November HA OA auction
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41 minutes ago, First Upgrade said:

Master of What?!?! Paul Who?!?!...

$21.6K plus sales tax?!?!...

No Thanks!

I would rather buy a McSpidey DPS...

I love Gulacy and have a soft spot for MOKF, but man, 22k doesn't feel like a steal to me either.   Perhaps a touch soft, but not that much?    I mean... on the one hand I want to say that Gene and his cronies know the market better than me, on the other hand, if there are only four of them, that's not a given as the scarcity may drive the private expectations up and not have them play out / be met in public?  2c

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On ‎11‎/‎5‎/‎2018 at 10:21 AM, delekkerste said:

It includes a 23% BP - hammer price was 95K GBP, which was the reserve.

Hey guys... the auction was this year's (2018) Prop Store Entertainment Memorabilia Live Auction.  You can find the results here:

https://sam.propstoreauction.com/view-auctions/catalog/id/138/?page=1&key=&cat=1767&xclosed=no

And, yes, the price with Buyer's Premium is £116,850

With a 1.3625 exchange rate at the time, that comes out to roughly $159k.  

Edited by comiconxion

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What was people general impression of Platinum Mid-afternoon? It seemed pretty balanced to me, for every Gulacy (yeah that was cheap when good panel pages can go 4-5k) it seems their were a "Master Race". I wasnt sure what I thought of the sale of the ASM Romita cover, seemed light or just on target?

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2 hours ago, zhamlau said:

What was people general impression of Platinum Mid-afternoon? It seemed pretty balanced to me, for every Gulacy (yeah that was cheap when good panel pages can go 4-5k) it seems their were a "Master Race". I wasnt sure what I thought of the sale of the ASM Romita cover, seemed light or just on target?

I was pretty bullish in my pre-auction estimates and all of the top-line pieces met, exceeded, or came within an increment of getting to my expectations. 

 

 

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On 11/7/2018 at 9:53 AM, sfcityduck said:

Master Race is already at $156K, and the big bidders likely have not bid yet.  There are a large number of registered phone bidders. So what's the upper limit on such a piece?  I don't think it exists.  I can see savy collectors and cultural institutions driving the bidding in the live auction to multiples of the $156K it sits at now. Here's why:

Master Race is NOT a pop culture collectable like the vast majority of comic original art.  It is NOT a piece which is artistically devoid of merit and derives significance only because of a character appearance (I'm looking at you Hulk 180).  Master Race is culturally significant and influential FINE ART.  And for bidders on fine art, $150K to 250K is, frankly, chump change.  If, as I think is the case, Master Race attracts fine art bidders (probably institutions), then we could see the price driven up to shocking heights by an epic battle between cultural institutions and comic art collectors.

If any comic book story belongs in a serious museum, it is surely Master Race.  It is accurately referred to as the "Citizen Kane" of comic books.  It's artistic merit is seriously discussed in the serious press.  The first and last pages of that story are arguably the two most influential comic pages ever drawn.  They are a masterpiece of comic art.  In short, the significance, reputation and value for Master Race will likely only grow over time as its influence becomes more and more appreciated, whereas some of the other big ticket comic art faces the prospect of fading as the characters which drive the value of those pages lose popularity and significance.  Yes, people love Wolverine, but Herb Trimpe is no fine artist and one panel depicting a superhero who looks like a refugee from the musical Cats is never going to end up in a serious museum or artistic study.   Master Race, on the other hand, is truly fine art.  

So here's my prediction:  I predict Master Race to break $450K at least, and the sky is the limit.  I would not be shocked at all to see it beat the Hulk 180 page. 

 

Damn.  Master Race just missed at $600K compared to $657K for Hulk 180 page.  

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The Peanuts 1953 Sunday with personalized note was available on Alberts website a few months before this auction for $36k and it was available for quite a while.  Final hammer today was $63k :whatthe:  Guess the buyer doesn't spend much time looking around on the internet, but I guess it was only a $27k premium over what they could have paid.

