Justice League - restarting the thread 1 1

[jsilverjanet]

Let’s talk about the Black Panther  

[Bosco685]

On 1/30/2018 at 5:21 PM, Bosco685 said:

Mark Hughes from Forbes.com delves into why general audiences didn't take to Batman v Superman and then Justice League. Quite the long article, but with some good points. And he is someone that appreciated these movies.

What Zack Snyder's DCEU Was Really All About, And Why So Many People Rejected It

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Superman was the main issue, in terms of the disconnect between audience preconceptions and the DCEU portrayal. Man of Steel certainly re-imagined many of our general expectations, such as Pa Kent's approach to teaching his son how to restrain his use of powers (one of my own primary complaints about the film), and Superman killing Zod at the end. However, overall the movie managed to walk the line between meeting our foundational expectations for Superman's character and personality while challenging our impression of the world in which he would exist. That was, of course, the whole point of the story, to challenge those ideas and instead ask how the world would really react to the arrival of a superhuman alien in our midst.

 

In Batman v Superman, however, the continuation of that deconstruction of the character and (more importantly) his place in our world took several further steps toward significant change and upending our expectations, and that's where I think it met with serious resistance and complaints from so many people. Much of the story's approach required not merely expanding and accelerating the extent of society's questioning of Superman, but also showing him reacting in ways that undermined traditional portrayals and expectations of him in the process. First society questioned him, then he began to question himself, and finally he began to doubt society. It was a deconstruction within a deconstruction, so to speak. And this was a very difficult and dark journey, and it presented Superman in a way contrary to the most popular iterations in comics, films, and TV.

 

Batman v Superman's Caped Crusader lacks that underlying optimism and hope -- which is, of course, the entire point, that Batman HAS crossed a line and become the bad guy in this tale even though he didn't realize it until confronted with Superman's humanity and his own inhumanity in that singular moment as he stood over Superman's helpless body and was reminded of himself as a little boy helpless to save his own mother and praying someone would save him and save his dying parents.

 

Likewise, during the fight Superman stops even attempting to talk to Batman or explain anything, and it becomes a pure violent expression of their mutual contempt and distrust, with Batman representing (in Superman's eyes) all of the cynicism and unfairness and cruelty of a world without hope, and with Superman representing (in Batman's eyes) all of the failure and fear and meaninglessness in the pursuit of humanity to improve itself and do anything meaningful (and of course, Batman's own specific failures in a world where hopelessness and failure and loss and the triumph of evil are around every corner).

 

Both men, though, have a moment of clarity and epiphany -- Batman realizes Superman's own humanity when he sees him as son begging for his mother's life, his final words a plea to his enemy (Batman) to save his mother. That her name is Martha is often mocked, but obviously (if we are trying to be honest and serious about the issue) the point wasn't merely that their moms had the same name, it's that this crystallized for Batman his ability to perceive himself in Superman and to relate completely to Superman's situation.

 

What? A wild DC fanatic like me posting something negative about these movies??!!

[Bosco685]

2 minutes ago, ComicConnoisseur said:

An example of your issue.

I think Justice League was at a level of the Mummy with Tom Cruise.

A mediocre movie at best.

Let's see if now if Bosco365 comes charging in with the cavalary to defend Justice League's honor!

 

Wow! Someone didn't like that in instigating they had it come back at them. So now they are REALLY going to instigate, and show us how to really instigate.

Edited February 17, 2018 by Bosco685

[Batman]

22 hours ago, ComicConnoisseur said:

An example of your issue.

I think Justice League was at a level of the Mummy with Tom Cruise.

A mediocre movie at best.

Let's see if now if Bosco365 comes charging in with the cavalary to defend Justice League's honor!

 

Mediocre is a word best reserved for Spider-Man: Homecoming.

[Gatsby77]

9 minutes ago, Batman said:

Mediocre is a word best reserved for Spider-Man: Homecoming.

Respectfully disagree.

Because -- Iron Man-style suit aside, it was leagues better than The Amazing Spider-Man, Amazing Spider-Man 2, and Spider-Man 3.

Similarly, much as I was frustrated by BvS, it was still a far better film than Batman Forever and Batman & Robin.

[Batman]

36 minutes ago, Gatsby77 said:

Respectfully disagree.

Because -- Iron Man-style suit aside, it was leagues better than The Amazing Spider-Man, Amazing Spider-Man 2, and Spider-Man 3.

Similarly, much as I was frustrated by BvS, it was still a far better film than Batman Forever and Batman & Robin.

The whole Iron Spider-Man thing was (for me) one of the film's bad points. I agree with you on Amazing Spider-Man & Amazing Spider-Man 2, but I preferred Spider-Man 3 over HC. I found it to be a fairly bog-standard mix of teenage angst and high school superhero encounters. It wasn't boring but I don't find that type of storyline to be entertaining. I guess I have more in common with an aging (and slightly more grumpy) Batman.

The best bit for me was...

Spoiler

...when Liz's father opened the door. Nice twist, if somewhat unlikely when considering the size of the population of NYC.

