STAR WARS : Episode IX December 20, 2019 6 6

[Bosco685]

1 minute ago, Gatsby77 said:

?

*Of course* Disney knows how to read a calendar, but that's irrelevant, and has nothing to do with the actual math.

My point?

It's absolutely disingenuous for either Scott Mendelson or you to highlight an "86%" drop from last Wednesday (New Year's Day) to this Wednesday as "whopping," let alone *unexpected* when the data show The Rise of Skywalker outperformed The Last Jedi both in absolute terms on those comparable days *and* on a % drop basis.

If anything, the opposite's true -- Rise of Skywalker *held better* than did The Last Jedi over that period -- it made more money on New Year's day than did The Last Jedi *and* it had a smaller % drop a week later.

Uh-huh. Meanwhile, I have captured all the films's results and the differences between them. But you have it all figured out.

Disingenuous?

For any fan of the Star Wars brand, this is painful to see how the overall modern franchise has been managed. This is the ENDGAME of this short franchise run, and it is under-performing against Rogue One same days?? Rogue One.

[mattn792]

58 minutes ago, drotto said:

 

The trend with Star Wars is what is important now, not the individual film box office.  With ROS now tracking to finish below R1, that is going to be viewed as a disappointment.  The recent argument has been that the trilogy films have outperformed the solo films, so all is good.  That may now not be so.

 

Where does Star Wars go now.  All the movies so far have pulled heavily on the nastolgia strings.  The strings have basically been used up, and the few remaining are much weaker.  It seems that this nastolgia fuel and manipulation, almost more than anything has fueled recent Star Wars.  Now any new Star Wars by necessity and cold reality, must be new material and venture into new territory (the general public has little knowledge of the EU).

The IP must be reinvented and reinvigorated.  To avoid further slide, the new films must be special, or dwindling returns will continue.

 

The nostalgia strings were completely used up by TFA.  Had Johnson not epically failed at reinventing and reinvigorating, I wonder if Rise of Skywalker would've turned out better.  The box office numbers certainly have shown that yet another trip down memory lane was not what the movie going public was looking for.

[mattn792]

14 minutes ago, Gatsby77 said:

?

*Of course* Disney knows how to read a calendar, but that's irrelevant, and has nothing to do with the actual math.

My point?

It's absolutely disingenuous for either Scott Mendelson or you to highlight an "86%" drop from last Wednesday (New Year's Day) to this Wednesday as "whopping," let alone *unexpected* when the data show The Rise of Skywalker outperformed The Last Jedi both in absolute terms on those comparable days *and* on a % drop basis.

If anything, the opposite's true -- Rise of Skywalker *held better* than did The Last Jedi over that period -- it made more money on New Year's day than did The Last Jedi *and* it had a smaller % drop a week later.

You're really splitting hairs when your defense of ROS comes down to it dropping 1.5% less than TLJ while earning an extra $600,000 in gross receipts.

[Bosco685]

5 minutes ago, mattn792 said:

You're really splitting hairs when your defense of ROS comes down to it dropping 1.5% less than TLJ while earning an extra $600,000 in gross receipts.

Don't be so disingenuous. 

[mattn792]

1 minute ago, Bosco685 said:

Don't be so disingenuous. 

Don't disparately disguise dual disingenuousness; don duality deftly.

[Bosco685]

23 minutes ago, mattn792 said:

Don't disparately disguise dual disingenuousness; don duality deftly.

[paperheart]

Jumanji down 87%, Frozen II down 88%, Spies in Disguise down 91% from last Wed- but that being said, ROS is rolling over like a dog.

[Gatsby77]

1 hour ago, paperheart said:

Jumanji down 87%, Frozen II down 88%, Spies in Disguise down 91% from last Wed- but that being said, ROS is rolling over like a dog.

This.

I'm not defending Rise of Skywalker -- I thought it was a weak sauce entry, the worst of the primary nine films but for The Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones. And it's better than Solo, but not by much.

Nor am I defending its *overall* financial performance -- it deserves to get spanked at the box office by Rogue One, if only because Rogue One was a *far* better film. In fact, I think Rogue One was a better film than Return of the Jedi.

But I am against people improperly using statistics to mislead.

Which, in this case, was posting the 86% Wednesday - Wednesday drop without context or comparable benchmarks. Fact is, it's an average / expected drop, and was less than that of The Last Jedi across every metric.

There are plenty of reasons to criticize the film -- from its story choices to its overall mediocrity to its overall lackluster (for a Star Wars film) financial performance.

But its Weds. - Weds. drop ain't one of them.

[media_junkie]

Well I'd have to say that you can't really count Frozen 2, it came out a full month before ROS.  Additionally it has done better at the box office than the preceding Frozen film, that cannot be said about ROS.

[darkstar]

On 12/25/2019 at 10:14 AM, fantastic_four said:

It seems that you misspelled "mind-blowingly awesome" there somehow.  

It was a walk-out-of-the-theater moment. 

[@therealsilvermane]

People ranking any one of the Star Wars Prequel Trilogy, New Trilogy, or spin-off movies over any one of the Original Trilogy films is causing a disturbance in the Force.

