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Incredible Hulk #181 - is it *that* red-hot?
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1,931 posts in this topic

14 hours ago, jason4 said:

A year from now these prices could seem like a bargain the way this book is going and going. Anybody asks me if they should buy or wait I say buy

could be. also could be plateauing now and things calm down for awhile. if you were paying attention this time last year, that's what happened to AF15 prices. they are now recovering, but last winter they dropped significantly from the summer highs. i'm not saying anything conclusively about Hulk181 but it's food for thought. the speed and magnitude of this run-up is truly unprecedented, which makes it a bit concerning. 

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Buy your new copy when the right copy/price/timing comes along, then sell your old copy to help pay for it. If you sell your old copy first, you'll be too anxious to replace it and may make an impulse buy.

I think we've seen the big runup in this book for this year, seems like the book has jumped 20 - 30% since January and there's no way that continues over the next 6 months. (thumbsu

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5 hours ago, kimik said:

Sell off something else to upgrade and keep your current copy. It is a book that will keep on running.

Good point. Let me see what else I can try to sell off. Thanks!

Edited by rogue14
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I think there are certain events that will trigger a plateau or downward trend:

  1. Character no longer prominent or interesting anymore.

  2. Horrible movie or media exposure.

  3. Prices are so high that people can’t afford it and issues that are for sale start to accumulate due to not anyone buying them anymore.

In regards to Wolverine and Hulk 181, I don’t think this is the case yet.  In fact, now that Disney has countered Comcasts offer and essentially made it very clear they want Fox and determined to get back the rights to the X-men, wolverine, etc and gets those characters back to the MCU, I think the prices will just keep going up.  There are less and less copies available, especially graded ones and ones with the MVS intact.  IMHO, I say buy now before Hulk 181 (or even Hulk 180) goes higher. 

Edited by Supraman16
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1 hour ago, Dark Knight said:

If anyone is looking to buy a copy, I would wait and see if prices start plateuing and/or a pullback. I agree with alexgross that there will come a point where prices will stabilize and get back to reality. 

I have been using that logic the past three years in not nabbing a 9.4 or two for my personal collection. The prices keep running up. This book is similar to AF #15 - you think it is going to stop rising but it continues.

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53 minutes ago, kimik said:

I have been using that logic the past three years in not nabbing a 9.4 or two for my personal collection. The prices keep running up. This book is similar to AF #15 - you think it is going to stop rising but it continues.

i agree, many people have been saying this book is overrated pretty much forever, and that it would drop. but the recent surge, something like increasing in value by 25-30% in a matter of weeks, is more suspect as far as whether it can be sustained. but there is no doubt that the longer trend for the book is only up. i'm just talking about the next half year or so when i suggest to wait and see. buying when something is at a record high can sometimes be a bad move. but, like you say, it may never be lower than it is now. 

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49 minutes ago, www.alexgross.com said:

i agree, many people have been saying this book is overrated pretty much forever, and that it would drop. but the recent surge, something like increasing in value by 25-30% in a matter of weeks, is more suspect as far as whether it can be sustained. but there is no doubt that the longer trend for the book is only up. i'm just talking about the next half year or so when i suggest to wait and see. buying when something is at a record high can sometimes be a bad move. but, like you say, it may never be lower than it is now. 

I understand that it seems there was a sudden rise, but if you look at sold listings from low to high on ebay, you'd see as far back as May: 6.5s slowly rising and lower grades following suit. There weren't many 7.0-7.5s etc during this time, and when there were, they went more than the 1700 they were going for...

My point is that for the amount available, the progression was the same as it's always been, but with fewer available, the lowers are matching the higher and it seems to grow quicker. :foryou:

 

Edited by ADAMANTIUM
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I remember 3 or 4 years ago, a boardie had a gorgeous 9.4 with white pages.  I was waiting for one of my stocks to hit a certain number.  Well, that didn't work out and I'm kicking myself for not buying it then.  9.2's were going for 2 grand and the 9.4 was $2,750.  White paged beauty with great centering.  I'd have to spend nearly triple that now.  Not gonna happen. 

I think the only way 181 moves down is if we have a recession or major conflict.  Barring that, it will be flat or continue to climb. 

 

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1 hour ago, scooter99 said:

I remember 3 or 4 years ago, a boardie had a gorgeous 9.4 with white pages.  I was waiting for one of my stocks to hit a certain number.  Well, that didn't work out and I'm kicking myself for not buying it then.  9.2's were going for 2 grand and the 9.4 was $2,750.  White paged beauty with great centering.  I'd have to spend nearly triple that now.  Not gonna happen. 