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My random thoughts....

IH 330 cover - it's hideous, 33k seems like a massive overpay. A classic example of box checking and not actually looking at the art.

The Mignola Action comics story seemed strong for non-peak non Hellboy art, but the pages were pretty nice.

The Wrightson Twisted Tales cover coming up at auction again for the 3rd time in six years has impressively appreciated each time.

Most of the covers seemed strong in general.

GSXM #1 and X-Men #94 pages seemed reasonable coming for "key" issues.

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1 hour ago, NinjaSealed said:

The Mignola Action comics story seemed strong for non-peak non Hellboy art, but the pages were pretty nice

I'd be curious why the winner bid... Mignola fan or nostalgia for that Action 600 issue? Either way, I liked that sequence in that issue.

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3 hours ago, NinjaSealed said:

My random thoughts....

IH 330 cover - it's hideous, 33k seems like a massive overpay. A classic example of box checking and not actually looking at the art.

The Mignola Action comics story seemed strong for non-peak non Hellboy art, but the pages were pretty nice.

The Wrightson Twisted Tales cover coming up at auction again for the 3rd time in six years has impressively appreciated each time.

Most of the covers seemed strong in general.

GSXM #1 and X-Men #94 pages seemed reasonable coming for "key" issues.

What was Amazing Adventures’ original price tag on that Hulk 330? 65k? It’s funny how I forgot since I’d see that cover in person every other month for a few years. That cover is just *a tad* more impressive in person than an online scan though that might not be saying much. Of course, when I asked to see the cover up close the seller treated me like a common thief. :mad: This is the same seller who has that really nice Bernie Wrightson Star-Lord pin-up. Maybe that’ll go up on auction. 

All neither here nor there. 

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8 hours ago, Bronty said:

I love Gulacy and have a soft spot for MOKF, but man, 22k doesn't feel like a steal to me either.   Perhaps a touch soft, but not that much?    I mean... on the one hand I want to say that Gene and his cronies know the market better than me, on the other hand, if there are only four of them, that's not a given as the scarcity may drive the private expectations up and not have them play out / be met in public?  2c

It may very well be the case that expectations were simply too high and/or outdated.  We haven't seen one of these Gulacy MOKF covers trade hands in a long, long time, and I suspect that the very real pent-up demand that used to exist may just not be there anymore.  If this cover had been offered to me, say, 3-4 years ago at $30K, I would have snapped it up in a heartbeat.  My friend is a big MOKF guy, and I suspect he would have been interested at that level a few years ago as well.  But, both of us (40-something collectors) have moved on somewhat, and I suspect that a lot of the 50-somethings who used to covet these covers so much have moved on as well.  Not necessarily to buying other art, but just other things (private school tuitions have been mentioned to me a couple of times recently by two formerly very active collectors, for example).  

I'm seeing evidence of a generational fade-out with other '70s material as well.  A very good Ploog cover sold privately recently - for a decent price, yes...but, only 20% above what I was willing to pay in 2010 when I was trying to pry it loose from the former owner's collection (I don't think that's even kept up with inflation over the past 8 years). While BWS Weapon X is hot, BWS Conan has basically flatlined (at best) for the past several years.  I'd be very worried about that great Kaluta piece at CLink if I was the consignor.  

So, anyway, Gulacy MOKF?  Perhaps it is the case that the best time to sell was a few years ago.  I suspect that the best time to sell a lot of '80s material is right now (paging Walter Simonson...), and that prices 10-15 years from now, far from continuing to soar higher on nostalgia, will actually be softer (at least accounting for inflation) as the 40-somethings age out of the '80s material like the 50-somethings are starting to with a lot of the touchstone material from the '70s. 2c 

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4 hours ago, NinjaSealed said:

My random thoughts....

IH 330 cover - it's hideous, 33k seems like a massive overpay. A classic example of box checking and not actually looking at the art.

