When will the “comic con” bubble burst? 5 5

[batman_fan]

Denver Comic Con has some comics but each year it seems less and less.  I actually didn't go last year because the cost is so high to get in and I usually come away with nothing.  There are people selling cosplay stuff, mystery boxes, t-shirts, toys, furniture, etc.  I would be hard pressed to say what the theme of the show is.

[Mercury Man]

Tampa Comic Con and Orlando Megacon were the two big ones here.  It's a 1 1/2 hour drive between the two cities.  Now Tampa has to deal with Tampa Megacon, mere months after Tampa Comic Con.  Too much.   Not to mention some of the smaller cons that happen in the area.   It's officially overkill in Central Florida. 

[WoWitHurts]

11 hours ago, 1950's war comics said:

@WoWitHurts I have noticed that many of the bigger dealers will not risk selling their good books on fleeceBay anymore and  many of those dealers stock are so huge they don't have the time to list anything more than the most popular stuff on their web sites so you have to catch them at cons

Perhaps but I can usually find what I want online. It may take some patience but the books I want seem to come around. Especially raw books. Last C2E2 I went to, the nice raw books were like 30% over guide or more. 

Edited November 20, 2017 by WoWitHurts
grammer

[blazingbob]

34 minutes ago, WoWitHurts said:

Perhaps but I can usually find what I want online. It may take some patience but the books I want seem to come around. Especially raw books. Last C2E2 I went to, the nice raw books were like 30% over guide or more. 

What were the titles/issue #'s of the books that were 30% over guide or more?  Who was selling them?  I love vague,  how about specifics.  We won't get offended.  I would just like less vague and more fact.

[Shaolingoat]

I'll add my thoughts as strictly a buyer and collector.  This past Wizard Chicago was the first "big" con that I attended since getting back into the hobby about three years ago.  Until August I'd mostly just frequented the smaller shows in the DFW area and the April Indianapolis show.  My main take away from the show, was that it reinforced my established buying habits.  90% of my comic budget went to the same dealers whom I either buy from here on the boards or off of their websites.  I met one dealer that I only knew previously from their eBay presence, had a great conversation--and ended up buying a GA Timely that I originally had no plan to go after prior to the weekend.  

Interestingly enough, the main comic on my want list going into the show I turned down as the customer service of the company selling it was so poor.  

I enjoyed the trip quite a bit from a social angle--the board members' dinner and seeing some great books first hand, but I know I'm looking forward to some of the other mentioned shows this coming year: Seattle and Baltimore based on their reputations.  

[ygogolak]

38 minutes ago, blazingbob said:

What were the titles/issue #'s of the books that were 30% over guide or more?  Who was selling them?  I love vague,  how about specifics.  We won't get offended.  I would just like less vague and more fact.

Buyers don't know most dealers by name. Yes, on here there is some great comradarey. You know yourself that you create the market price above normal . Am I wrong?

[blazingbob]

18 minutes ago, ygogolak said:

Buyers don't know most dealers by name. Yes, on here there is some great comradarey. You know yourself that you create the market price above normal . Am I wrong?

Ok,  they don't see the company name on the booth.  How about title/issues?  I was at C2E2,  I bought a lot of great material,  before, during and while the general public was out and about.  I would not assume that all my pricing is above the market place when my website has the ability for customers to make offers. 

[WoWitHurts]

9 hours ago, blazingbob said:

What were the titles/issue #'s of the books that were 30% over guide or more?  Who was selling them?  I love vague,  how about specifics.  We won't get offended.  I would just like less vague and more fact.

Silver and Bronze age Iron man. I am not going to name anyone because they are members here.  

[1Cool]

9 hours ago, blazingbob said:

Ok,  they don't see the company name on the booth.  How about title/issues?  I was at C2E2,  I bought a lot of great material,  before, during and while the general public was out and about.  I would not assume that all my pricing is above the market place when my website has the ability for customers to make offers. 

