Starhawk's first appearance? 1 1

[Sensei Ryan]

Can anyone with more knowledge on this topic than I (which is pretty much everyone) explain why CGC does not note Starhawk's first 'full' appearance as Defenders #28 but does denote #27 instead?  Everything I read online states that #27 is his cameo and #28 is the full (and he's on the cover to #28).  I don't have the raw issues nor own either copy of the book in graded form but not sure which would be better to own (the cover to 28 is definitely more appealing, I think).

Thoughts?  Thanks, everyone, in advance!

Edited May 16, 2018 by Sensei Ryan

[ygogolak]

Good question, same as Gamora in Strange Tales 180 / 181. Shes in 5 panels, not named in 180. Named in 181. Only label note is on 180, "First Appearance of Gamora".

This happens with a lot of books honestly. It's what's decided by someone at some point.

[Sensei Ryan]

If I had raw copies of the two I could compare them myself but Defenders #28 is definitely a more appealing cover so if he's in like 1 panel at the end of 27 (IDK if he is or not) then IMO someone made a mistake naming 27 as the 1st app.  Everything i see (other than the CGC labels) claims 27 is a cameo and 28 is the full.

Does anyone own the raws of the two to make a determination?  

[picon3]

I don't have the raw books in hand, but here's a comparison of the two covers.  Not even close in my mind.  Paul~

[divad]

19 hours ago, Sensei Ryan said:

If I had raw copies of the two I could compare them myself but Defenders #28 is definitely a more appealing cover so if he's in like 1 panel at the end of 27 (IDK if he is or not) then IMO someone made a mistake naming 27 as the 1st app.  Everything i see (other than the CGC labels) claims 27 is a cameo and 28 is the full.

Does anyone own the raws of the two to make a determination?  

I once did, but I sold them both as "the first appearance" 

[seanfingh]

I sold one of the 1st 9.8 28s before CGC had denoted anything - and after the rumor surfaced that Starhawk was Star-Lord's dad . . .  

[Sensei Ryan]

Thanks for all the replies, everyone!  Does anyone have any pics of the panel(s)/pages Starhawk appears from in issue #27?  That might help make the case for which deserves to be the 1st appearance!

[Martin Sinescu]

Towards the end of Defenders 27.... it's this guy, right? 

[picon3]

Yes, that is Starhawk in at least two panels in Defenders #27.  Paul~

[Sensei Ryan]

2 hours ago, Martin Sinescu said:

Towards the end of Defenders 27.... it's this guy, right? 

Thank you so much for posting this!  Can you tell me if he appears on any pages past this or only these panels on this page?

I guess that if it is just these two-five panels (depending on how you look at it) it seems enough to warrant a first appearance but if he's on another page I'd say that for sure.

Thanks again for posting them!

[fett]

He appears only  in one panel as the golden figure towards the start of the issue, as in the first 4 panels on the page shown. No other appearances this issue. 

[batmiesta]

I don't understand the long running controversy over this, he is there in two panels, so surely that is his first appearance. 

[Chaykin Stevens]

On 5/17/2018 at 7:30 PM, picon3 said:

I don't have the raw books in hand, but here's a comparison of the two covers.  Not even close in my mind.  Paul~

It may not feature Starhawk, but I much prefer Defenders #27's cover by Gil Kane and John Romita to #28's typically mediocre effort by Rampaging Ron Wilson.

Edited May 26, 2018 by Chaykin Stevens

[Chaykin Stevens]

There was an unpublished strip by Roy Thomas and Dan Adkins dating from the 60s about a character named Starhawk.

http://ripjaggerdojo.blogspot.co.uk/2009/12/coming-of-starhawk.html

[ygogolak]

On 5/18/2018 at 5:29 PM, batmiesta said:

I don't understand the long running controversy over this, he is there in two panels, so surely that is his first appearance. 

How do you know it's him?

[batmiesta]

So! Just because we didn't know his name at that point, he didn't show up?? Even though he is clearly in two panels. 

[ygogolak]

16 hours ago, batmiesta said:

So! Just because we didn't know his name at that point, he didn't show up?? Even though he is clearly in two panels. 

Sure, he's there, I guess. Again, we don't know who it is. Perfect definition of a cameo.