What are the general cutoff points for high, mid and low grade? 2 2

[FSF]

I would assume this shouldn’t depend on the age of the book.  

[grebal]

It doesn't exactly line up with the numbering, but I always regarded mid-grades as comics that fall between 1/3 and 2/3 copies.

[cortown71]

3,6,9?

2,5,8?

Good-lowest for low 3.0

Fine-mid 4.0-6.0

High-8.0 up

Others may vary.

[FSF]

For the record, and I know this isn't one of those factual things but prone to perception and varying opinions, but I would have thought:

High - 8.0+

Mid - 5.0-7.5

Low - 4.5 and below

 

[VintageComics]

1 hour ago, FSF said:

I would assume this shouldn’t depend on the age of the book.  

Discussed many times on here.

I always say that high grade starts in the VF range, so 7.0 (F/VF) because most VF range books look extremely high grade at arm's length with just a few small defects.

Like wise, for me VG range is already mid-grade so low grade stops at 3.0 / 3.5 and midgrade starts there and goes to 6.5

Low grade books look low grade

Mid grade books look mid grade

High grade books look high grade

[Von Cichlid]

For silver age books, high grade is synonymous with "fresh."  They can even have small nicks and a few creases maybe.  As long as the paper quality is great and there is no tanning and the smell is good, I would call an older book high grade if it had that fresh look.    

Mid-grade is what you have when a book has good eye appeal, but the wear of time has definitely begun to show.  It might be the book just doesn't feel tight anymore or that the spine is fuzzy or that the book feels loose around the staples.  A mid grade book looks decent but the newness of it has long been gone.

Low grade is when I am cool to have it in my collection, but there are flaws that really make the copy not desirable.  Soiling, water damage, mildew smell, stains, and oxidation are the things that really pit a book it that category for me.

For copper age and up, it seems that > 8.5 is high grade, and every thing else is varying levels of low grade.

[lizards2]

4 hours ago, VintageComics said:

 

I always say that high grade starts in the VF range, so 7.0 (F/VF) because most VF range books look extremely high grade at arm's length with just a few small defects.

 

You're channeling E Gerber! 

I loved his comparison in page quality to milk vs spoiled milk, or something like that.   

[oakman29]

8 hours ago, VintageComics said:

Discussed many times on here.

I always say that high grade starts in the VF range, so 7.0 (F/VF) because most VF range books look extremely high grade at arm's length with just a few small defects.

Like wise, for me VG range is already mid-grade so low grade stops at 3.0 / 3.5 and midgrade starts there and goes to 6.5

Low grade books look low grade

Mid grade books look mid grade

High grade books look high grade

I think I started a thread very similar to this ten years ago,  and you Roy hit the nail on the head. I can see your opinion hasn't changed in all these years. 

[adampasz]

Listing a 7.0 or 8.0 as High Grade is a stretch IMHO.  Even though it's not evenly distributed, I would recommend a scale like this:

Less than 5 -> Low
Greater-than-or-equal-to 5, but less than 8.5 -> Mid
Greater-than-or-equal-to 8.5 -> High

 

[Phicks]

We grade on a scale up to 10.0.   Low, medium, and high grade should divide that 10.0 equally.

0-3.0 = Low Grade

3.5-6.5 = Medium Grade

7.0-10.0 = High Grade

Some collectors will protest that a 7.0 is not high grade, but regardless of whether we increase that lower limit to 8.0 or even 9.0, there would always be a group of collectors who would say that isn't really high grade because they collect 9.6 and above.

And it is easy for collectors of modern books to say 7.0 is not high grade, but not so easy for collectors of silver and golden age.

 

 

 

[valiantman]

There's no arguing with the "beauty" aspect of what's high grade, mid grade, etc... so that's not what I'm going to post.

What I'm posting is the CGC Census info related to where the cut-offs would be if you decided that the "top X% of CGC graded copies" would be the place to make the call... and it definitely makes a difference if we're talking 1930s or 1990s.

 

[jcjames]

21 minutes ago, valiantman said:

There's no arguing with the "beauty" aspect of what's high grade, mid grade, etc... so that's not what I'm going to post.

What I'm posting is the CGC Census info related to where the cut-offs would be if you decided that the "top X% of CGC graded copies" would be the place to make the call... and it definitely makes a difference if we're talking 1930s or 1990s.

 

Interesting.

Based on numbers of books graded (not in this chart but in other data), the majority of books graded are less than 20 years old and nearly all of them are 9.8s.

Most people who send books to grade probably self-select the higher-grades to send in across most ages of books. So even for GA/SA/BA books in the chart abovve, the "median" and "average" grade books are most likely from a set of cherry-picked books and not representative of typical books of that age.

 

 

 

[Lazyboy]

2 hours ago, Phicks said:

We grade on a scale up to 10.0.   Low, medium, and high grade should divide that 10.0 equally.

