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Stan Lee forgeries, a general thread
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210 posts in this topic

1 minute ago, James J Johnson said:

Oh. Same company. Separated by distance.

yeah I'm hazy on the details but he was pretty amazed/concerned.  If I remember correctly he said what was to stop him from just grabbing any book and signing it himself then heading over to station 2.

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Anyway it was a once in a lifetime oddball situation not something that is ongoing and can be taken advantage of by scammers.

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16 hours ago, kav said:

any sig not in a yellow label slab is 'name written on cover'.  doesnt matter how well executed.

I've said in the past that an almost perfect scam is to forge a sig on the first page of the book (say, Jack Kirby), and submit the book for grading. The slab will have a note that says "Jack Kirby written in pencil on first page" or something to that effect. CGC won't verify it's a real signature, and the location will imply it's an old-school signature. The owner/seller of the slab will have a book that appears to be a legit signature without anyone seeing it. Buyer cracks the book and discovers it's fake? Can't return it because you can't prove it's what was in the slab.

 

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2 hours ago, stock_rotation said:

I've said in the past that an almost perfect scam is to forge a sig on the first page of the book (say, Jack Kirby), and submit the book for grading. The slab will have a note that says "Jack Kirby written in pencil on first page" or something to that effect. CGC won't verify it's a real signature, and the location will imply it's an old-school signature. The owner/seller of the slab will have a book that appears to be a legit signature without anyone seeing it. Buyer cracks the book and discovers it's fake? Can't return it because you can't prove it's what was in the slab.

 

The flaw in that scam is only a fool would pay more than normal market value for the slab with "name written on first page".

Then again...I see lots of sales of the forged signature books so there are indeed plenty of fools out there. :facepalm:

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7 hours ago, Artboy99 said:

The flaw in that scam is only a fool would pay more than normal market value for the slab with "name written on first page".

This! +1

Maybe if this was pre-2000 times, versus 20 years later. Most old school signatures for collectors were acquired on splash pages because even less than condition conscious comic collectors were adamant about having the covers defaced by ink, even if that ink was placed there by the artist/creator. That was the norm, and the exceptions were the cover signed comics. Since CGC's emergence and with the gradually increasing use and population/popularity of the witnessed signature series books, cover signatures have supplanted splash page signatures as the more desirable standard! Stands to reason. You can see the signature. Slabbed books with splash page signatures are not visible.

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2 hours ago, James J Johnson said:

This! +1

Maybe if this was pre-2000 times, versus 20 years later. Most old school signatures for collectors were acquired on splash pages because even less than condition conscious comic collectors were adamant about having the covers defaced by ink, even if that ink was placed there by the artist/creator. That was the norm, and the exceptions were the cover signed comics. Since CGC's emergence and with the gradually increasing use and population/popularity of the witnessed signature series books, cover signatures have supplanted splash page signatures as the more desirable standard! Stands to reason. You can see the signature. Slabbed books with splash page signatures are not visible.

Years ago, probably back in the 1970s, I got a cover signed by Al Williamson. It was Flash Gordon #1 and there was a large area of the cover that was white, making it a candidate for a cover autograph.

FlashGordon#1.jpg

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1 hour ago, Tony D said:

Years ago, probably back in the 1970s, I got a cover signed by Al Williamson. It was Flash Gordon #1 and there was a large area of the cover that was white, making it a candidate for a cover autograph.

FlashGordon#1.jpg

That is too inviting to pass up. A perfect cover for his signature.

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34 minutes ago, James J Johnson said:
2 hours ago, Tony D said:

FlashGordon#1.jpg

That is too inviting to pass up. A perfect cover for his signature.

That is a top-notch signature!!

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On 12/18/2018 at 9:18 PM, kav said:

If its a studio authorized poster they are legit.  thats pretty cool.  keep all paperwork!

I hate to tell you, but the signed cast posters with "studio" holograms are all fake. The "movie premier cast signed poster" is a huge scam that has been going on for years.

Marvel Avengers Cast Movie Poster with letter and holograms

Fake Autographed Premiere Poster Crisis?

sl160018.jpg

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On 12/17/2018 at 11:01 PM, mattn792 said:

FFS, every Stan signature this guy has listed looks the EXACT SAME.  That's a dead giveaway by itself.

A forger has to learn a signature, and because it is learned and repeated exactly the same way every time, they have no natural variation. "Cookie cutter" fakes. This is how and why you are able to identify specific forgers.

Could also be some sort of trace job as mentioned by someone else.

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On 12/18/2018 at 3:17 PM, Joosh said:

if these guys are terrible at forgeries and getting away with it out in the open via eBay, what about the not so obvious forgers we aren’t talking about?

 

Thye guys doing Stan Lee on dollar bin books are kitchen table forgers -- ebay hack bottom feeders.

The really skilled forgers are doing Beatles Albums, Babe Ruth baseballs, etc.

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On 12/19/2018 at 5:44 AM, stock_rotation said:

I've said in the past that an almost perfect scam is to forge a sig on the first page of the book (say, Jack Kirby), and submit the book for grading. The slab will have a note that says "Jack Kirby written in pencil on first page" or something to that effect. CGC won't verify it's a real signature, and the location will imply it's an old-school signature. The owner/seller of the slab will have a book that appears to be a legit signature without anyone seeing it. Buyer cracks the book and discovers it's fake? Can't return it because you can't prove it's what was in the slab.

 

Lol who knows?  I don't really care, I didn't even know it was there...

406591999_wgG8E71lSNSqxSl8nMHmw_thumb_72c.jpg.dd7ab660b26288793768efae9fb10252.jpg

UNADJUSTEDNONRAW_thumb_6e7.jpg.005c68b1a113af6f47ebdc0cc4a3555e.jpg

I was checking the pages before I sent it in and saw it...  Also I have owned the book for 40 years.  Maybe fake maybe not, I sure can't tell...

Edited by Karl Liebl
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23 minutes ago, Mr. Zipper said:

I hate to tell you, but the signed cast posters with "studio" holograms are all fake. The "movie premier cast signed poster" is a huge scam that has been going on for years.

Marvel Avengers Cast Movie Poster with letter and holograms

Fake Autographed Premiere Poster Crisis?

sl160018.jpg

I didnt know the right words to use-I meant posters the studio has personally got signed by the actors for some kind of benefit or something.  Yes those ones in your pic are all bogus.

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I believe the Kirby on FF 13 is good. 

Bear in mind, just a few years ago, Kirby was an inexpensive signature and generally not the target of forgers. It has only become so in the last few years as his signature skyrocketed. I believe this is partially due to the realization among many collectors that "KIrby" signatures previously thought to be authentic -- 1990s lithos, books, etc. -- are now suspected to be proxy signatures.  

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On 12/17/2018 at 10:48 PM, James J Johnson said:

Absolutely. Some are using a projector and cel that places the signature on the medium. Those wlll be the closest each and every time, tracing that projection without much variation in the macro details, like 57LesPaulGoldTop. I'm fairly certain that's what he's using, IMO.

What won't be duplicated is the track itself. The way the line thins and thickens and it's angles, based on how Stan turns the pen with each trajectory change! This is why most will not show a super closeup of the signature. They know that would be a dead giveaway. The forgers are savvy about some things, and downright blithering about others.

Not only are 57LesPaulGoldTop’s signatures obviously fake, but so is his feedback on EBay! Even though he has 100% positive feedback, most of it is from the same buyer, who probably is him on an alternate account.

 

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