Need advice on a sale that is going sideways 7 7

[ttfitz]

34 minutes ago, RockMyAmadeus said:

The eBay comics board started 19 years and 3 months ago. That wasn't the first online comics message board, but it was one of the first that was exclusive to comics (as opposed to those sub sections in .rec.arts) and one of the first in that format (scrolling message format.)

 

As long as you ignore places like GEnie, or Compuserve, or AOL.

[Sardo Numspar]

8 hours ago, skypinkblu said:

So he constantly lied to his wife? ...and you were complicit in this? Sounds like a great guy.

You were traumatized by a comic deal?  You seem to have told Jeff that your friend didn't have the funds?

Perhaps you should take a break, get some sleep, READ the thread and then post. 

Maybe you'll wake up and read what you have written and want to rethink a few things in the morning.

I barely post anymore, but have to say that I love Sharon. This is so spot on.

[Mr.Mcknowitall]

8 hours ago, Jaymole said:

^{Sorry, but I have not heard of him, and I really don't know most members here as I have not posted much in 2 years.}

^{And again, Jeff refused to give me his details in the beginning unless I paid him $45 more and that is when my fears took hold of me. When he finally gave me his name and address for shipping, I still did not know who he was. If it wasn't for another boardie who I do know, Crassus, I would have sent the books back to Jeff, although I admit I still was very nervous until I got the refund.}

Please increase the size of the letters. I am 69 and eyesight is a bit challenged.

Thank You.

PS: My brains still works, as does my sense of fair play.

So far, you are losing in both that areas. Hopefully, when you are my age, you will experience vast improvements in those areas.

[Jordysnordy]

9 hours ago, Jaymole said:

I can't sleep so I will answer your post because I have no idea why you are feeling this way.

All I heard from Jeff in the beginning is that he wanted to send the books to his friend. He did not mention your name or address because he said I had to send him $45 by paypal before he gave it to me. He had my $675 and now wanted $45 more when I told him he can just take the $45 off of the refund. Sorry, that sounded very fishy and was not the right thing to do or say...he sounded like someone from Goodfellas LOL. After that message, I was just trying to avoid not being able to file a paypal claim because i really thought I was dealing with someone who seemed very suspicious. Please ask Jeff to share that message he sent me and my reaction, you will see that it really freaked me out. 

Anyway, thanks to another boardie who I dealt with and is on the up and up, I agreed to send them to his friend and he agreed to take the $45 off of my refund. I only found out your name at the end when he gave me your info and I sent the package. But until then I had no clue who you were and I still don't know who you are as I never dealt with you and I have not been on the boards for months and months.

It doesn't look like there will be any agreement on this unless I send Jeff the $200 or so for the loss he incurred, and I don't feel that that loss was necessary, so going back and forth like this seems to be fruitless.

@Jaymole - I hope by now you have re-read our conversation as I will point out a few things you got wrong.

You DID ask for another $100.00 off - not 10%. The Overstreet value all of the books was $1364.00.  and we agreed on $675.00 shipped  - which was a very good price for your friend - and I even tossed in some free books that were not his desired grade range because I was trying to help another Spidey lover out. Shame on me for being extra nice

You said that I don't take returns - an untrue statement. My sales threads have return policies and I have never had an issue with a return - EVER - I have never even had one book returned to me because - if you check my Kudos thread - which I told you to do when you became suspicious of me - you would have seen that I am a pretty good grader and very fair. But I guess you didn't check my long Kudos thread. You needed to email Robert to have him vouch for me . I even suggested that we use Robert as a middle man - meaning I would send him your refund and you send Randall the books and once Randall had the books, Robert would send you the refund. We NEVER discussed a refund policy and numerous times in this epic thread I did state that some of the blame lies on ME for not having discussed this with you - you never brought it up either and I was replying to YOUR want ad. I supplied numerous scans and you did say that your were happy with the scans. (I'm not sure if your friend ever did see them). Plus he didn't want high grade raw books - these were mostly books in the 6.0 to 8.0 range so the prices were not really expensive so I truly didn't think there would be an issue with him not agreeing with the grading. You never even opened the box - it was a case of cold feet.

I DID say that I wanted my $45.00 shipping cost returned to me to before I gave you @ChiSoxFan  information BUT I ONLY said this AFTER you said you would refuse the box and your friend said to file a Paypal claim. Once I heard that nugget, I felt that I would get the box back BUT I would have to refund you the FULL $675.00 and I would be out the $45.00 shipping cost to you. Maybe I'm wrong but since you and your friend backed out of the deal, I felt it was only fair that the both of you be on the hook for my shipping costs to YOU. In my mind it seems very reasonable to me.