0-3.0 = Low Grade

3.5-6.5 = Medium Grade

7.0-10.0 = High Grade

Not really. It's a 25-point scale.

High - above VF (8 points)
10
9.9
9.8
9.6
9.4
9.2
9.0
8.5

Mid - from VG to VF (9 points)
8.0
7.5
7.0
6.5
6.0
5.5
5.0
4.5
4.0

Low - below VG (8 points)
3.5
3.0
2.5
2.0
1.8
1.5
1.0
0.5

[jcjames]

5 minutes ago, Lazyboy said:

Not really. It's a 25-point scale.

High - above VF (8 points)
10
9.9
9.8
9.6
9.4
9.2
9.0
8.5

Mid - from VG to VF (9 points)
8.0
7.5
7.0
6.5
6.0
5.5
5.0
4.5
4.0

Low - below VG (8 points)
3.5
3.0
2.5
2.0
1.8
1.5
1.0
0.5

 

The quibble-zone would probably be whether VF is high-grade or not. Since most collectors never ever see a 10.0 or a 9.9, those two grades should be in their own category of "super-high-grade". One may even make the case of a 9.8/9.6 being "super-high-grade" since the flaws may be ever so slight. Maybe the grade brackets can be something like:

10.0-9.6 "Super-High-Grade/ Nearly Flawless Or Perfect"

8.0-9.4 "High Grade/ Great Looking"

4.0-7.5 "Mid-Grade/ Average Looking"

0.5-3.5 "Low-grade/ Shabby Looking"

 

 

[Gatsby77]

The thread I remember here from years back settled on a consensus of 8.5 (VF+) as the lower-bound of "high-grade."

That said, I'm with the subjectivity. I *still* have a hard time paying for 7.0 Bronze books, no matter how expensive they are (Hulk 181, ASM 129, etc.).

Overall - 8.5 is high-grade

Copper and Modern - 9.6+ is high grade

For certain expensive books (TMNT 1, Albedo 2, etc.) 9.0+ is high grade.

Silver Age: 9.0+

Golden Age: 6.0+

 

Example: Detective 1-50 in 6.0 is high-grade, whereas The Walking Dead 1-100 in 9.4 is not.

[valiantman]

1 hour ago, jcjames said:

So even for GA/SA/BA books in the chart abovve, the "median" and "average" grade books are most likely from a set of cherry-picked books and not representative of typical books of that age.

Yes - CGC census reflects the best-of-the-best across the combination of conditions and eras, since many books are only sent to CGC if they are in top condition.  We only get a "glimpse" of the full range of grades for books that are worth sending to CGC in all grades, such as Action #1 or Amazing Fantasy #15.  When you isolate those books specifically, you see a much "flatter" population across the 25 different grades (not to mention the number of restored/qualified).

[NP_Gresham]

it depends by age, but I collect Bronze so unless it is an uber-key:

High Grade 9.8-10

Mid grade (VF) 8.0 -9.6 

low grade 4.0 - 7.5

less than 4.0 is a reader

[VintageComics]

12 hours ago, adampasz said:

Listing a 7.0 or 8.0 as High Grade is a stretch IMHO. 

Is it?

It depends on the book but most people confuse 7.0 or 8.0 books with NM when they start grading.

I don't think it's a stretch. The new grading scale of minor increments divided into 0.2's is relatively new.

An old school NM often turned out to be a VFish book today.

[VintageComics]

7 hours ago, Gatsby77 said:

The thread I remember here from years back settled on a consensus of 8.5 (VF+) as the lower-bound of "high-grade."

I can show you 7.0 books that look better than some 8.5's - it's going to depend on the book and the defects - that's why I specifically said VF range and not necessarily a particular grade.

7 hours ago, Gatsby77 said:

Copper and Modern - 9.6+ is high grade

For certain expensive books (TMNT 1, Albedo 2, etc.) 9.0+ is high grade.

Silver Age: 9.0+

Golden Age: 6.0+

Grade should be irrelevant of era.

High grade is high grade regardless of how old the book is. If a book is a 5.0 or a 6.0 I consider it mid grade even if it's a Tec #27.

But being tough in grade, and being a highest grade copy for a tough book (like and early Tec) is an entirely different matter.

 

[Readcomix]

37 minutes ago, VintageComics said:

Is it?

It depends on the book but most people confuse 7.0 or 8.0 books with NM when they start grading.

I don't think it's a stretch. The new grading scale of minor increments divided into 0.2's is relatively new.

An old school NM often turned out to be a VFish book today.

The .2 thing bothers me because it somehow only exists north of 9.0.

I want a book that is labeled 6.4...or 7.8....

Actually, what I really want is the quintessential VG book, labeled "pi" with that squiggly little symbol where the number goes. That would be cool.