I think the only way 181 moves down is if we have a recession or major conflict.  Barring that, it will be flat or continue to climb. 

 

If 2008 couldn't affect major keys then any future eco downturns won't touch 181's either

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4 hours ago, ADAMANTIUM said:

I understand that it seems there was a sudden rise, but if you look at sold listings from low to high on ebay, you'd see as far back as May: 6.5s slowly rising and lower grades following suit. There weren't many 7.0-7.5s etc during this time, and when there were, they went more than the 1700 they were going for...

My point is that for the amount available, the progression was the same as it's always been, but with fewer available, the lowers are matching the higher and it seems to grow quicker. :foryou:

 

i am aware that you like to get into "debates" with other members here, but i don't believe your statement is accurate adam. there WAS a very sudden rise. on march 8 i was quoted $4800 direct for a 9.2 WP by a dealer who had the book on feebay. i hemmed and hawed. meanwhile, he sold it on feebay within a few days for his asking price of $5300, a very high price at the time. now a 9.2WP is going for 6k.  my 9.0WP appreciated from $2100 to around $3600 over about two and a half years. then, within a few months, it went from $3600 to about $5k. those are just two examples of dramatic price increases compared to past performance. i have quite a few other examples as well. so, you just have to go back a little bit earlier than may. 

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9 hours ago, www.alexgross.com said:

i am aware that you like to get into "debates" with other members here, but i don't believe your statement is accurate adam. there WAS a very sudden rise. on march 8 i was quoted $4800 direct for a 9.2 WP by a dealer who had the book on feebay. i hemmed and hawed. meanwhile, he sold it on feebay within a few days for his asking price of $5300, a very high price at the time. now a 9.2WP is going for 6k.  my 9.0WP appreciated from $2100 to around $3600 over about two and a half years. then, within a few months, it went from $3600 to about $5k. those are just two examples of dramatic price increases compared to past performance. i have quite a few other examples as well. so, you just have to go back a little bit earlier than may. 

I apologize, i didn't realize i had that reputation :sorry:

Your right, I wouldn't know about higher grades, not my wheel house. I had been watching up to 8.0 and had justified the increase in my mind is all. :foryou: 

That's the reason I mentioned it was because I had a perception and was confused, given the info I provided, if you were basing your opinion off the same info is all. 

:shy:

 

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I guess we shall see what happens in the future. Before this huge surge in price increase, the book has had steady growth and yes I don't think prices will get down to what it was a year ago. 

I see this book acting like how AF 15 did last year where it also went to astronomical price levels than had a recent pullback a few months ago. Some thought too that prices will keep going up, but guess what it didn't. 

With more IH 181 copies made available than AF 15 in practically all grades, I don't see why IH 181 would be any different than AF 15's slight dip. AF 15 is arguably the 3rd most important book in the hobby too! 

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The Disney deal might have something to do with this.

Less and less have become available.

This has been trending upwards for a long time.

It plateaued for a long time in lower grades.

The lower grades trending upward because of spikes in higher grades? Yes, sure.

Are they really that big of spikes? AF 15 spiked by 10's of thousands, and we critique IH 181 because of hundreds with less and less availability. I'm one of them, the shier number are out there is starting to not matter as not everyone who wants one has one, and those that do, still want theirs compared to the $$.

A dip? of course! as it rests and plateaus again, there will be undercutters just to make a sale. There are plenty out there. Anyone who finds this in the wild, "may" want to make a buck. 

Edited by ADAMANTIUM
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12 minutes ago, ADAMANTIUM said:

The Disney deal might have something to do with this.

Less and less have become available.

This has been trending upwards for a long time.

It plateaued for a long time in lower grades.

The lower grades trending upward because of spikes in higher grades? Yes, sure.

Are they really that big of spikes? AF 15 spiked by 10's of thousands, and we critique IH 181 because of hundreds with less and less availability. I'm one of them, the shier number are out there is starting to not matter as not everyone who wants one has one, and those that do, still want theirs compared to the $$.

A dip? of course! as it rests and plateaus again, there will be undercutters just to make a sale. There are plenty out there. Anyone who finds this in the wild, "may" want to make a buck. 

You are correct, the % increase in price isn't unprecedented in this highly speculative market we're in... Some people like seeing non-dealers post dozens of copies, to me...that's a red flag. The top-dog book of each comic age certainly gets special attention though...AF15, HULK181, TMNT1...I suppose because each one has top nostalgic appeal to a certain age group.

