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Anyone know the story behind Wildcats #1 Gold and other Image gold books?
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33 posts in this topic

42 minutes ago, RockMyAmadeus said:

Incentive ratios didn't exist in 1992. There was no way to order this that way. It's possible, even probable, that Image gave a copy for every 100 copies ordered, but there was no way to place a "qualifying order" to obtain a gold. 

This is false.

American Entertainment (or the like) did advertise it -- and Predator/Magnus Platinum, among others as an incentive variant direct to customers ("Buy 50, or 100 copies, get 1 special copy").

Example: the ad on the back cover of Spawn # 1 has a solicitation for "buy 100 copies of WildCats # 1, get one gold."

This may not have been how they were allocated at the distribution level, but it certainly was how they were marketed to collectors on the wholesale sub-distribution level.

So from a practical perspective, there *at least* enough to go around for 1:100.

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59 minutes ago, RockMyAmadeus said:

Incentive ratios didn't exist in 1992. There was no way to order this that way. It's possible, even probable, that Image gave a copy for every 100 copies ordered, but there was no way to place a "qualifying order" to obtain a gold. 

True.

...and notice there is no price in the box.

Typically the absence of a price is because it’s not marked for resale.

Venom LP gold: no price in box

Spider-man 1 Platinum: no price box.

Spawn THX: no price box

 

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6 hours ago, Gatsby77 said:

This is false.

 

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6 hours ago, Gatsby77 said:

American Entertainment (or the like) did advertise it -- and Predator/Magnus Platinum, among others as an incentive variant direct to customers ("Buy 50, or 100 copies, get 1 special copy").

Example: the ad on the back cover of Spawn # 1 has a solicitation for "buy 100 copies of WildCats # 1, get one gold."

This may not have been how they were allocated at the distribution level, but it certainly was how they were marketed to collectors on the wholesale sub-distribution level.

So from a practical perspective, there *at least* enough to go around for 1:100.

That is incorrect, and you have an inaccurate understanding of what an "incentive variant" is.

Here's the back cover to Spawn #1:

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That does *not* make it an "incentive variant." And while ETM was, indeed, American Entertainment's distribution arm, selling direct-to-the-public, by definition, is not distribution to retailers or the Direct market distribution system.

Incentive variants are offered to retailers and other clients of distributors (in this case, just Diamond), by PUBLISHERS (not distributors) to incentivize them to order more copies. 

But this is not an offer from Image. This is an offer from a third party distributor/wholesaler/retailer. That does not an "incentive variant" make.

If you have any SOLICITATION documentation, from Image, that shows any sort of incentive ordering program, by all means...please share it.

I'll check my copy of Previews when I can, and see what, if anything, Image had to say about it through Diamond (if I have the Wildcats catalog.)

Edited by RockMyAmadeus
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19 minutes ago, Shoomanfoo said:
1 hour ago, RockMyAmadeus said:

Incentive ratios didn't exist in 1992. There was no way to order this that way. It's possible, even probable, that Image gave a copy for every 100 copies ordered, but there was no way to place a "qualifying order" to obtain a gold. 

True.

...and notice there is no price in the box.

Typically the absence of a price is because it’s not marked for resale.

Venom LP gold: no price in box

Spider-man 1 Platinum: no price box.

Spawn THX: no price box

Yes, they were never meant to be sold as regular books. The reason these books didn't have a price is because they didn't want retailers to mistakenly put them on the shelves for sale as normal copies...which is precisely what happened to half the print run of Eternal Warrior #1 Gold...2500 copies got sent "to the West Coast" (that's the usual story) and retailers put them out on the shelves as second prints, because they had a cover price...$2.25...and it had been a mistake, so they didn't know any better. That's why the embossed gold (with no cover price!) exists in the first place.

These were new. They weren't anything the market had much experience with. The publishers had zero consistency. So, there was quite a cluster in figuring out how to get them out. But publishers had figured it out, and didn't want to repeat the same mistake...that's why no other Valiant gold/platinum after that has a cover price, and why most other such books (but not all!) don't have cover prices.

