Alot Of Scratches On Inner Holders, Newly Graded 0

[Artboy99]

in either case ( newton rings or inner well scratches ) neither product should leave their facility is my opinion.

Imagine getting a car bus painted. Would any of you be happy to see after paying for the service:

-your clear coat over the color paint creating newton rings?

-your freshly painted vehicle arriving with scratches all over it?

To expect your paying customers to tolerate this stuff boggles my mind.

Edited October 5, 2018 by Artboy99

[Bomber-Bob]

12 hours ago, androolx said:

Yes, because for me, the Newton's rings are much more visible than the scratches and distort the true appearance of the book much more than the scratches.  It does irritate me that I paid good money for a damaged (scratched) item.

I'm curious to see if CGC is accepting books with scratches to be reholdered on their dime. They should. As you said, you paid good money for  a damaged item.

[androolx]

2 hours ago, Artboy99 said:

in either case ( newton rings or inner well scratches ) neither product should leave their facility is my opinion.

Imagine getting a car painted. Would any of you be happy to see after paying for the service:

-your clear coat over the color paint creating newton rings?

-your freshly painted vehicle arriving with scratches all over it?

To expect your paying customers to tolerate this stuff boggles my mind.

Totally agree.  The latest scratched holder I got was a re-holder from the early days of the current holder where books would get wavy.  I simply do not want to send it in again.  I sent another message to CGC about the scratched holder phenomenon, expressing my dissatisfaction, and did not hear back.

[Get Marwood & I]

3 hours ago, Artboy99 said:

in either case ( newton rings or inner well scratches ) neither product should leave their facility is my opinion.

Imagine getting a car painted. Would any of you be happy to see after paying for the service:

-your clear coat over the color paint creating newton rings?

-your freshly painted vehicle arriving with scratches all over it?

To expect your paying customers to tolerate this stuff boggles my mind.

Hey, I do the Newton Ring car analogies round here,  alright 

[Artboy99]

2 minutes ago, Get Marwood & I Live! said:

Hey, I do the Newton Ring car analogies round here,  alright 

Ok, in the future I will discuss painting buses then. Does that work?

[Get Marwood & I]

4 minutes ago, Artboy99 said:

Ok, in the future I will discuss painting buses then. Does that work?

Yes. Yes, that will be fine.  

 

[comicdonna]

3 hours ago, Artboy99 said:

in either case ( newton rings or inner well scratches ) neither product should leave their facility is my opinion.

Imagine getting a car painted. Would any of you be happy to see after paying for the service:

-your clear coat over the color paint creating newton rings?

-your freshly painted vehicle arriving with scratches all over it?

To expect your paying customers to tolerate this stuff boggles my mind.

I agree.  I paid $25 for the membership and  $105 for grading and shipping.   Got the book yesterday, and it has a lot of scratches.  I only saw 4 newton rings.  Took the book out today, and I can see newton rings on the whole book, when tilting it.  I used to have 85 slabbed Actions between #1 and #100.  I never saw any newton rings or interior scratches on those books.  I like the clarity and design of the new holder but, it fails due to these new problems.  

[Bomber-Bob]

45 minutes ago, androolx said:

Totally agree.  The latest scratched holder I got was a re-holder from the early days of the current holder where books would get wavy.  I simply do not want to send it in again.  I sent another message to CGC about the scratched holder phenomenon, expressing my dissatisfaction, and did not hear back.

Totally behind you reporting your dissatisfaction to CGC, however, from what I can ascertain they don't respond to correspondence, suggesting they may not even read them. They do answer the phone = it's the only way to communicate with CGC. 

[Bomber-Bob]

3 minutes ago, comicdonna said:

I agree.  I paid $25 for the membership and  $105 for grading and shipping.   Got the book yesterday, and it has a lot of scratches.  I only saw 4 newton rings.  Took the book out today, and I can see newton rings on the whole book, when tilting it.  I used to have 85 slabbed Actions between #1 and #100.  I never saw any newton rings or interior scratches on those books.  I like the clarity and design of the new holder but, it fails due to these new problems.  

From what I can ascertain, I think the main incentive for the new holder design was to prevent tampering. On that aspect they were successful, the holder is a true fortress. The clarity aspect is great but it can enhance the flaws on lower grade books. All these other residual problems prompt me to say I much prefer the previous design. Sorry to hear you moved your Action run, did you keep some personal favorites ? I've always had such a difficult time selling because I inevitably get seller's remorse. How did it work out for you ?

[Get Marwood & I]

15 minutes ago, Bomber-Bob said:

Totally behind you reporting your dissatisfaction to CGC, however, from what I can ascertain they don't respond to correspondence, suggesting they may not even read them. They do answer the phone = it's the only way to communicate with CGC. 

Not 100% true Bob. I got them to make an official announcement in my poll thread. All by email badgering. 

[Get Marwood & I]

18 minutes ago, comicdonna said:

I agree.  I paid $25 for the membership and  $105 for grading and shipping.   Got the book yesterday, and it has a lot of scratches.  I only saw 4 newton rings.  Took the book out today, and I can see newton rings on the whole book, when tilting it.  I used to have 85 slabbed Actions between #1 and #100.  I never saw any newton rings or interior scratches on those books.  I like the clarity and design of the new holder but, it fails due to these new problems.  

