How do I know I am getting Ink on actual pencils and noy just ink? 0

[Blastaar]

 Just bought a OA and it was described as ink on pencils. My question is....how do they know? I attached another pic of OA for reference that shows someone selling both pencils and ink separately. How can I be sure a piece has both and not just the inks? Not sure what process each artist uses. Sorry if this has been brought up multiple times, new to the sight and not sure where to dig first.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 28, 2018 by Blastaar

[malvin]

You would know by asking the seller (assuming he knows and he is truthful) or the inker.

You might also get a sense based on who the artist is and when it was done, since some artists are known to ink over blue lines (or produce digital pencils only).

I don't follow the Leonard Kirk market so I have no clue on your piece.

Malvin

[DarthRawn]

Sometimes the artists do their own inking, other times they just send the art to the inker directly. Look on Venom's left upper elbow that crossed over the blue border, that doesn't look like ink on that bit. Can you tell if that is pencil? 

[Blastaar]

So the options are digital, blue line, or pencils? And blue lines are still pencils...correct? It's just a blue pencil the artist uses that doesn't show up?

[malvin]

10 minutes ago, Blastaar said:

So the options are digital, blue line, or pencils? And blue lines are still pencils...correct? It's just a blue pencil the artist uses that doesn't show up?

not that easy.  Typically when someone says bluelines, it means printed pencils that are blue.  However, some artists use a real blue pencil when drawing their art, so you might see "blue lines" that are hand drawn.

It's not an easy hobby to fully understand...

Malvin

[Bird]

what Malvin said...the printed pencils are typically printed in blue ink (and not black for instance) as the blue does not photocopy and will not impact the final image if they are not perfectly covered up

for that same reason some pencillers use blue pencil in the early stages but I think that practice is less used than it used to be

[BCarter27]

I can't tell from your scan as it is pretty grainy, but typically inks over a blueline stat will have a blue halo throughout. Take couple of natural light photos closeup with a macro function so we can see.

[Dick O.]

8 hours ago, Blastaar said:

So the options are digital, blue line, or pencils? And blue lines are still pencils...correct? It's just a blue pencil the artist uses that doesn't show up?

As excerpted from my OA collecting guide:

Pencillers can now email their pencils (scans or digtal pencils) to the inker, who then prints it out and inks on that copy of the pencils. This is known as “blueline” inks, because the pencil lines are printed in non-photo blue colour. Non-photo blue lines are not captured by the scanner when the inked page is scanned for publication.

Do note that some pencillers use non-photo blue pencils! This way, inks can be applied over the original blue pencil-work and any un-inked blue pencil lines need not be erased, as they won’t be captured when scanned for publication.

 

Edited June 29, 2018 by Dick O.

[Blastaar]

11 hours ago, BCarter27 said:

I can't tell from your scan as it is pretty grainy, but typically inks over a blueline stat will have a blue halo throughout. Take couple of natural light photos closeup with a macro function so we can see.

It's being shipped, should have it in a couple days. Seller assured me it was penciled, and you can vaguely see it run outside the border on Venom's arm.

[PhilipB2k17]

29 minutes ago, Blastaar said:

It's being shipped, should have it in a couple days. Seller assured me it was penciled, and you can vaguely see it run outside the border on Venom's arm.

It’s sometimes easy, sometimes not. One way O check is to look on the back of the art to see if there are pencil indentations. They aren’t always there, of course. But it can help. 

Also, I gave gotten mixed responses from oencillers on whether art was scanned and inked by the inker or not. 

I was on the verge of buying a nice inked page on eBay. But during my research into the piece, Issw that the artist had a scan of the pencils for that same page up on his old Deviant Art site. 

So I found his email and asked him if he recalled whether the page was inked directly or if he sent adigital copy to the inker. 

His answer bothered me. He said it’s been a while but he “thought” he sent the page directly to the inker and it’s inks on pencils. 

A penciller should know his process and how he sends stuff to inkers. 

I also asked him if he “sold” the pencilled Page, and he wouldn’t say. 

So, the moral of the story on modern art is: Do your homework as much as you can. 