The Mignola Action comics story seemed strong for non-peak non Hellboy art, but the pages were pretty nice.

The Wrightson Twisted Tales cover coming up at auction again for the 3rd time in six years has impressively appreciated each time.

Most of the covers seemed strong in general.

GSXM #1 and X-Men #94 pages seemed reasonable coming for "key" issues.

Hulk #330 is hideous, I agree.  I'm very bearish on C-examples by A-creators...the "worst house in the best neighborhood" thesis doesn't work with OA, IMO.  I just think that these pieces are going to be among the most vulnerable to falling by the wayside in the coming years.  It's already not easy to sell this kind of material; when the OA market eventually shrinks due to demographics (as I think it eventually will), it will just get even harder to move this kind of material.  

I regret missing out on the Wrightson TT the first time it came around (I made a play for it then).  I'm actually a bit shocked that it has now managed two price increases despite being re-auctioned so quickly both times. 

The two Herriman Krazy Kat Sundays went strong.  The $50K one in particular was stunning - I'm glad it went high as I might have felt some regret otherwise passing it up. 

Kirby experts - what do you think about the Hulk page and the Sinnott-inked Annual page?  Both seemed a touch soft to me, but, I don't follow this part of the market closely anymore. 

XM 94 is a beautifully drawn issue; $21.6K for a memorable, but new X-Men-less, page seems about right.  I thought that page was better than the GSXM 1 page, personally..

Howard the Duck #1 splash at $43.2K...as per my post about '70s art above, I bet this stuff ages very badly from a market perspective.  Re-auction this one in 10-15 years and my bet is that it hasn't kept pace with inflation. Not that it isn't very cool, though!

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12 hours ago, delekkerste said:

HOLY :censored: 

Somebody call the cops - someone STOLE that Gulacy MOKF cover at only $18K hammer ($21.6K with the juice).  That is crazy low.  If I hadn't missed the first 25 minutes of the auction and had seen that, I definitely would have thrown in a higher bid.  Wow, just wow. 

I was the underbidder.  Based on what you guys were predicting, I thought it was going to go for way more.  Of course who knows what the winner was willing to go up to, but I was really surprised that my bid held up until the end.

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11 hours ago, delekkerste said:

For sure.  He only did 4 MOKF covers (#51, 55, 64 and 67) and the consensus among the savvy collectors I spoke to was $30-40K due to the scarcity value.  $21.6K was an absolute steal...I feel bad for the consignor as I know from his having previously offered it that his expectations were quite a bit higher. 

This just confirms what I've thought, that there are no MOKF Gulacy fans out there.  At least none who are big spenders.

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6 hours ago, tth2 said:

This just confirms what I've thought, that there are no MOKF Gulacy fans out there.  At least none who are big spenders.

There's one out there who is a BSD. I would not be surprised if he won it and would have gone much higher had he been pushed. 

That said, it's been noted to me that the "old time EC collector" gang aren't writing big checks these days, with the exception of Halperin.  And that the (Jeff) "Jones Mafia" only has a few members these days, none of whom are writing big checks either.  Similar situations exist with other niche artists and genres/characters/publishers in our hobby - a lot of the '70s and earlier material is clearly starting to feel the impact of aging and demographics (there's literally only ONE GUY buying non-mainstream Golden Age hero art in any quantity these days!!). Doesn't mean that prices are necessarily tanking at the moment, but, decreasing liquidity, fewer buyers and not keeping up with the rest of the market are the canaries in the coal mine for what is likely to be a secular decline in interest, IMO. 

6 hours ago, O. said:

I've been expecting this to happen, but mid-quality '70s superhero OA seems to be holding strong following the past couple years' price upticks (shrug) 

So far, yes.  But, I wouldn't be surprised to see a lot of '70s and '80s mainstream Marvel and DC eventually feel the pinch as well, as those who loved that material best age out and pull back. The early, historic stuff may get a bid just for being what it is, but, I think there's a lot of stuff that came afterwards that are, in the grand scheme of things, more "memorable" than "important".  Unfortunately, memories and nostalgia are fickle things...

