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Sparkle City Action 1 on ebay!!!!
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269 posts in this topic

The thing about this thread that I'm trying to wrap my brain around [and no, it's not who is going to win the upcoming  James Johnson v. sfcityduck lawsuit] is that it appears that this book is going to hammer around 200K ( to 250K ??!!)  according to those in the know here. How is it possible that a Tec #27 8.5 mod(P) just sold for 242K, but this book, which clearly would supposedly grade out as a 0.5 mod(P) Action #1, will sell for the same $$ ? That's my dilemma.

 I get that there is an aggressive bidder who has a coverless copy who wants the cover. This cover will get him what? If his coverless copy is unrestored, how would he approach the cover. The cover is restored with pieces added and colour touch I believe. If one believes this restoration could be reversed, at least the pieces added, does he get a conserved copy? and at what grade with pieces missing from the cover? And then there is the issue of his second copy, now coverless, which has value either as is or selling off individual pieces of the Superman story.  So I'm trying to do the math, but it probably all depends on how much the guy originally paid for his original coverless copy. 

If he paid , say, 50K for the coverless copy, then pays 250K for this one ....  that's 300K. And the work to add a cover to a book, and do a bit of resto removal.....not much expense there. I don't know, does the math work? What am I missing....maybe it does if his (now) complete book gets a conserved designation and he has an incomplete coverless still to sell if he wants...

 

I'm trying to understand this game, and when I think I do......then  all of a sudden I don't

Edited by fishbone
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5 minutes ago, fishbone said:

The thing about this thread that I'm trying to wrap my brain around [and no, it's not who is going to win the upcoming  James Johnson v. sfcityduck lawsuit]

Nobody would win. The judge would take one look at the suit, one look at us and tell me to GTFO and take my duck with me.. :makepoint:

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14 minutes ago, fishbone said:

The thing about this thread that I'm trying to wrap my brain around [and no, it's not who is going to win the upcoming  James Johnson v. sfcityduck lawsuit] is that it appears that this book is going to hammer around 200K ( to

If he paid , say, 50K for the coverless copy, then pays 250K for this one ....  that's 300K. And the work to add a cover to a book, and do a bit of resto removal.....not much expense there. I don't know, does the math work? What am I missing....maybe it does if his (now) complete book gets a conserved designation and he has an incomplete coverless still to sell if he wants...

yes. The math can work if you can craft the description of the finished product creatively enough, and then convince someone that the finished product is worth considerably in excess of $300K, not to mention having extra parts to Frankenbook-farm out to subsidize this acquisition once the dust settles.  If it's as I suspect, and this book finishes for $250K or more, with a paying winner, of course the entire envelope, the whole price spectrum of Action 1 in low to midgrade expands from the orbit of Jupiter to around the Ort cloud, and getting well in excess of $300K for the finished product we're discussing will not be that much of a challenge.

Edited by James J Johnson
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22 minutes ago, James J Johnson said:

yes. The math can work if you can craft the description of the finished product creatively enough, and then convince someone that the finished product is worth considerably in excess of $300K, not to mention having extra parts to Frankenbook-farm out to subsidize this acquisition once the dust settles.  If it's as I suspect, and this book finishes for $250K or more, with a paying winner, of course the entire envelope, the whole price spectrum of Action 1 in low to midgrade expands from the orbit of Jupiter to around the Ort cloud, and getting well in excess of $300K for the finished product we're discussing will not be that much of a challenge.

That's what I'm thinking would have to be the result. Nothing else is logical. But, if that is the case, then another move forward in the conserved/restored world of GA mega keys.......for those of us who care :devil:

 

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6 minutes ago, Knightsofold said:

My guess is this book could go for whatever the lowest price of any available copy with a similarly restored cover and pages is. I have no idea what that price would be.  

The duck and God already know that precise amount. The rest of us will know in 5 days.  My number is $251,200. You heard that here.

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26 minutes ago, fishbone said:

That's what I'm thinking would have to be the result. Nothing else is logical. But, if that is the case, then another move forward in the conserved/restored world of GA mega keys.......for those of us who care :devil:

 

IMO, putting the finished product, whatever the union may be of the married parts for 2 or 3 books cobbled together to form what would technically still a partial one, in a CGC slab will be counter-indicative to wringing out every last penny. You take a cobbled together Action 1 and creatively word the description and like this auction, you'll get better results than the words of what is actually done to the book strewn across the label, which appropriately, should have a picture of Boris Karloff as Frankenstein to appropriately epitomize two, three, or more books in one. You start mentioning "married this, married that" on labels and you can kiss your ample profits a fond farewell..