[ESeffinga]

1 hour ago, PhilipB2k17 said:

So, the moral of the story on modern art is: Do your homework as much as you can. 

Can't stress this strongly enough. I'm sure I said it years ago in the advice thread, but I often suggest people NOT buy art for a while.

Spend a few months researching the kind of art they are into and ask these kinds of questions here, or of folks on CAF with whom you have a shared collecting interest. My experience is that OA collectors don't really get to talk OA a lot with folks in their daily lives, so they light up like Christmas at the chance to do so. The point is ask and learn BEFORE spending the money. It's easy to ask a question. It can be less easy to get your money back when buying something without understanding what it is you are buying.

OA is not like collecting comics or other manufactured collectibles. Each piece is a unique thing. There is no way to "grade" (nor should there be) and there's no baseline for anything involved. That goes for everything from the price of pieces asked, size an artist works at, to what kind of material they work on. What types of tools they use, and even how they tend to ship work to customers. And then you have the variables in art dealers, art reps, the aftermarket, forgers, fakers and other types of scammers. There is a LOT to take in. Some of the pitfalls you'll just have to learn from as you go, because you'll ignore the sage advice by so many folks in that thread, and you'll make the same mistakes we all have done over the last several decades of collected wisdom. But smart folks will read that thread cover to cover, and take heed. A lot of overlapping suggestions in there, and with very good reason.

The hobby is a super fun one, but all it takes is a few bad deals to sour new folks on it very fast. I've seen so many people jump in, spend a large chunk of money, and then jump back out within a matter of months to a handful of years, but the guys in it long term have learned a lot on their own and from each other. Learning the market before dropping hard cash into it can make for a much more rewarding experience overall.

 

.02¢

[BeholdersEye]

A lot of times simply inquiring with the artist, or fans on boards like there will give you answers to what the known process is, since it's usually artist specific whether they do digital, blueline, etc.

Many of the overseas artists are the ones who trade digital files back and forth between penciler and inker rather than mailing them risking loss, damage or deadline delays.  So, if you see a lot of artists who reside in South America, Asia or Europe who are part of a penciler/inker tandem today, the odds are there might not be the traditional process of original pencils with original inks on top.

Personally, I like to see pencils and inks separate like how The Walking Dead original art is made (and sold), seeing each artist's contributions and the creative process with the final end result that's published.  

[Hekla]

2 hours ago, PhilipB2k17 said:

It’s sometimes easy, sometimes not. One way O check is to look on the back of the art to see if there are pencil indentations. They aren’t always there, of course. But it can help. 

 

If you don't see any indentations and are still unsure about whether or not the blue lines are pencils or printed, you can try erasing a small section of line (pick a line that's at the edge of the page or not part of the main image. of course, only do this if you are comfortable with this process!). colored pencils are waxy and will not erase as easily as graphite, but you would see a fading of the line. Also use white eraser and not a red one (it's gentler on the paper and the pencils).

[malvin]

3 hours ago, PhilipB2k17 said:

It’s sometimes easy, sometimes not. One way O check is to look on the back of the art to see if there are pencil indentations. They aren’t always there, of course. But it can help. 

Also, I gave gotten mixed responses from oencillers on whether art was scanned and inked by the inker or not. 

I was on the verge of buying a nice inked page on eBay. But during my research into the piece, Issw that the artist had a scan of the pencils for that same page up on his old Deviant Art site. 

So I found his email and asked him if he recalled whether the page was inked directly or if he sent adigital copy to the inker. 

His answer bothered me. He said it’s been a while but he “thought” he sent the page directly to the inker and it’s inks on pencils. 

A penciller should know his process and how he sends stuff to inkers. 

I also asked him if he “sold” the pencilled Page, and he wouldn’t say. 

So, the moral of the story on modern art is: Do your homework as much as you can. 

I don't know about that.  I obviously don't know the exact words said between you and the artist, but  pencillers are not always consistent and it's very believable that they won't remember what happened with a specific page.  Many artists I know physically draw art, but use digital if there is a time crunch, or instead of couriering physical page like the normally do, they would send digital scans of it once in a while due to deadlines.

Malvin