CGC v. Company X
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3 hours ago, MrBedrock said:

As long as you don't Cede to Be Conversing uSing the other company's name the thread should be around.

People Go and get there books removed from company X is all I am reading.(thumbsu

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1 hour ago, Mmehdy said:

harder grading does not equate to the actual grade, one could interpret this as the "other company" is not a jammed up and took more time to look at the books.....and is more accurate. They are both close, however a blanket policy of "under grading" just to be tough on a competitior makes us the loser.....if we use CGC, it will be interesting to see how this plays out, since the competitor is a former CGC employee with a great and respected reputation.

My go-to guide for grading is the original Overstreet grading guide that came out in the 90s. I don't think either of the companies is as strict overall, so I don't think anybody is undergrading books.

My biggest pet peeve is that books with cream-to-off-white pages sometimes get labeled 9.6 or 9.8. That always leaves me shaking my head.

Edited by jimbo_7071

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7 hours ago, jimbo_7071 said:

My go-to guide for grading is the original Overstreet grading guide that came out in the 90s. I don't think either of the companies is as strict overall, so I don't think anybody is undergrading books.

My biggest pet peeve is that books with cream-to-off-white pages sometimes get labeled 9.6 or 9.8. That always leaves me shaking my head.

Page quality has in my opinion is very important and would disqualify my purchase if not up to acceptable levels..I agree

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15 hours ago, Mmehdy said:
23 hours ago, jimbo_7071 said:

My go-to guide for grading is the original Overstreet grading guide that came out in the 90s. I don't think either of the companies is as strict overall, so I don't think anybody is undergrading books.

My biggest pet peeve is that books with cream-to-off-white pages sometimes get labeled 9.6 or 9.8. That always leaves me shaking my head.

Page quality has in my opinion is very important and would disqualify my purchase if not up to acceptable levels..I agree

The only problem with this is that based upon scans of resubs that have been posted here, the determination of PQ is far more inconsistent than the actual grading itself.  hm

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1 hour ago, lou_fine said:

The only problem with this is that based upon scans of resubs that have been posted here, the determination of PQ is far more inconsistent than the actual grading itself.  hm

and that is another main issue with any grading service, what if the white paged book CGC'ed 10 years ago or more, there could be some type of paper change which might slightly occur. I think that the  "mile high books" price factor has always had page quality into the high demand, Overstreet really did not address in terms of price which amount of value is added for white pages or pages which are damaged by time. Would it be safe to day it adds 20% to value with white pages, the most recent think that comes to mind was the "white pages" action 1 which was sold on Ebay, they looked at the pages in dark room if I recall on a video..never underestimate the power of "white pages". It appears that white pages has little factor on condition of the cover of the book which is the main grading focus.

Edited by Mmehdy

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2 hours ago, Mmehdy said:

and that is another main issue with any grading service, what if the white paged book CGC'ed 10 years ago or more, there could be some type of paper change which might slightly occur. I think that the  "mile high books" price factor has always had page quality into the high demand, Overstreet really did not address in terms of price which amount of value is added for white pages or pages which are damaged by time. Would it be safe to day it adds 20% to value with white pages, the most recent think that comes to mind was the "white pages" action 1 which was sold on Ebay, they looked at the pages in dark room if I recall on a video..never underestimate the power of "white pages". It appears that white pages has little factor on condition of the cover of the book which is the main grading focus.

https://www.cgccomics.com/1134755001/#features/

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On ‎5‎/‎6‎/‎2018 at 12:47 PM, Mmehdy said:
On ‎5‎/‎6‎/‎2018 at 10:59 AM, lou_fine said:

The only problem with this is that based upon scans of resubs that have been posted here, the determination of PQ is far more inconsistent than the actual grading itself.  hm

and that is another main issue with any grading service, what if the white paged book CGC'ed 10 years ago or more, there could be some type of paper change which might slightly occur. I think that the  "mile high books" price factor has always had page quality into the high demand, Overstreet really did not address in terms of price which amount of value is added for white pages or pages which are damaged by time. Would it be safe to day it adds 20% to value with white pages, the most recent think that comes to mind was the "white pages" action 1 which was sold on Ebay, they looked at the pages in dark room if I recall on a video..never underestimate the power of "white pages". It appears that white pages has little factor on condition of the cover of the book which is the main grading focus.