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This thread reminds me of the age old adage "better to be thought the fool than open your mouth and remove all doubt" (and yet here I go!)  All I can say is that once upon a time Sparkle City only sold slabs at auction with no minimum.   Their sister company neatstuffcollectibles dealt in raw books and collections. At that time they may have been the best seller on ebay.  The fact that this is unslabbed is a head scratcher to me.  Don't think I'd touch this with a six figure pole but to those who are playing caveat emptor and good luck. 

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5 hours ago, bluechip said:

The only acceptable way to list a book like this is as follows:

"This book will not be sold for a price higher than you think it's worth.  If anyone tries to pay more they will be informed the book isn't worth it and their attempts to pay more will be refused.   If you are buying this for resale we will accept only what you think is a price that allows the markup you want.   If the book has any defects or restoration, or anything you think is a defect or restoration that was not described in precisely the same terms you would have used, then we understand that offering a return is not enough; you will also have the option to keep the book and tell us the amount that must be refunded.  You will also be free to return it, if the value ever decreases."

:signfunny: I had to post that cuz I am sure some people will think you were serious.

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For all we know the person who has the coverless bought it years ago for a few thousand dollars. So his total amount into the book will not be much more than the high bid. To either remove the resto or fully restore it may cost another $5k.

So let’s say it goes for $250k. The total the winner may have into it could be around $260k for either a 1.0 qualified or a 6.0-8.0 extensive? Price doesn’t sound too crazy anymore.

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I just assumed (perhaps wrongly) that someone pursuing the book for it’s cover may just want it to own a complete copy. A married copy is probably better than a coverless copy to many.

Otherwise I’m not sure how the math would work out on a resale later until the final bid is in and it was disclosed what the coverless copy cost.

I’m not in love with the condition of the cover but with a Action #1 you can hardly be picky. 

Anyone care to guess what the value of a decent coverless copy married to that cover would fetch?

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4 hours ago, fishbone said:

The thing about this thread that I'm trying to wrap my brain around [and no, it's not who is going to win the upcoming  James Johnson v. sfcityduck lawsuit] is that it appears that this book is going to hammer around 200K ( to 250K ??!!)  according to those in the know here. How is it possible that a Tec #27 8.5 mod(P) just sold for 242K, but this book, which clearly would supposedly grade out as a 0.5 mod(P) Action #1, will sell for the same $$ ? That's my dilemma.

 I get that there is an aggressive bidder who has a coverless copy who wants the cover. This cover will get him what? If his coverless copy is unrestored, how would he approach the cover. The cover is restored with pieces added and colour touch I believe. If one believes this restoration could be reversed, at least the pieces added, does he get a conserved copy? and at what grade with pieces missing from the cover? And then there is the issue of his second copy, now coverless, which has value either as is or selling off individual pieces of the Superman story.  So I'm trying to do the math, but it probably all depends on how much the guy originally paid for his original coverless copy. 

If he paid , say, 50K for the coverless copy, then pays 250K for this one ....  that's 300K. And the work to add a cover to a book, and do a bit of resto removal.....not much expense there. I don't know, does the math work? What am I missing....maybe it does if his (now) complete book gets a conserved designation and he has an incomplete coverless still to sell if he wants...

 

I'm trying to understand this game, and when I think I do......then  all of a sudden I don't

A coverless action 1 sold privately for 80k just last month... so 50k won’t work now, but maybe a few years ago 

my gut was there is entry level demand in the 150-200k range for just about any decent copy

If someone had a complete coverless and bought years ago for , say 25k, then 225k to get a “complete” copy ain’t shabby in today’s market. That’s my math lol

if it sells for way more may simply be indicative of a couple of deep pocketed collectors that just want it. Who the heck knows 

that said, with the restored revision from slight to mod/ext? That certainly will remove my interest and maybe others hm

Edited by G.A.tor
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40 minutes ago, G.A.tor said:

 with the restored revision from slight to mod/ext? That certainly will remove my interest and maybe others hm

So with what little credit the duck gives me for any tangible hobby knowledge at all, my initial statement about there being more work on this book than was being initially disclosed has now proven to be true by the seller himself updating and augmenting the disclosure of restoration procedures? Is that about right? It was a case of partial disclosure, now remedied?

Here was my post on partial disclosure from page 2, verbatim:

So, what this really translates out to is that when the buyer submits this to the CGC, and it bounds back to him or her in a 0.5 purple labeled holder from whence it came, slabbed with the words, "extensive restoration" and "Incomplete" included on the label, plus far more disclosed work than the seller is disclosin mentionedg, relegating the book's resale value to approx. the 25 to 40% range of the winning bid price, "don't look to remedy the deception, because you'll find us unmoved by your grievous error in winning it, and by the way, the short pier is that'a'way, if you'd like a nice place to take that long walk, you're welcome!".

Is that about the gist of it? 