I also told you numerous times in our PMs that I was OK losing money on this deal as my board reputation means a lot more to me than the $675.00 but you kept saying in our PMs and in your replies in this thread that you didn't understand why I would lose money on this. And I told it is the principal. Once you asked for another $100.00 off, that was the last straw and I had no problem losing money on this as I wanted to do the right thing. It really irked me that you would keep the books and try and sell them if I took that additional $100.00 off. Randall was kind enough to step and in help out. He didn't ask for 1 penny but I gave him 25% of the proceeds, Brittany gets 50% and me 25% - plus I paid Randall back his shipping costs to @surfcitycomics, who bought all of the books and was happy with the grades.

We did have mix up about some of the shipping costs- and @crassus told me that our messages were a bit confusing at times - Robert read our messages as I wanted an impartial opinion on things. You paid me $675.00 and I netted $649.72. When it came time to refund you I asked how much you wanted back and you said $663.25 and that's what I refunded you. You did pay for shipping to Randall but your friend has paid you for half of that shipping costs so I was not made whole on my original shipping costs to you as I wanted but I wanted to just be done with this so I refunded you the EXACT amount you requested to end this mess.

I truly hope that things are going better for you now as some of this mess was not your fault BUT as the go between in this deal I do feel that you should have stepped up to the plate and taken more responsibility in all of this.

 

 

[newshane]

18 minutes ago, Jordysnordy said:

Once you asked for another $100.00 off, that was the last straw ....it really irked me that you would keep the books and try and sell them if I took that additional $100.00 off.

Threatening to refuse delivery of the books while notifying PayPal was pretty disgusting, but trying to pull this scam was the cherry on top of the turd.

...on top of that, the seller is out for a portion of the shipping costs, not to mention the freebies.

I know that life is tough and we all have personal struggles, but that doesn't excuse business conducted on this level of shadiness.

 

[Columbia Comics]

Wow...this thread is...just wow!

I’ve dealt with Jeff for a few years and would gladly vouch for him at any time. Hell of he was in a bind, I’d send him some money, no questions asked. 

Now if @Jaymole was in a bind, after all we’ve seen, he wouldn’t get one Canadian cent from me (and I suspect zero from almost everyone else here). 

The constant excuses, blaming others, the “whoa is me” financial excuses...are just lame and pathetic.  The implications that a potential scam was taking place: well that’s just disgusting.  

Asking for a further discount after the fact so you don’t lose money, well that just sickens me even more! 

Why should Jeff lose money?  Your cheap arse should have taken the books, sold them for what you could have gotten and taken the loss. NOT JEFF!!! 

It’s sad that you want to hide behind excuse after excuse.

This may seem harsh but Jeff is a friend and shouldn’t have had to deal with any of this.  

Probably best for me to stop posting now.  Also probably best for @Jaymole to disappear for another two (or 20) years.  Your rep is shot and although we have had dealings in the past, I’d never send you one cent again.  

Edited June 13, 2018 by Columbia Comics
Typo

[Number 6]

11 hours ago, Jaymole said:

Actually, I thought that in the beginning, but a couple of days later found out I could not do that as there would not be a tracking number so I would have paid for the shipping back to him as I needed paypal to see that the package was sent back. Again, I wanted to send the books back to him because he had my money and I told him that I was very wary as if I sent them to someone else, I would have no paypal claim if I did not get my partial refund.

Do you realize that refusing a package and filing a PayPal claim is how most people would deal with a seller who’s being less than stand-up? And even then, usually that would be a last resort.

But you lead with that. 

Can you see how that might have given Jordysnordy pause?

This transaction started going sidewise a bit sooner than your estimate. 

[Jaymole]

19 minutes ago, Jordysnordy said:

@Jaymole - I hope by now you have re-read our conversation as I will point out a few things you got wrong.