I just got a wad of CGC books in that all appear to have suffered from ill storage based on the covers. Haven't cracked them out to see if they are "Savannah"-like..., in that the covers are spoiled cheese, but the interiors have white pages. (this is a ped I now avoid like the plague....,)  But honestly, these books all have a uniform dingy appearance to them in the slab.  I sincerely hope I'm wrong on my initial assessment.

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1 hour ago, lizards2 said:

I just got a wad of CGC books in that all appear to have suffered from ill storage based on the covers. Haven't cracked them out to see if they are "Savannah"-like..., in that the covers are spoiled cheese, but the interiors have white pages. (this is a ped I now avoid like the plague....,)  But honestly, these books all have a uniform dingy appearance to them in the slab.  I sincerely hope I'm wrong on my initial assessment.

So, you're saying that you think these books would receive lower grades if resubmitted?  Might be interesting to send a couple of them back in to test that theory.  I can't recall anyone saying they had this happen, other than the poor soul whose high-grade copy of IH 181 had a staple explode from rust after he stored it in a safe.

Seems likely, though, given how much time has passed since CGC started, that at least some significant deterioration would have happened to some slabs that were stored, say, in very hot attics or damp basements. 

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11 minutes ago, Sqeggs said:
2 hours ago, lizards2 said:

I just got a wad of CGC books in that all appear to have suffered from ill storage based on the covers. Haven't cracked them out to see if they are "Savannah"-like..., in that the covers are spoiled cheese, but the interiors have white pages. (this is a ped I now avoid like the plague....,)  But honestly, these books all have a uniform dingy appearance to them in the slab.  I sincerely hope I'm wrong on my initial assessment.

So, you're saying that you think these books would receive lower grades if resubmitted?  Might be interesting to send a couple of them back in to test that theory.  I can't recall anyone saying they had this happen, other than the poor soul whose high-grade copy of IH 181 had a staple explode from rust after he stored it in a safe.

Seems likely, though, given how much time has passed since CGC started, that at least some significant deterioration would have happened to some slabs that were stored, say, in very hot attics or damp basements. 

I doubt they'd receive different grades.  CGC doesn't grade on "intangible" stuff like this, that I've ever noticed - note the comparison to Savannah pedigree books.  And those books tend to be much, much worse than this bunch of books. 

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2 minutes ago, lizards2 said:

I doubt they'd receive different grades.  CGC doesn't grade on "intangible" stuff like this, that I've ever noticed - note the comparison to Savannah pedigree books.  And those books tend to be much, much worse than this bunch of books. 

Ah, ok.  I thought you were saying that you thought that the books had deteriorated in the slabs in the time since they were graded.

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Just now, Sqeggs said:
3 minutes ago, lizards2 said:

I doubt they'd receive different grades.  CGC doesn't grade on "intangible" stuff like this, that I've ever noticed - note the comparison to Savannah pedigree books.  And those books tend to be much, much worse than this bunch of books. 

Ah, ok.  I thought you were saying that you thought that the books had deteriorated in the slabs in the time since they were graded.

Absolutely I believe they have deteriorated.  But not in anything that CGC would knock the grade down on.  Note the original discussion was about PQ...., I thought.

I have the luxury of having always lived in an area of ideal paper preservation, so I have newsstand books from 40-50 years ago that are pristine white inside and out.  I think that should garner a premium, but that is not necessarily the case.