The dollar amount is much too high for this type of non-disclosure to stand up as a mitigating factor with the cc company. Anyone who has a CC with at least 6 figure thresholds has standing with their cc company and the chargeback will be effected pending a return without an insane re-stocking fee, of course, $25,000 to place the book back in a box just plain usurious to demand

Edited by James J Johnson
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1 hour ago, G.A.tor said:

that said, with the restored revision from slight to mod/ext? That certainly will remove my interest and maybe others hm

Gator, I could have saved you the effort of even tracking this for purchase consideration. As you can see above and from my page 2 post, the second I saw this book my impression, which I shared here, was that there was more to it than met the eye or the description with respect to the full extent of the resto. It's self-evident and fairly obvious from images alone that this is an extensively restored book. .

Edited by James J Johnson
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2 hours ago, G.A.tor said:

A coverless action 1 sold privately for 80k just last month... so 50k won’t work now, but maybe a few years ago 

my gut was there is entry level demand in the 150-200k range for just about any decent copy

If someone had a complete coverless and bought years ago for , say 25k, then 225k to get a “complete” copy ain’t shabby in today’s market. That’s my math lol

if it sells for way more may simply be indicative of a couple of deep pocketed collectors that just want it. Who the heck knows 

that said, with the restored revision from slight to mod/ext? That certainly will remove my interest and maybe others hm

It seems odd that a book would be extensively restored and yet still missing a big chunk of the corner.  If it's extensive anyway why not replace the corner?  Because the way the grades are determined and the words are used, none of the grades or words would change.    IMV the words should be different, but there is so much pressure to treat all restored books the same and all poor books the same that you can have a .5 restored Action 1 which is pretty and barely missing anything with color touch in corner and maybe a tiny bit of removal rice paper, or you could have a book that is ugly af brittle and missing chunks of key panels with a horribly faded and stained cover and scribbling all over superman's face.   But you might not get a clue about those differences from reading the grade or the resto designation. 
.

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4 hours ago, AnkurJ said:

For all we know the person who has the coverless bought it years ago for a few thousand dollars. So his total amount into the book will not be much more than the high bid. To either remove the resto or fully restore it may cost another $5k.

So let’s say it goes for $250k. The total the winner may have into it could be around $260k for either a 1.0 qualified or a 6.0-8.0 extensive? Price doesn’t sound too crazy anymore.

 

 

 

 

Edited by zen514
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1 hour ago, bluechip said:

It seems odd that a book would be extensively restored and yet still missing a big chunk of the corner.  If it's extensive anyway why not replace the corner?  Because the way the grades are determined and the words are used, none of the grades or words would change.    IMV the words should be different, but there is so much pressure to treat all restored books the same and all poor books the same that you can have a .5 restored Action 1 which is pretty and barely missing anything with color touch in corner and maybe a tiny bit of removal rice paper, or you could have a book that is ugly af brittle and missing chunks of key panels with a horribly faded and stained cover and scribbling all over superman's face.   But you might not get a clue about those differences from reading the grade or the resto designation. 
.

 

 

 

Edited by zen514
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11 hours ago, G.A.tor said:

 

If someone had a complete coverless and bought years ago for , say 25k, then 225k to get a “complete” copy ain’t shabby in today’s market. That’s my math lol

if it sells for way more may simply be indicative of a couple of deep pocketed collectors that just want it. Who the heck knows 

End of discussion. there Won't be any chargeback games

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Just showing these for anyone who hasn't seen these particular added questions they answered in the summary section.
 
Q: Has this book been CGC or CBCS graded?
A: We did not ever submit this book for grading. We do not believe it was ever graded by a 3rd party grader.
 
Q: Why didn't you CGC/CBCS this comic book?
A: We saw no reason to have this book encapsulated in a plastic case where the buyer can't see the pages or touch the actual book. We believe that a book like this should be appreciated in it's natural state. Given that this is not a brittle book or ultra high grade copy, we feel that the protection offered by encapsulation is not necessary. We wanted to be the first to publicly auction a raw Action Comics #1 in almost a decade!
 
Q: What grade is this comic book?
A: The book presents beautifully as a solid 3.0 - 4.0, but given the fact that it is missing a centerfold it would not receive a grade higher than .5 from 3rd party grading.
 
Q: Is this book restored and to what degree?
A: Yes, this book is restored. Overall restoration would be considered in the 4 - 5 range (Moderate/extensive restoration) by a 3rd party grader. Restoration includes: Color Touch (slight on the cover), Color Touch inside front cover, Piece fill and support to cover, Cover Cleaned and reinforced, Pages cleaned, staples replaced. 
 
Q: Can you share any history on the book?
A: This comic was purchased in 1995 by our client. It was never offered for since then. It has been locked in a climate controlled bank vault for over 23 years. 
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