Universal Blue Label with noted color touch restoration - ???!!! 1 1

[Frank.Einstein]

I just noted this Superman #32 CGC 7.0 Universal/Blue which notes "Very minor amount of color touch on cover".

Since when is any comic with a blue label permitted to have colour touch? Shouldn't it be purple? If they now allow this, what % of restoration is allowed for a blue label?

Baffling. Anyone have any insight into this?

(ebay item# 382418343259)

[comicquant]

This is not an uncommon notation on universal labels for GA books with very little color touch and/or glue.  You won't see this on any SA or newer.

Edited March 23, 2018 by comicquant

[Frank.Einstein]

1 minute ago, comicquant said:

This is not an uncommon notation on universal labels for GA books with very little color touch (and glue).  You won't see this on any SA or newer.

Interesting - I somehow have never seen one. Regardless, I think they need to be consistent. Apples to Apples.

[Bomber-Bob]

18 minutes ago, Frank.Einstein said:

Interesting - I somehow have never seen one. Regardless, I think they need to be consistent. Apples to Apples.

I agree . From what I heard, it was some sort of concession in the early start up days of CGC, when they were taking input about their proposed grading 'standards'. I think some otherwise high grade pedigrees, like Church copies, had some of this minor type of resto and collectors were nervous. Supposedly, this is only given to books that did not benefit, grade wise, from the CT. Looking at your example, there is an upper right FC corner chip that holds the book at 8.0 . The minor CT would not have improved the grade, hence Blue Label. Crazy.

[JollyComics]

2 hours ago, Bomber-Bob said:

I agree . From what I heard, it was some sort of concession in the early start up days of CGC, when they were taking input about their proposed grading 'standards'. I think some otherwise high grade pedigrees, like Church copies, had some of this minor type of resto and collectors were nervous. Supposedly, this is only given to books that did not benefit, grade wise, from the CT. Looking at your example, there is an upper right FC corner chip that holds the book at 8.0 . The minor CT would not have improved the grade, hence Blue Label. Crazy.

Were you nervous, were you?

[PovertyRow]

5 hours ago, Frank.Einstein said:

If they now allow this, what % of restoration is allowed for a blue label?

CGC has been doing this pretty much since it's inception. Very minor CT or glue on Golden Age books. It came from the general consensus of dealers and heavy collectors. This was also why plain old Scotch-type tape was allowed in a Blue label but archival would get a PLOD as Scotch type tape was historically used to reinforce even new books by old time collectors.

[Foley]

I asked the same thing a couple years ago if you want to read through the info there.

[Mr. Zipper]

Not unheard of. My Superman 11 is blue label with a "very minor amount of glue." It appears there is a tiny dab of glue on the tear bottom front cover. It really doesn't fix anything or improve the grade.

In my opinion, this makes more sense than mindlessly PLODing low or midgrade books for tiny amounts of marker hit or glue that do nothing to improve grade. They should be considered flaws and graded accordingly at that level. 

Edited March 23, 2018 by Mr. Zipper

[freefall2all]

On 3/23/2018 at 9:57 AM, comicquant said:

This is not an uncommon notation on universal labels for GA books with very little color touch and/or glue.  You won't see this on any SA or newer.

Sorry for bringing back an old thread, I've just seen this on a SA from 12/69 (last month of SA).  It says ""Restoration includes: small amount of color touch on cover" and has the blue Universal label.

Is this a new policy of CGC or have they been allowing small amounts of restoration on SA comics for their blue labels? 

[Mystafo]

I think if it says "restoration includes:" it is most likely a wrong color label error during encapsulation....this is not unheard of either.

[BlowUpTheMoon]

5 hours ago, freefall2all said:

On 3/23/2018 at 12:57 PM, comicquant said:

This is not an uncommon notation on universal labels for GA books with very little color touch and/or glue.  You won't see this on any SA or newer.

Sorry for bringing back an old thread, I've just seen this on a SA from 12/69 (last month of SA).  It says ""Restoration includes: small amount of color touch on cover" and has the blue Universal label.

Is this a new policy of CGC or have they been allowing small amounts of restoration on SA comics for their blue labels? 

That might be a mislabel.  There's a cutoff off for color touch being allowed in a blue label.  I forget what it is.  1945? 

[freefall2all]

1 hour ago, BlowUpTheMoon said:

That might be a mislabel.  There's a cutoff off for color touch being allowed in a blue label.  I forget what it is.  1945? 

 

Here are 3 SA examples.  It's with the Custom Label from CGC, but still has blue label with Universal Grade.  Notes on Certification Information mentions that ASM 79 is C-1, but that doesn't show up anywhere on a label.

[freefall2all]

Here's an example of blue label Universal Grade SA for a comic missing 1/2 a page.  Incomplete is only listed in small print on the blue label.

[freefall2all]

So I'm assuming that these were all mislabels.  Comics were likely submitted at the same time and handled by the same person.

[The Lions Den]

Unless it's changed, when books are received at CGC, they're nearly always entered into the system as Universal. The receiving team doesn't grade the books, so they generally have no idea if the books are Universal or not. But since most books sent to CGC are Universal, that's generally the standard designation, unless the paperwork suggests otherwise (Sig Series, for example). 