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Definitely due for correction, but when and by how much is the $100 question :shy: 

If 2.5-5.0 start hovering around $1800-2200 as opposed to the $800-1200 that it was, then will have that trend to go on. :foryou: 

I do stand by my opinions that the 6.5 and lower were the common growth that we've been seeing.

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7 minutes ago, Callaway29 said:

You are correct, the % increase in price isn't unprecedented in this highly speculative market we're in... Some people like seeing non-dealers post dozens of copies, to me...that's a red flag. The top-dog book of each comic age certainly gets special attention though...AF15, HULK181, TMNT1...I suppose because each one has top nostalgic appeal to a certain age group.

I'm sure the generation of collectors will have something to do with corrections too. How relevant and etc. What I want to say is a sale is a sale, but if a spike happens, I want to be aware of it is all.

Some are going to be outliers, but if $4,800 becomes the new trend for a 9.2 or 9.4 and the resulting price needed on ebay factoring in the fees, we shall see.

Lucky enough, as oppose to AF 15, there should be enough IH 181's available to notice such trends. :wishluck: here is hoping, as less and less people are listing to see where this price spike takes it before listing on ebay.

Got to give it to that dealer that stuck by his gut to hold out for the price that he wanted (shrug) 

Edited by ADAMANTIUM
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I know I'm just one single owner of a Hulk 181 9.2 , however if you offered me $8000 U.S right now for my copy I would respectfully decline. I wouldn't even consider it. That's even considering the potential conversion to the Canadian dollar. The long term importance and potential cost of replacing this book is not worth $8000 in 2018 to me. I'd be willing to guess that there are large number of others out there that are not flippers and have no need to sell. As long as that percentage is high this book is locked in for the foreseeable future. 

The reality is, as far as collectibles or hobbies go, this is a "small price" to pay for one of the crown jewels of a respective hobby. Really , outside Superman, Batman and Spiderman you have Wolverine. The cover of Hulk 181 is iconic, the character is iconic, etc.  

Another point I would raise is that fact that comics have a lot of room to go. I know what I pay to expand my guitar collection and my brother to build his vintage baseball card collection. Comics such as Hulk 181 in a grade of 9.2 are "cheap" by comparison. This hobby has a lot of catching up to do and will continue over the next few years. 

I'm saying this purely as a casual collector and not a seller. 

 

 

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2 hours ago, shane1956 said:

 

Another point I would raise is that fact that comics have a lot of room to go. I know what I pay to expand my guitar collection and my brother to build his vintage baseball card collection. Comics such as Hulk 181 in a grade of 9.2 are "cheap" by comparison. This hobby has a lot of catching up to do and will continue over the next few years. 

 

 

I’m not sure what you’re basing that on. A 1952 Mickey Mantle PSA 9 needs to be compared to Amazing Fantasy 15 in 9.4-9.6, not a 9.2 Hulk 181. I would not say that comics are undervalued compared to sports cards in general.

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1 hour ago, Paul_Maul said:

I’m not sure what you’re basing that on. A 1952 Mickey Mantle PSA 9 needs to be compared to Amazing Fantasy 15 in 9.4-9.6, not a 9.2 Hulk 181. I would not say that comics are undervalued compared to sports cards in general.

Respectfully,I made zero mention of a 1952 topps Mantle. Nor did I attempt to directly compare a comic , in this case Hulk 181 , to a particular card.  Perhaps I might have got away from my intended point when I used the sports card example. I don't want to get into a sports card vs comic book debate as that really wasn't what I was trying to convey in the post. 

My point was simply that people who are passionate about their hobbies are willing to pay more on particular item than what we have traditionally seen being paid for certain  key books such as Hulk 181 . Many  who collect guitars for example think nothing of paying $12,000 for 2018 Fender custom shop  stratocaster . It's what they enjoy , it's what they collect, it's not an investment. They don't worry about the  bubbles or the potential rise and fall based on speculation or trends. 

There are many who have equal amounts of disposable income who are just as passionate about comics . They will ,when the time comes, think nothing of droppping $8000 or whatever the price of the day is on a Hulk 181 in say 9.2 or whatever the desired particular grade. After seeing  what people pay for many things  outside of the comic world rising prices are not really surprising. 

The point is the money is there , the passion is there,  and these key books cost a lot less than what people pay when collecting many other things such as , cars, guitars, jewelry, etc. As a guy who is just as passionate about buying and collecting guitars , comics are in fact relatively and significantly  "cheaper" by comparison ;hence I see them as having room to grow. 

 

 

 

 

Edited by shane1956
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