 

Edited February 18, 2018 by Batman

[Gatsby77]

8 minutes ago, Batman said:

The whole Iron Spider-Man thing was (for me) one of the film's bad points. I agree with you on Amazing Spider-Man & Amazing Spider-Man 2, but I preferred Spider-Man 3 over HC. I found it to be a fairly bog-standard mix of teenage angst and high school superhero encounters. It wasn't boring but I don't find that type of storyline to be entertaining. I guess I have more in common with an aging (and slightly more grumpy) Batman.

The best bit for me was...

  Reveal hidden contents

...when Liz's father opened the door. Nice twist, if somewhat unlikely when considering the size of the population of NYC.

 

Agreed on the best part. That entire seen, through to the drive to the school dance, was the film's high water mark for me.

[jsilverjanet]

The issue with the suit is that it takes over the entire movie once it’s introduced (the abilities of the suit) It becomes more iron man jr than Spider-Man 

example the scene with the ferry, Spider-Man’s approach is to have the machine scan the ship, then he sends his spider to look for a white pick up truck.  I would have found it more interesting to have Spider-Man try and find the villains on his own, handle them etc than get assistance from the suit. That scene clearly separates poor puny Parker vs this new version 

[NewEnglandGothic]

I thought Peter shouldn't have gotten Stark's suit back in the end, as it blunted the impact of him defeating the Vulture without a fancy suit.

I still haven't watched Justice League yet.

Even James Bond would have to lose his gadgets occasionally in For Your Eyes Only or Licence to Kill and rely on his wits more, so you don't lose the audience.

Justice League.

It would have given them another suit opportunity after the Avengers monstrosity one offered to him.

Being the Justice League thread, I'll mention it again.

OOOOooo, how about backwards. Eugael Ecitsuj  

[jsilverjanet]

[Bosco685]

4 hours ago, Batman said:

The whole Iron Spider-Man thing was (for me) one of the film's bad points. I agree with you on Amazing Spider-Man & Amazing Spider-Man 2, but I preferred Spider-Man 3 over HC. I found it to be a fairly bog-standard mix of teenage angst and high school superhero encounters. It wasn't boring but I don't find that type of storyline to be entertaining. I guess I have more in common with an aging (and slightly more grumpy) Batman.

The best bit for me was...

  Reveal hidden contents

...when Liz's father opened the door. Nice twist, if somewhat unlikely when considering the size of the population of NYC.

 

Agreed on the chance of all that lining up to be the father of Peter's girlfriend out of all the folks throughout a massive area. But boy, did that make for a great scene.

[Batman]

1 hour ago, NewEnglandGothic said:

I thought Peter shouldn't have gotten Stark's suit back in the end, as it blunted the impact of him defeating the Vulture without a fancy suit.

I still haven't watched Justice League yet.

Even James Bond would have to lose his gadgets occasionally in For Your Eyes Only or Licence to Kill and rely on his wits more, so you don't lose the audience.

Justice League.

It would have given them another suit opportunity after the Avengers monstrosity one offered to him.

Being the Justice League thread, I'll mention it again.

OOOOooo, how about backwards. Eugael Ecitsuj  

Kltpzyxm.

Whatever you do, don't watch Justice League... Batman has far too many gadgets.

 

[Batman]

4 hours ago, Gatsby77 said:

Agreed on the best part. That entire seen, through to the drive to the school dance, was the film's high water mark for me.

36 minutes ago, Bosco685 said:

Agreed on the chance of all that lining up to be the father of Peter's girlfriend out of all the folks throughout a massive area. But boy, did that make for a great scene.

Definitely a very good scene throughout, with some great acting from Keaton.

[Bosco685]

10 minutes ago, Batman said:

Definitely a very good scene throughout, with some great acting from Keaton.

Two solid scenes.

 

 

[Bosco685]

Now that the digital copy is out, any updates will probably come from overseas theaters and any Domestic discount theaters.

 

[kagenish]

yeah some of the scenes that were released made me question why the movie was cut to only 2hrs

[Bosco685]

13 minutes ago, kagenish said:

yeah some of the scenes that were released made me question why the movie was cut to only 2hrs

Unfortunately, a misguided and concerned CEO. Hard to debate with someone at that level when they don't want to hear it.

[kagenish]

3 minutes ago, Bosco685 said:

Unfortunately, a misguided and concerned CEO. Hard to debate with someone at that level when they don't want to hear it.

big time I think he was one of many reason things got rushed in BvS, SS, and JL. 

[Bosco685]

‘Justice League’ Blu-ray clip reveals extended Wonder Woman rescue scene

 

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In the theatrical cut of Justice League we see Wonder Woman take out three bad guys before getting rid of a bomb. A new clip from the Justice League Blu-ray extras of a pre-production stunt rehearsal reveals an extended version of that scene. In the clip above, we see the Wonder Woman stunt actor take out seven bad guys very quickly, not unlike Faora did in Man of Steel. The stunt footage includes the sweep kick which was present in the Justice League trailers but removed for the theatrical cut.

 

The Justice League Blu-ray features just over an hour of behind-the-scenes footage and two deleted Superman scenes. It’s available for pre-order now and will be released on March 13th.

 

[Bosco685]