You DID ask for another $100.00 off - not 10%. The Overstreet value all of the books was $1364.00.  and we agreed on $675.00 shipped  - which was a very good price for your friend - and I even tossed in some free books that were not his desired grade range because I was trying to help another Spidey lover out. Shame on me for being extra nice

You said that I don't take returns - an untrue statement. My sales threads have return policies and I have never had an issue with a return - EVER - I have never even had one book returned to me because - if you check my Kudos thread - which I told you to do when you became suspicious of me - you would have seen that I am a pretty good grader and very fair. But I guess you didn't check my long Kudos thread. You needed to email Robert to have him vouch for me . I even suggested that we use Robert as a middle man - meaning I would send him your refund and you send Randall the books and once Randall had the books, Robert would send you the refund. We NEVER discussed a refund policy and numerous times in this epic thread I did state that some of the blame lies on ME for not having discussed this with you - you never brought it up either and I was replying to YOUR want ad. I supplied numerous scans and you did say that your were happy with the scans. (I'm not sure if your friend ever did see them). Plus he didn't want high grade raw books - these were mostly books in the 6.0 to 8.0 range so the prices were not really expensive so I truly didn't think there would be an issue with him not agreeing with the grading. You never even opened the box - it was a case of cold feet.

I DID say that I wanted my $45.00 shipping cost returned to me to before I gave you @ChiSoxFan  information BUT I ONLY said this AFTER you said you would refuse the box and your friend said to file a Paypal claim. Once I heard that nugget, I felt that I would get the box back BUT I would have to refund you the FULL $675.00 and I would be out the $45.00 shipping cost to you. Maybe I'm wrong but since you and your friend backed out of the deal, I felt it was only fair that the both of you be on the hook for my shipping costs to YOU. In my mind it seems very reasonable to me.

I also told you numerous times in our PMs that I was OK losing money on this deal as my board reputation means a lot more to me than the $675.00 but you kept saying in our PMs and in your replies in this thread that you didn't understand why I would lose money on this. And I told it is the principal. Once you asked for another $100.00 off, that was the last straw and I had no problem losing money on this as I wanted to do the right thing. It really irked me that you would keep the books and try and sell them if I took that additional $100.00 off. Randall was kind enough to step and in help out. He didn't ask for 1 penny but I gave him 25% of the proceeds, Brittany gets 50% and me 25% - plus I paid Randall back his shipping costs to @surfcitycomics, who bought all of the books and was happy with the grades.

We did have mix up about some of the shipping costs- and @crassus told me that our messages were a bit confusing at times - Robert read our messages as I wanted an impartial opinion on things. You paid me $675.00 and I netted $649.72. When it came time to refund you I asked how much you wanted back and you said $663.25 and that's what I refunded you. You did pay for shipping to Randall but your friend has paid you for half of that shipping costs so I was not made whole on my original shipping costs to you as I wanted but I wanted to just be done with this so I refunded you the EXACT amount you requested to end this mess.

I truly hope that things are going better for you now as some of this mess was not your fault BUT as the go between in this deal I do feel that you should have stepped up to the plate and taken more responsibility in all of this.

 

 

Hi Jeff

Thank you for responding

First of all I apologize for this whole incident. It came at a very bad time for me, and particularly that month which I will go into more detail with you if you ant in a PM or text, because I am sure people here will not care about what was and still is happening in my life.

Second, I said my friend wanted nice looking books, so I said they needed to be 7.0 or higher. You gave me a list of books and made a package where I would take all the books, even the ones below 7.0. which was a fair deal. I had no idea you threw in extra books because I never opened the package. We also never discussed return policy because I never thought there would be a problem. You showed me a few scans and I said it is fine, from those scans I saw they were graded fairly. I have and never thought that I would need to return the books due to condition. But I also never expected that Pat would not be able to pay me. I never had a problem in the past with him paying, but I also did not know his relationship with his wife was such a pain, and I understand now why he always bought my books in small lots.

Third, I only mentioned the discount because you said you were going to lose hundreds of $ sending them to your friend  who would sell them at a convention. I only mentioned the discount after this fact, not before and you know that! I told you I would sell them on the boards, this way you can see that I was being truthful and not making any money on them. The fact is, I really had no time at all to start selling books due to the events you know about, but I really did feel bad at first that you were now going to lose money. I told you I had to have my money by the end of the month (I had 2 rents to pay that month) which is why this whole thing was a mess for me. When you refused my offer and told me you would rather lose hundreds of $ and then when you would not give me the address until I paypal you $45, that is when my guilt stated eroding away and I thought this does not sound right. "Why does he want to lose hundreds of $", "why won't he let me send them back to him", why is asking for more money when he already has my $675 and could take the $45 off of that"...those were the thoughts running through my head.