I got some nice books from Zapp and Leroy but all in all I'd have been pissed if I paid the high ticket price and saw the number of books being offered.  Comic booths accounted for what - 30% of the floor space?  Maybe 25% if you consider the huge area for Stan signing.  It was my first year going so I have no reference in terms of how many comic dealers that was in the past.  But like October has said in the past - it's all about being the first guy in a long box that makes or breaks a show.  I didn't get their until Saturday morning so I'm sure most of the good stuff was long gone.

[1Cool]

I did ask my wife about this topic last night since she knows a few artists that set up at most big Cons within a 6 hour drive of Cleveland.  From her friends perspective - Cons are more profitable then ever.  She pays a few hundred dollars for a small booth (probably several hundred for C2E2) and pulls in several thousands in sales over the 3 days.  Her friends say the only one they hear complaining about sales are the comic book guys since all the cheap art and knick nack guys are doing very well at each and every show.  In terms of a bubble they are still riding high and no popping is in sight.

[blazingbob]

2 hours ago, WoWitHurts said:

Silver and Bronze age Iron man. I am not going to name anyone because they are members here.  

And if I may ask did that seller discount his books?  Since 30% over guide could become 10% over guide if he discounts 20%.  Or are you a buyer that wants it priced at guide and then discounted a certain percentage?  Not picking on you.  Just leading into this.    Who is selling high grade at half guide for that dealer to make money on?

[TheDarkestKnight]

I can only speak for the Memphis/Mid-South area, but the shows here just aren't worth my time anymore.  Spending $40-$50 a few times a year for the opportunity to go flip through the same late-Bronze, Copper, and Modern books every time does not interest me.  If I'm walking in with a few grand in my pocket and then leaving with a few grand in my pocket, something isn't working for me.  I'm quite sure the selection at the bigger shows you all can attend/have attended blow these shows out of the water.

On the flip side, I do enjoy taking my kids to them so they can dress up and learn more about the hobby.  They love going every year, and I let them pick out whatever toys they want while we're there.  But dangit I want to see some GA/SA books! 

I need to bite the bullet and hit up a bigger show one of these days. 

[Jimbo749]

As others have said, finding the local cons with local dealers can be great for deals. Attended Albany Comic Con for the first time this year, and organizers madesure the show was a place to find deals. There was a large poster at the entrance stating something along the lines of "vendors must be prepared to make deals" and this was reiterated over the PA system "we are here to buy/sell comics, make it happen". I wasn't shopping for keys so I can't speak on prices for big ticket items, but quick deals were everywhere. My wife was looking for one book out of a two book set, found both in a set, told the vendor she was only looking for #2 so he said take them both for the price of one. 

[ygogolak]

34 minutes ago, Jimbo749 said:

As others have said, finding the local cons with local dealers can be great for deals. Attended Albany Comic Con for the first time this year, and organizers madesure the show was a place to find deals. There was a large poster at the entrance stating something along the lines of "vendors must be prepared to make deals" and this was reiterated over the PA system "we are here to buy/sell comics, make it happen". I wasn't shopping for keys so I can't speak on prices for big ticket items, but quick deals were everywhere. My wife was looking for one book out of a two book set, found both in a set, told the vendor she was only looking for #2 so he said take them both for the price of one. 

[blazingbob]

44 minutes ago, Jimbo749 said:

As others have said, finding the local cons with local dealers can be great for deals. Attended Albany Comic Con for the first time this year, and organizers madesure the show was a place to find deals. There was a large poster at the entrance stating something along the lines of "vendors must be prepared to make deals" and this was reiterated over the PA system "we are here to buy/sell comics, make it happen". I wasn't shopping for keys so I can't speak on prices for big ticket items, but quick deals were everywhere. My wife was looking for one book out of a two book set, found both in a set, told the vendor she was only looking for #2 so he said take them both for the price of one. 

LOL.  Not exactly sure why this has to be blasted over the PA system since I wouldn't be at a show unless I wanted to sell books.  Maybe I would have added "If you want to buy books make sure you have some money" since I can't tell you how many times I get "If I win the lotto I'll be back for that book"

[Jimbo749]

8 minutes ago, ygogolak said:

Indeed... 

Never been to another show with this "arrangement". 