Just because we got to see Darth Vader do a Freddy Krueger impersonation in Rogue One does not make it a better movie than Return of the Jedi. The SW movies after ROJ are all basically “ fan service” films which serve more as cinematic tributes to the three greatest sci-fi adventure fantasy films of all time.

Edited January 9, 2020 by @therealsilvermane

[Bosco685]

1 hour ago, Gatsby77 said:

This.

I'm not defending Rise of Skywalker -- I thought it was a weak sauce entry, the worst of the primary nine films but for The Phantom Menace and Attack of the Clones. And it's better than Solo, but not by much.

Nor am I defending its *overall* financial performance -- it deserves to get spanked at the box office by Rogue One, if only because Rogue One was a *far* better film. In fact, I think Rogue One was a better film than Return of the Jedi.

But I am against people improperly using statistics to mislead.

Which, in this case, was posting the 86% Wednesday - Wednesday drop without context or comparable benchmarks. Fact is, it's an average / expected drop, and was less than that of The Last Jedi across every metric.

There are plenty of reasons to criticize the film -- from its story choices to its overall mediocrity to its overall lackluster (for a Star Wars film) financial performance.

But its Weds. - Weds. drop ain't one of them.

I guess your statistical misrepresentation worked great with Joker though, right? You claimed I was being disingenuous for posting the article and bolding what he stated, but you were acting like a temper-tantrum addled child. Yet the rest of what your Lord and Master, Scott Mendelson, had to say was on-point. 

The film is definitely suffering for right now. And rightly so only because the vision here across this franchise was not well structured. Not because ROS is a horrible film, as enough people are enjoying it. 86% if we go by Rotten Tomatoes. 

Meanwhile, the 2022 film launch will probably bring new energy because of a two-year step back to think through a 400-year jump back in time. If this is where they head, it could be a cool prequel.

Edited January 10, 2020 by Bosco685

[Bosco685]

Critics score takes a dip. Audience score - hold on to your seats - remains at 86%.

[MetalPSI]

Ride the spiral to the end, we may just go where no one's been

 

Spiral out, keep going.....

[paperheart]

Sung to the tune of Send in the Clowns:

It's such a (female dog).

I'm in despair.

Me in my seat,

You are nowhere

Where are the crowds?

 

Fandom is pissed.

Johnson reproved.

JJ keeps flailing around,

Disney can lose.

Where are the crowds?

There ought to be crowds.

[Mr Sneeze]

1 hour ago, @therealsilvermane said:

People ranking any one of the Star Wars Prequel Trilogy, New Trilogy, or spin-off movies over any one of the Original Trilogy films is causing a disturbance in the Force.

Just because we got to see Darth Vader do a Freddy Krueger impersonation in Rogue One does not make it a better movie than Return of the Jedi. The SW movies after ROJ are all basically “ fan service” films which serve more as cinematic tributes to the three greatest sci-fi adventure fantasy films of all time.

If you told me I could only take 3 movies of the 11 then I'll take the prequels and I'm going to also assume I can have your copies, yes?

[@therealsilvermane]

16 minutes ago, Mr Sneeze said:

If you told me I could only take 3 movies of the 11 then I'll take the prequels and I'm going to also assume I can have your copies, yes?

You can have ‘em. I tried rewatching them recently and couldn’t do it. 

[Gatsby77]

13 hours ago, @therealsilvermane said:

People ranking any one of the Star Wars Prequel Trilogy, New Trilogy, or spin-off movies over any one of the Original Trilogy films is causing a disturbance in the Force.

Just because we got to see Darth Vader do a Freddy Krueger impersonation in Rogue One does not make it a better movie than Return of the Jedi. The SW movies after ROJ are all basically “ fan service” films which serve more as cinematic tributes to the three greatest sci-fi adventure fantasy films of all time.

Nah.

I would have still ranked Rogue One over Jedi even it had ended with Jyn and Cassion dying on the beach. The Vader & Leia stinger at the end was just gravy.

If you go back and do watch the three trilogies today, it reveals how weak Return of the Jedi was. There's a whole 20 minute spot when they first get to Endor where the film grinds to a halt. The film is markedly worse than the prior two chapters.

[Hollywood1892]

Looks like Darth Revan has been brought into Canon, along with a couple other Sith Lords from video games....because of the movie

https://www-pcgamer-com.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/www.pcgamer.com/amp/star-wars-rise-of-skywalker-makes-kotors-revan-canon/?amp_js_v=a2&amp_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQCKAE%3D#aoh=15786717461639&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&amp_tf=From %1%24s&ampshare=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.pcgamer.com%2Fstar-wars-rise-of-skywalker-makes-kotors-revan-canon%2F

Edited January 10, 2020 by Hollywood1892

[bane]

2 hours ago, Gatsby77 said:

If you go back and do watch the three trilogies today, it reveals how weak Return of the Jedi was. There's a whole 20 minute spot when they first get to Endor where the film grinds to a halt. The film is markedly worse than the prior two chapters.

This. Having seen Return of the Jedi several times the only parts of the movie I enjoy is Yoda's send off, the Battle of Endor (only the space parts) and Luke/Vader/Palpatine. The rest of it is utterly forgettable. Ford does his best to "ham" it up, the whole Jabba's palace scene always bored me to tears and meeting the Ewoks as Gatsby pointed out, grinds the film to a halt.