As I mentioned, I think we both had a distrust of each other. The only reason I started mentioning the paypal claim is because Pat brought it up as I told him I was stuck with the books now that he cant pay me as you would not accept the return and I am in a bad jam because I would not be able to pay all my bills. I am guessing you were afraid I would make a false claim, and I was afraid that I would not get any of my money back, especially after you said that you want the books shipped somewhere else and wanted more money. I understand now that "pay me $45 or you dont get the address" was because you thought I would make a false claim, but at that time, I thought it came off very scary, and I was freaking out that I would send the books back and have no claim if I did not get my money back.

As I said all along, and still feel, the best thing would have been for me to return the books to you. I would have felt safer that there was a record that I returned them, and it would not have cost you a cent. I know you were angry and upset that I wanted to return the books, and I understand that. But I never expected that it would turn out that this way.

Anyway, I am too late to this thread to change anyone's mind. You know my circumstances, you have our texts, and you know that at no time was I trying to do anything shady. You know I was freaked out because I needed my money and I did not want toi send them to someone else, which is why you asked Robert to step in. It was only because of Robert that I agreed to send them to another address, but honestly, until I got the refund, I was sweating bullets.

 

 

[The Lions Den]

As I read through this thread last night, I have to admit it was a compelling story. In fact, one could make an argument that it's almost a classic example of a deal gone wrong. I do think there are some things that can be learned from this deal, however. Here they are, listed in no particular order of importance: 

1)  In most cases, your wife will not be interested in spending any money on comics. In my experience, wives tend to be more practical. They would much rather you spent the money on them instead of those worthless old funny books. Most married guys already know this...it's one of the reasons they're still married.

2) The less people involved in a transaction, the better. More people involved = more complications. This whole deal would likely have gone much smoother if it had involved just a buyer and a seller.

3) State the terms of the transaction clearly. Both parties should agree on all aspects of the transaction before committing to it. If there is any doubt about any detail of the transaction, make sure you address it before the deal goes down. Each party should know what to expect, especially things like your return policy, return shipping costs, etc. Plan for the worst and hope for the best.

4) It's an honor to be part of this community. As with any community, there are certain rules you should abide by. If you decide to circumvent these rules, there will be consequences. In my house, we have a saying:  Actions = Consequences. This case is a prime example of that principle. 

5) If you screw up, admit it. Believe me, people will find out, no matter how hard you try to cover it up. One of my favorite sayings is this: "It's my fault!" So simple to say, yet some folks will never say it. Big mistake. It's tough to regain trust once you lose it. 

6) Now for the big question:  Who would I deal with after reading this thread? I'll say this, JordySnordy, you impress me as an honest guy. I'd have no problem doing a transaction with you in the future. I appreciate your integrity and willingness to help other people, and your efforts to salvage something positive from this transaction. In my experience, when a deal goes wrong the true character of the people involved comes into play. When the pressure is on, how do they handle it? Do they put forth extra effort to make it work, or do they play the blame game and begin making excuses? I think it's pretty clear what happened here, Jaymole. As far as I'm concerned, you should just get out of Dodge before sundown...

[Jaymole]

One further thing Jeff....I will post our conversation here if you continue to make it look like I was asking for a discount for some nefarious purpose. You know very well, that I told you about that after you said you were now going to lose hundreds of $ because you were sending them to a friend who will sell them at a con. Because of that, I told you if you can give me the discount so the books are under 50% guide, I will sell them on the boards and this way you would not have to lose that much and I would have a better chance of selling them and getting my money back.

Again, I will post our texts here if you continue to make it look like I was trying to get a better deal for another reason

 

[skypinkblu]

If I've learned one thing in this thread it is that I need to rewrite my return policy.  I've always said I'd take returns for any reason. I'm going to have to try to remember to add ...except for friends changing their minds, or wives or HUSBANDs

Maybe that will help people to remember, that when you make a deal, it's YOUR responsibility, period,

not your friend's or relative's. 

That's what you don't seem to get Jaymole...you sound like a nice guy, but you are missing the point.

 

[Jaymole]

I am posting here what you told me in the exact words because I do not think it is fair that people are thinking I was trying

"I want the $45.00 sent to me 1st so I'm whole on this. I also want you to send the box to another boardie in the US who is going to take them. Once he has the books I will send you the refund"

"One of you sends me $45 (meaning pat or me) friends or family and then one of you pays for the postage to the other boardie which will be a lot cheaper because he is in the US. Once he has the books safe and sound I will refund your payment to me."