Once the books hit the grading room, they're looked at by the pre-grader. However, if the pre-grader doesn't select the appropriate designation, the books will eventually be looked at by a restoration expert and finalizer. With the books shown above, the information would suggest that the first three books should have been changed to "Restored." The fourth book should have been changed to "Qualified" because of the missing half page, and indeed the tipoff is the writing in capital letters, as it should be for a Qualified book. Unfortunately, the books apparently made it through the grading room without the field being changed, which meant they went to encapsulation as Universal books.

At that point, the odds are pretty slim that someone in slab will notice the error, so the labels are printed as Universal labels instead of Restored and Qualified labels. Maybe this error was compounded by those special Marvel labels---they could be a factor here as well... 

After that, the next step in the process is Quality Control. I'll put it this way: QC is generally the last line of defense. If they don't catch it, the books will soon be sent to the shipping team, and out the door they go...

So this is how you wind up with books like the ones pictured. If you called CGC about it, they would likely fix it for free, but who wants a purple or green label over a blue one? 

Looking at the label numbers, it appears 3 of the 4 books have the same invoice number, which makes sense. However, the Spidey #79 (with the C-1 resto) isn't from the same invoice, which suggests to me that it may have been sent to CCS first. Whatever happened, it actually benefits the customer...after all, a blue label is always better, right? 

 

Edited August 2, 2019 by The Lions Den

[oldrover]

Wish they’d make a few of those mistakes on MY books. 

[jimhouston1]

I have some Golden Age Batman graded Universal with "small amount of color touch" and some graded Restored with "small amount of color touch". If a Golden Age Batman is Restored with the notation that there is a "small amount of color touch" - what can be done to get it into a Universal holder. I do not want holes put in the comic to remove the color touch. If the comic was cleaned and pressed would that be enough to get a Universal grade with the notation that there is a "small amount of color touch".

[Krismusic]

On 8/2/2019 at 12:25 AM, The Lions Den said:

Unless it's changed, when books are received at CGC, they're nearly always entered into the system as Universal. The receiving team doesn't grade the books, so they generally have no idea if the books are Universal or not. But since most books sent to CGC are Universal, that's generally the standard designation, unless the paperwork suggests otherwise (Sig Series, for example). 

Once the books hit the grading room, they're looked at by the pre-grader. However, if the pre-grader doesn't select the appropriate designation, the books will eventually be looked at by a restoration expert and finalizer. With the books shown above, the information would suggest that the first three books should have been changed to "Restored." The fourth book should have been changed to "Qualified" because of the missing half page, and indeed the tipoff is the writing in capital letters, as it should be for a Qualified book. Unfortunately, the books apparently made it through the grading room without the field being changed, which meant they went to encapsulation as Universal books.

At that point, the odds are pretty slim that someone in slab will notice the error, so the labels are printed as Universal labels instead of Restored and Qualified labels. Maybe this error was compounded by those special Marvel labels---they could be a factor here as well... 

After that, the next step in the process is Quality Control. I'll put it this way: QC is generally the last line of defense. If they don't catch it, the books will soon be sent to the shipping team, and out the door they go...

So this is how you wind up with books like the ones pictured. If you called CGC about it, they would likely fix it for free, but who wants a purple or green label over a blue one? 

Looking at the label numbers, it appears 3 of the 4 books have the same invoice number, which makes sense. However, the Spidey #79 (with the C-1 resto) isn't from the same invoice, which suggests to me that it may have been sent to CCS first. Whatever happened, it actually benefits the customer...after all, a blue label is always better, right? 

 

I had the theory that maybe the new marvel labels not having purple or green variation would be causing this problem, but wouldn't CGC then not honour the "Marvel label" and put it in a purple or green label and refund that 5$ extra for the label? Or would they let it go with the new label and just note it  on the "Marvel Label" like the examples above? as I think I saw someone else post about this before.

[The Lions Den]

6 hours ago, jimhouston1 said:

I have some Golden Age Batman graded Universal with "small amount of color touch" and some graded Restored with "small amount of color touch". If a Golden Age Batman is Restored with the notation that there is a "small amount of color touch" - what can be done to get it into a Universal holder. I do not want holes put in the comic to remove the color touch. If the comic was cleaned and pressed would that be enough to get a Universal grade with the notation that there is a "small amount of color touch".

This is a case where you may need to call CGC and/or CCS to get an adequate answer...

[The Lions Den]

6 hours ago, Krishosein said:

I had the theory that maybe the new marvel labels not having purple or green variation would be causing this problem, but wouldn't CGC then not honour the "Marvel label" and put it in a purple or green label and refund that 5$ extra for the label? Or would they let it go with the new label and just note it  on the "Marvel Label" like the examples above? as I think I saw someone else post about this before.

It's interesting to me that all these examples are the special labels. I would guess there was either an oversight in the grading room or the encapsulation room (or both). It's also interesting to note that all of the completed auctions I've been able to find for the special Spider-Man labels were also blue label books. 

My question would be if anyone has an example of a special Marvel label book which received a "Restored" or "Qualified" grade..? 

Edited August 8, 2019 by The Lions Den