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2 hours ago, lizards2 said:

I just got a wad of CGC books in that all appear to have suffered from ill storage based on the covers. Haven't cracked them out to see if they are "Savannah"-like..., in that the covers are spoiled cheese, but the interiors have white pages. (this is a ped I now avoid like the plague....,)  But honestly, these books all have a uniform dingy appearance to them in the slab.  I sincerely hope I'm wrong on my initial assessment.

Would you mind expanding on the the Savannah comment?  I own a hundred or so, not slabbed but certified, Savannah copies that are very nice.  What are you seeing on Savannahs that I should be looking out for?

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4 minutes ago, Badger said:

Would you mind expanding on the the Savannah comment?  I own a hundred or so, not slabbed but certified, Savannah copies that are very nice.  What are you seeing on Savannahs that I should be looking out for?

I know I've heard several people comment about tanning on interior covers, and paper quality issues.  I can't recall who it was selling a nice copy of Tec 359 with the Savannah label recently, but I thought the price was fair.  I asked a knowledgeable boardie through PM why it was still available, and the answer was referencing poor PQ typical of the pedigree.

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5 minutes ago, Badger said:
2 hours ago, lizards2 said:

I just got a wad of CGC books in that all appear to have suffered from ill storage based on the covers. Haven't cracked them out to see if they are "Savannah"-like..., in that the covers are spoiled cheese, but the interiors have white pages. (this is a ped I now avoid like the plague....,)  But honestly, these books all have a uniform dingy appearance to them in the slab.  I sincerely hope I'm wrong on my initial assessment.

Would you mind expanding on the the Savannah comment?  I own a hundred or so, not slabbed but certified, Savannah copies that are very nice.  What are you seeing on Savannahs that I should be looking out for?

Oily dark putrid yellow covers.  I think, like any collection, some are worse than others.

A lot of Savannah's say they have white pages on the interior, but I've never gotten past the covers to bother cracking them out.  I think I'm down to one copy, which is a 9.8 for my fish in the face cover collection - I didn't see that it was a Savannah until it came in.

I'm sure many collectors don't even know or care, or can even detect the difference.

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2 minutes ago, entalmighty1 said:

I know I've heard several people comment about tanning on interior covers, and paper quality issues.  I can't recall who it was selling a nice copy of Tec 359 with the Savannah label recently, but I thought the price was fair.  I asked a knowledgeable boardie through PM why it was still available, and the answer was referencing poor PQ typical of the pedigree.

Interior cover tanning makes sense given how they were stored.  I never have understood why CGC does not make note of this defect on the slab.  It is a major flaw and not factored into the PQ or in most grades.  

Thanks for the reply!

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1 minute ago, lizards2 said:

Oily dark putrid yellow covers.  I think, like any collection, some are worse than others.

A lot of Savannah's say they have white pages on the interior, but I've never gotten past the covers to bother cracking them out.  I think I'm down to one copy, which is a 9.8 for my fish in the face cover collection - I didn't see that it was a Savannah until it came in.

I'm sure many collectors don't even know or care, or can even detect the difference.

Interesting.  I would love to see a picture of a Savannah comic with this defect just so I could clearly envision it.  :sick:  Thanks for the reply!

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23 minutes ago, Badger said:

Interior cover tanning makes sense given how they were stored.  I never have understood why CGC does not make note of this defect on the slab.  It is a major flaw and not factored into the PQ or in most grades.  

Thanks for the reply!

I've seen cover tanning mentioned in grader's notes, so I assume that they do deduct for it.  I think it was mentioned on label notes years ago, but these days I think only detached covers, detached cfs, tape, and minor amounts of glue and ct (too minor to merit making the book a PLOD) are typically noted on the label.

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38 minutes ago, Badger said:

Interesting.  I would love to see a picture of a Savannah comic with this defect just so I could clearly envision it.  :sick:  Thanks for the reply!

Just about every one - just look at the back cover.  If there is no back cover scan, there is a reason for it!

You said you personally own 100+ of them - maybe take a look at them? 

Edited by lizards2

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