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Are comics gaining more respect as a valid investment outside of the comic collecting community?
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208 posts in this topic

21 minutes ago, kav said:

There has to be a flaw in this argument, but I cant see what it is. :cry:

Well, the interest payments for one. A 30 year mortgage at 4% brings the true cost outlay of a $200,000 house up to $350,000. Interest deductions aside, your house has to almost double in value to bring you back to break-even. 

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1 minute ago, october said:

Well, the interest payments for one. A 30 year mortgage at 4% brings the true cost outlay of a $200,000 house up to $350,000. Interest deductions aside, your house has to almost double in value to bring you back to break-even. 

BINGO

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Not to mention unforeseeable things like the neighborhood goes to hell and the house value drops or not making balloon payment and losing entire investment.

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13 minutes ago, october said:

The roof on my AF 15 never needs replacing. 

yes that would be extensive resto

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Amazing fantasy 15 has probably beaten most stocks long term. A book I paid 700 for is now 10,000. People with higher grades made even more. Hulk 1, 181, detective 27 etc. 

And I think comics are a great long term investment compared to stamps because of the movies and the kids that love the characters. Kids today don’t love stamps but every generation seems to love Spider-Man and Batman. You don’t see stamps on backpacks and lunch boxes or at theme parks, you see comic book characters. I see future collectors. 

Ive seen people lose all of their money in stocks but no one who bought cheap on the books I listed lost all of their money (or possibly any depending what they paid)

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9 hours ago, kav said:

Not to mention unforeseeable things like the neighborhood goes to hell and the house value drops

In the UK house prices can still escalate even when local conditions deteriorate significantly.

I've experienced that.

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10 hours ago, october said:

Well, the interest payments for one. A 30 year mortgage at 4% brings the true cost outlay of a $200,000 house up to $350,000. Interest deductions aside, your house has to almost double in value to bring you back to break-even. 

That's if you pay it off over 30 years, it's possible to make that term much shorter, you just make an arrangement to make small additional principal payments and increase them when you can.

I know that was never a very popular idea because of the deductions, but it works. It's really nice once you don't have to pay anything except real estate taxes.

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1 hour ago, skypinkblu said:

 

I know that was never a very popular idea because of the deductions, but it works. It's really nice once you don't have to pay anything except real estate taxes.

bingo, I paid mine off in 11 years. been mortgage free for over 20. when you factor in the interest your paying out just to get the deduction, it did not wash any more.

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13 hours ago, kav said:

Not to mention unforeseeable things like the neighborhood goes to hell and the house value drops or not making balloon payment and losing entire investment.

What would make the neighborhood go to hell?

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On 6/17/2018 at 12:36 PM, eddly said:

 but I'm just curious, do you think graded comics are becoming more respected as an investment over the past 15 years outside of the comic collecting community? Especially interested in hearing feedback from dealers, have your customers changed much over time?

If you meet with a financial advisor I'm guessing they are still not recommending you to have 10% of your portfolio in graded comics...

 

"Collectibles, like art, or stamps or comic books do not have a measurable fundamental value," said Gus Sauter, who served as Vanguard Group's chief investment officer from 2003-2012, in The Wall Street Journal. "Certainly, they provide enjoyment to some people who love to examine them. But the only way to make money investing in collectibles is to find someone who is willing to pay more for them than you did."

In addition, the tax rate on proceeds from selling collectibles is higher than for classes of traditional investments.

So I think there's a good reason why a financial advisor would not recommend a comic book retirement portfolio.  Having said that, we all know anecdotes of folks whose collection have really paid off.  Still, we also know that a lot of us are not getting rich off this hobby.

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4 hours ago, skypinkblu said:
15 hours ago, october said:

Well, the interest payments for one. A 30 year mortgage at 4% brings the true cost outlay of a $200,000 house up to $350,000. Interest deductions aside, your house has to almost double in value to bring you back to break-even. 

That's if you pay it off over 30 years, it's possible to make that term much shorter, you just make an arrangement to make small additional principal payments and increase them when you can.

I know that was never a very popular idea because of the deductions, but it works. It's really nice once you don't have to pay anything except real estate taxes.

Without getting to the politics of good/bad, with the new tax law in America, it probably makes more sense now to pay off your mortgage faster now than it did before.  Meaning, if you can afford it, throw some more principal in every month, even $100 extra helps.  You're likely paying more in interest than you're earning from your savings account, even with a good mortgage rate.

*Of course consult your own tax specialist or financial planner.

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When FF #1 came out in 1961, the DOW was at around 6000. Today it is at around 24,000. If you did nothing but hold for close to 60 years, you would have quadrupled your investment in the stock market. How has FF #1 done in that same time? Oh I know what the argument there is going to be... well the FF #1 just came out and you bought it off the stands at cover price. OK, how has Action #1 done in that same time?

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5 minutes ago, LordRahl said:

When FF #1 came out in 1961, the DOW was at around 6000. Today it is at around 24,000. If you did nothing but hold for close to 60 years, you would have quadrupled your investment in the stock market. How has FF #1 done in that same time? Oh I know what the argument there is going to be... well the FF #1 just came out and you bought it off the stands at cover price. OK, how has Action #1 done in that same time?

So you think people who purchased them off the rack were investing?  I know when I was a kid, I was just buying them to read. That's why they got so scarce, because most people read them and their mother's tossed them...or they were liberated some other way.

What about the cost of an Action 1 now? How would that stand up in time? I know we don't have a time machine, but I can't see it appreciating 300,000 times the original value;) Say you buy a million $ copy, will it be worth that much more in 60 years...I won't be here, so I'll never know;)

Edited by skypinkblu
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6 minutes ago, revat said:

You're likely paying more in interest than you're earning from your savings account, even with a good mortgage rate.

*Of course consult your own tax specialist or financial planner.

From a financial perspective though, the amount you're paying in interest should actually be irrelevant (or is at least secondary) when determining whether or not to pay off your mortgage.  The more important factor is your opportunity cost.  Can I make more elsewhere than I am having to pay in interest?  The long term average growth financial advisors gun for in the stock market is roughly 7%.  Would I rather pay down my mortgage at 3.5% or would I rather take that money and make 7% on it?  (Yes, the market fluctuates, but if you annualize your returns over an extended amount of time, you should see 7%.  Frankly imo, 7% is average and I think your gains should be higher.)

Now, given all of that, there is something to be said about the peace of mind you get knowing you don't have a mortgage hanging over your head.  That you suddenly have an extra $1,000+ a month to save or spend on whatever you want.  To each their own.

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5 hours ago, skypinkblu said:

That's if you pay it off over 30 years, it's possible to make that term much shorter, you just make an arrangement to make small additional principal payments and increase them when you can.

I know that was never a very popular idea because of the deductions, but it works. It's really nice once you don't have to pay anything except real estate taxes.

in my neighborhood, "nice" isn't the word to describe it :cry:

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14 minutes ago, LordRahl said:

When FF #1 came out in 1961, the DOW was at around 6000. Today it is at around 24,000. If you did nothing but hold for close to 60 years, you would have quadrupled your investment in the stock market. How has FF #1 done in that same time? Oh I know what the argument there is going to be... well the FF #1 just came out and you bought it off the stands at cover price. OK, how has Action #1 done in that same time?

Apologies but this is selective reasoning.  You're picking 1 book out of a hundred and you just happen to be picking one of the ones with the greatest value.  If you were to take all books over all time and determine an average gain/loss on "investment" where would you stand?  Do comics as a medium (as a whole) stand up as viable investments?  Everything from AF #15 down to X-Force #1.

(Edit: how many people are original owners?)

Edited by ExNihilo
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