Same here. I had ASM 100-200 in second gen holders. Not one single ring, scratch or visibility problem. The new cases are clearer, and a fortress as Bob says, but the visual flaws are simply unacceptable.  Joking aside, and you know how I feel about it if you've read my posts in the NR poll thread, but I simply cannot understand why serious collectors make excuses for CGC in this area. 'Trying to improve things' is just not good enough. 'It's getting better' is not good enough. Would they impart the same good will to their supermarket if a % of their food was always off? Absolutely not! I don't get it. 

[Bomber-Bob]

57 minutes ago, Get Marwood & I Live! said:

Same here. I had ASM 100-200 in second gen holders. Not one single ring, scratch or visibility problem. The new cases are clearer, and a fortress as Bob says, but the visual flaws are simply unacceptable.  Joking aside, and you know how I feel about it if you've read my posts in the NR poll thread, but I simply cannot understand why serious collectors make excuses for CGC in this area. 'Trying to improve things' is just not good enough. 'It's getting better' is not good enough. Would they impart the same good will to their supermarket if a % of their food was always off? Absolutely not! I don't get it. 

Because they have no real competition anymore. If the crossover grading promotion is successful, it will really be the nail in the coffin. In their defense, this is probably not an easy fix. I suspect they are looking into a solution for the rings and the scratches are simply a by product of those attempts. They didn't fix the creep engine design of the new slab immediately either. Personally, I think customers should demonstrate their patience by withholding submissions for a while. 

[Get Marwood & I]

11 minutes ago, Bomber-Bob said:

Because they have no real competition anymore. If the crossover grading promotion is successful, it will really be the nail in the coffin. In their defense, this is probably not an easy fix. I suspect they are looking into a solution for the rings and the scratches are simply a by product of those attempts. They didn't fix the creep engine design of the new slab immediately either. Personally, I think customers should demonstrate their patience by withholding submissions for a while. 

Yes, they should.  But they won't.  Not in any significant numbers anyway. People seem content to live with faults for some reason. They let CGC off the hook like they are a group of children who are 'doing their best'.  Ahh.  Look at the nasty people criticising our CGC. 

I agree, the fix is likely to be difficult, time consuming and costly. The predisposition to rings was either not picked up in development, which is at best clumsy, or it was and a conscious decision was taken to 'justify' them to avoid a financial hit. It's that part that I dislike. The clear attempt to persuade people it was ok to have Rings - normal. And the reluctance to accept returns. The self imposed severity levels. You pay return shipping. Must report in two weeks. Etc.

There's a picture of them all sitting proudly under the heading "5 million items graded", looking like fine upstanding people. I'm sure they are. 

Problems happen. It's how companies deal with them that defines them.

That sounded like a Batman line!

 

[Bomber-Bob]

3 hours ago, Get Marwood & I Live! said:

Yes, they should.  But they won't.  Not in any significant numbers anyway. People seem content to live with faults for some reason. They let CGC off the hook like they are a group of children who are 'doing their best'.  Ahh.  Look at the nasty people criticising our CGC. 

I agree, the fix is likely to be difficult, time consuming and costly. The predisposition to rings was either not picked up in development, which is at best clumsy, or it was and a conscious decision was taken to 'justify' them to avoid a financial hit. It's that part that I dislike. The clear attempt to persuade people it was ok to have Rings - normal. And the reluctance to accept returns. The self imposed severity levels. You pay return shipping. Must report in two weeks. Etc.

There's a picture of them all sitting proudly under the heading "5 million items graded", looking like fine upstanding people. I'm sure they are. 

Problems happen. It's how companies deal with them that defines them.

That sounded like a Batman line!

 

The aspect that bothers me the most is the attempt to persuade people that Rings are okay. That's wrong.

[Callaway29]

4 hours ago, Bomber-Bob said:

Because they have no real competition anymore. If the crossover grading promotion is successful, it will really be the nail in the coffin. In their defense, this is probably not an easy fix. I suspect they are looking into a solution for the rings and the scratches are simply a by product of those attempts. They didn't fix the creep engine design of the new slab immediately either. Personally, I think customers should demonstrate their patience by withholding submissions for a while. 

Bingo. If you’re the ONLY grocery store in town, you hold all the cards.

[Get Marwood & I]

6 hours ago, Bomber-Bob said:

The aspect that bothers me the most is the attempt to persuade people that Rings are okay. That's wrong.

Yes. And more accurately, the self imposed severity criteria. "We (CGC) say when it warrants replacement - not you".

That gets my goat.

[Ride the Tiger]

For sure seems like were dealing with the better of 2 evils. I would have to admit being "almost" ok with the scratches compared to my NR filled holders. If it doesn't get better we may need to start a thread dedicated to the problem and all vote.

[Bhog]

I have just sent 15 books out to be slabbed. 5 have come back and 2 have had tons of scuff marks INSIDE the case. I'm not sure why this has happened, but CGC is now re-slabbing them for me. It's a lot of hassle.

[AlexG_art]

On 12/6/2019 at 12:10 PM, Bhog said:

I have just sent 15 books out to be slabbed. 5 have come back and 2 have had tons of scuff marks INSIDE the case. I'm not sure why this has happened, but CGC is now re-slabbing them for me. It's a lot of hassle.

We’re you able to get the same grade after?

Edited July 21, 2020 by AlexG_art