After this you told me your friend will sell them at the con and that you are going to lose hundreds of $, That is when I brought up selling them on the boards and the discount. I NEVER MENTIONED A DISCOUNT BEFORE THIS. I had no idea how I was going to sell them due to my circumstances but I felt this way you would not lose so much money and I could get back most of my money by months end. I really did feel bad.

Again, I see that our distrust of each other led us down a bad path. I do feel really bad about the whole incident and I know that I was responsible at the end for wanting a return due to my friends inability to pay. I never expected this to happen and like I have said I never had a bad experience like this before with anyone on the boards.

 

 

 

 

[Columbia Comics]

@Jaymole

here is the best advice you will receive all day (and it’s free so no returns)

STOP POSTING 

You cannot talk your way out of this. 

[Jordysnordy]

8 minutes ago, Jaymole said:

I am posting here what you told me in the exact words because I do not think it is fair that people are thinking I was trying

"I want the $45.00 sent to me 1st so I'm whole on this. I also want you to send the box to another boardie in the US who is going to take them. Once he has the books I will send you the refund"

"One of you sends me $45 (meaning pat or me) friends or family and then one of you pays for the postage to the other boardie which will be a lot cheaper because he is in the US. Once he has the books safe and sound I will refund your payment to me."

After this you told me your friend will sell them at the con and that you are going to lose hundreds of $, That is when I brought up selling them on the boards and the discount. I NEVER MENTIONED A DISCOUNT BEFORE THIS. I had no idea how I was going to sell them due to my circumstances but I felt this way you would not lose so much money and I could get back most of my money by months end. I really did feel bad.

Again, I see that our distrust of each other led us down a bad path. I do feel really bad about the whole incident and I know that I was responsible at the end for wanting a return due to my friends inability to pay. I never expected this to happen and like I have said I never had a bad experience like this before with anyone on the boards.

 

 

 

 

This is all true - but I wrote this after you said you would refuse the box and Pat suggest you file a PP claim so you can hopefully see WHY I asked for it this way.

For the sake of my sanity and @Jaymole's , he has graciously offered to pay me my original shipping  costs and I have asked him to send that amount to Brittany's go fund me page. We have hugged it out

[Jaymole]

I will say that Jeff has reached out to my messages and I think we have agreed to forget this whole thing with no hard feelings. I apologized for this mess in my message and asked if I can talk to him on the phone  and apologize there as well. I said in my message from a few days ago that I will be willing to send him the money that we had the misunderstanding over in regards to shipping to Randall. He was nice enough to say it is ok, but I should send donate it to Brittany which I will do.

I apologize to everyone for being so late to respond to this thread. It has only been over the last week or so that I could frequent this forum normally and I had no idea that a thread was created over this.

[Jaymole]

FYI: The original $45 shipping cost I had Jeff take out of my refund, it was the shipping to Randall that I had taken out of the difference That I will donate to Brittany

[mattn792]

12 hours ago, Red84 said:

Just reiterating for @Jaymole

[Jaymole]

4 minutes ago, Jordysnordy said:

This is all true - but I wrote this after you said you would refuse the box and Pat suggest you file a PP claim so you can hopefully see WHY I asked for it this way.

For the sake of my sanity and @Jaymole's , he has graciously offered to pay me my original shipping  costs and I have asked him to send that amount to Brittany's go fund me page. We have hugged it out

Thank You Jeff. I look forward to talking to you on the phone.

[Spyder!]

Not that anyone cares, but here are Spyder!'s 2 cents.

Most of the drama here occurred after one thing that I just cannot possibly understand: Jaymole did not take responsibility for a deal that he made, plain and simple.  I think we have all made purchases we regretted.  I know I have.  Maybe I pulled the trigger before realizing I was over-paying, maybe I made some drunken eBay purchases (guilty!), maybe my wife found out and got pissed, whatever.  Never have I thought to stick it to the seller because I had a change of heart, or felt stupid (or sobered up!).  I made an agreement to buy books at a certain price.  Unless I don't get what I purchased in the condition it was described to be in, I will not return it.  I will sell it for a loss if I have to, and I have done this more than once.  A sale is a form of contract between the parties involved.  OWN THE DEAL YOU MADE!  Other people shouldn't have to deal with your personal junk.

Rant over.  Spyder! out.

Edited June 13, 2018 by Spyder!
word omitted, oops

[Columbia Comics]

19 minutes ago, Jaymole said:

I will say that Jeff has reached out to my messages and I think we have agreed to forget this whole thing...

Yeah good luck with that.  Loooong memories here...