Remember: no (real) internet to speak of, and no way to directly communicate with retailers and buyers in a speedy and comprehensive manner.

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39 minutes ago, RockMyAmadeus said:

 

s-l1600.jpg

 

Other things interesting about that ad:

ETM was offering "Spawn #1 2nd prints" on the back cover of Spawn #1 first prints.

Second prints don't exist. They were never made.

"Art of Extreme #1" also doesn't exist.

There's no mention of Brigade #1 Gold.

So messy. Especially Image. At this point, no one yet knew just how bad Image would get...and it got horrifyingly bad.

I don't think Brigade #1 came out for 4-5 months after this ad (May of 1992.)

Edited by RockMyAmadeus
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On 12/14/2019 at 4:34 PM, RockMyAmadeus said:

ETM was offering "Spawn #1 2nd prints" on the back cover of Spawn #1 first prints.

Second prints don't exist. They were never made.

...

So messy. Especially Image. At this point, no one yet knew just how bad Image would get...and it got horrifyingly bad.

Just throwing this out there... is there any chance that the "2nd prints" are/became the same thing as newsstand editions?  I don't remember if Spawn #1 newsstand (barcode on the front cover) was out at the same time as Spawn #1 or if I saw them later (perhaps months later). Maybe the need for 2nd prints coincided with the idea of selling Image on newsstands... Spawn #1 needed more copies, but Youngblood #1 didn't... so we've got newsstand Spawn #1 but not newsstand Youngblood #1. hm

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23 minutes ago, valiantman said:

Just throwing this out there... is there any chance that the "2nd prints" are/became the same thing as newsstand editions?  I don't remember if Spawn #1 newsstand (barcode on the front cover) was out at the same time as Spawn #1 or if I saw them later (perhaps months later). Maybe the need for 2nd prints coincided with the idea of selling Image on newsstands... Spawn #1 needed more copies, but Youngblood #1 didn't... so we've got newsstand Spawn #1 but not newsstand Youngblood #1. hm

I can't speak for Image books because I don't recall buying any from newsstands, but my local newsstand in suburban Philly received books three weeks after they were released to comic book shops.

This knowledge came in handy for quick comic shop sell-outs like ASM 361 and Man of Steel 18.

Also, I know that locally Youngblood # 1 sold out far faster than Spawn 1 did. Spawn # 1 was still available for reorder for several months in my area, whereas Spawn # 2 sold out quickly and thus became a $4 book.

In contrast, despite Youngblood # 1's being "limit 5 per customer" from day-of-release, it quickly rose to $7.50 within two months...

Edited by Gatsby77
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2 hours ago, valiantman said:

Just throwing this out there... is there any chance that the "2nd prints" are/became the same thing as newsstand editions?  I don't remember if Spawn #1 newsstand (barcode on the front cover) was out at the same time as Spawn #1 or if I saw them later (perhaps months later). Maybe the need for 2nd prints coincided with the idea of selling Image on newsstands... Spawn #1 needed more copies, but Youngblood #1 didn't... so we've got newsstand Spawn #1 but not newsstand Youngblood #1. hm

No. Spawn #1 Direct and newsstand were printed, like all other Direct/newsstand books, at the same time and distributed at the same time. Newsstands didn't get books for 2-3 weeks after the Direct market, but that was due to the low priority comics took with the national magazine distributors.

Whether a book was sold on the newsstand or not was up to the publisher; in Image's case, each studio would have made the decision, and Larry Marder (who served as Image's publisher) would have coordinated all of that. These were decisions that were made long before they were printed. Even though Youngblood #1 wasn't distributed on the newsstands for some reason, books that came out a few months later, like Brigade #1, was.

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7 hours ago, RockMyAmadeus said:

yay!

Codename Strikeforce IS a weirdo. Image was really in love with embossed covers at that point:

s-l1600.jpg

s-l1600.jpg

 

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Wow they did a lot of them.... it's funny that I don't see them often in the massive dollar bins of image books...

Edited by Wolverinex
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