[ygogolak]

9 minutes ago, blazingbob said:

LOL.  Not exactly sure why this has to be blasted over the PA system since I wouldn't be at a show unless I wanted to sell books.  Maybe I would have added "If you want to buy books make sure you have some money" since I can't tell you how many times I get "If I win the lotto I'll be back for that book"

"Oh, it's that much. OK, I was wondering because I have one."

[justafan]

There might be too many shows or maybe I'm just going to too many shows back to back too often.   As a buyer I got stock fatigue seeing the same dealer stock digging through the same long boxes show after show, dealer after dealer from the east coast to the west and back.  I spent less on comics this year than in any of the previous 3 years and my bank account is the best reflection of this.  however it isn't for lack of finding great books being offered at shows.  it's for the simple fact that I'm down to the more rare items needed for my collection and my tastes for common items has me focused on the highest attainable grade with the best presentation possible and I'm just not finding those at many shows. 

Not really dealers fault as I probably don't represent the majority of collectors and the stuff I'm looking for likely sells long before they make it to shows or before the doors even open. 

The veteran big dealers seem to consistently do well enough to keep going. I met 1st time dealers at sdcc that did ok or at least broke even after slow starts. I saw some of the big guys bring in fresh stock that I managed to find something to buy but that was all at the same show in baltimore where I did most of my buying.

What worries me is the high booth prices for all these shows. I realize for many dealers the opportunity to raid other dealers stock and make it a mini vacation make the overall cost worth the trip but worry that it limits what stock they bring and what smaller dealers can afford. if you're already down $1k-3k that's a large hole to make up for small dealers (worse at sdcc). and how do you keep that up at back to back shows?

big dealers can make that up with a few big sales. smaller ones have to grind it out depending on their stock.  

from my experiences this year talking with different dealers:

1. whales with bags of cash still do appear. there was a guy at baltimore with $50k+ in rolls of $5's and $1's that paid full price for whatever they bought and another at heroes or dc that had a bag o' cash for buyin.

2. There's no shortage of dollar box divers. comics4u at Baltimore had a great setup and it was busy all weekend.

3. the population of speculators and investors has grown as has the age and gender range.  Lots of preteens digging for the next hot book and many of them female.

4. con prices = ebay prices. negotiations seem to start from there or slightly above which has turned me off from some dealers but they find it necessary since everyone now expects a 20% discount from whatever you're asking.

5. I see more buyers for those pop dolls than comics sometimes. are those the next beanie babies? 

Maybe there are too many shows or maybe we just go to too many to appreciate what is there.  I'm cutting back next year to Heroes, awesome con, and baltimore with c2e2 or wizard chicago being my new test market for buying.  SDCC didn't pan out very well last year

[jsilverjanet]

4 hours ago, 1Cool said:

I got some nice books from Zapp and Leroy but all in all I'd have been pissed if I paid the high ticket price and saw the number of books being offered.  Comic booths accounted for what - 30% of the floor space?  Maybe 25% if you consider the huge area for Stan signing.  It was my first year going so I have no reference in terms of how many comic dealers that was in the past.  But like October has said in the past - it's all about being the first guy in a long box that makes or breaks a show.  I didn't get their until Saturday morning so I'm sure most of the good stuff was long gone.

But you aren’t the typical buyer. You are buying to resell. Nothing wrong with that but you are looking for something completely different 

[WoWitHurts]

2 hours ago, blazingbob said:

And if I may ask did that seller discount his books?  Since 30% over guide could become 10% over guide if he discounts 20%.  Or are you a buyer that wants it priced at guide and then discounted a certain percentage?  Not picking on you.  Just leading into this.    Who is selling high grade at half guide for that dealer to make money on?

I feel like you are attacking me a bit. You are implying that I expect high grade books to be sold half guide. Which is not the case. I will pay what I believe is fair pricing. 

I will give you a example. Dealer had IM 99 with a sticker of $60. Guide is $15 for a 9.2 so what is this dealer representing with that price? I can tell you it wasn't a 9.8 candidate. With discount dealer wanted $52. If you think that is a good deal I have a lot of comics to sell to you. IM is notoriously unloved and I can pick up great books under guide all day long online. One of the reasons I like IM is its affordability.