not even Moore was really going for Fawkes' pro-Catholic/anti-monarchist brand of extremism, and even if he was, most Americans have never heard of Guy Fawkes. I think it was more that he liked the idea of co-opting a vaguely anti-authoritarian image by adding a layer of creepiness to what was otherwise a childhood party prop. In this context, it's probably important to remember that V for vendetta was published first in Warrior, and intended primarily for a British audience. It was only later that it came to international attention with its reprinting by DC.

It's kind of like how Jason in the Friday 13th movies wears a hockey mask... the creepiness or unease comes from the hidden anonymity of the mask's wearer, rather than from trying to evoke a feeling of hockey players.

I wonder who came up with the design. Was it Lloyd or both him and Moore. Is there an interview with them discussing it?