And I'm not just talking my book here - I don't, by and large, collect Silver Age art (the most "historic" stuff, at least as far as Marvel goes), and I have actually turned into a net seller of OA in general, so it's certainly not in my self-interest to talk down prices! 

I suspect that some of the early '80s indie stuff is also already going this way (tier-B and C artists/titles) as well.  I think a lot greater % of the vintage art market is going to be subject to changing tastes than demographics than people think in the coming years/decades.  Don't think your beloved '90s drek is going to be immune, DickO.!

Edited by delekkerste

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16 hours ago, Bronty said:

that was a very cool piece

Both that Ditko and the Gulacy MOKF. Not the kind of money I'm spending this quarter, but wow - two absolute winners for very different types of collections (generally speaking). Meanwhile...

Was very interested in seeing what this old friend would hammer for in the current environment:

Dave Cockrum and Bob McLeod X-Men #94 Story Page 5 Original Art (Marvel, 1975) Dave Cockrum and Bob McLeod X-Men #94 Story Page 5 Original Art (Marvel, 1975)....

Auction 7192 | Lot: 91006 | Nov 15, 2018
Sold For:  $21,600.00
 
And now some history (for the new owner and everyone else too) - I bought this from the original owner for $200 (shipped!) in December 1999. He bought it direct from Dave in 1975 for $50. I think he may have overpaid and I'm certain that I got the steal 24 years later.
 
Decided it didn't really fit my collection, I'm more a 2nd run Dave fan and this example is rather flat except for panels 2,3, and 8. I offered it to everybody with money back then (pick a name, any name, all serious dealers and self-proclaimed spending stupid money and I pay top dollar folks). Nobody wanted it at all or offered more than salvage value (what I paid or...gah!...less lol ) so I put it up on eBay, $1 open and no reserve, resulting in $2,162 close in March 2000. 10x in four months. That was double what I was looking for privately. Good times! Took another 19 years for the next ten-bag to happen (nearly to the penny even, wow!) I'm good with my decision then (though I wasn't always so certain going back some years) and I definitely made more than 10x, several times over, with what the $2k got me instead :) Thank god I reinvested and didn't buy a beater car for the winter or go on a cruise ha ha ha...

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7 hours ago, delekkerste said:

I'm seeing evidence of a generational fade-out with other '70s material as well.  A very good Ploog cover sold privately recently - for a decent price, yes...but, only 20% above what I was willing to pay in 2010 when I was trying to pry it loose from the former owner's collection (I don't think that's even kept up with inflation over the past 8 years). While BWS Weapon X is hot, BWS Conan has basically flatlined (at best) for the past several years.  I'd be very worried about that great Kaluta piece at CLink if I was the consignor.  

 

More worried for the consignor or the person who wins it this time around. The Kaluta was on CAF for a short time. Based on the asking price on CAF I won't be in the market for the Conan piece even if a fraction of the ask. I don't know his market, at all it seems.

That said, I'd love one of Kaluta's Dragonlance covers and the Metropolis piece Albert has is pretty amazing as well.

Edited by cstojano

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30 minutes ago, delekkerste said:

 

I suspect that some of the early '80s indie stuff is also already going this way (tier-B and C artists/titles) as well.  I think a lot greater % of the vintage art market is going to be subject to changing tastes than demographics than people think in the coming years/decades.  Don't think your beloved '90s drek is going to be immune, DickO.!

The 80s indy stuff is so cheap though.    Doesn't have far to fall outside a few small exceptions?   (shrug)    What titles are you thinking of?

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5 minutes ago, vodou said:

Both that Ditko and the Gulacy MOKF. Not the kind of money I'm spending this quarter, but wow - two absolute winners for very different types of collections (generally speaking). Meanwhile...

Was very interested in seeing what this old friend would hammer for in the current environment:

Dave Cockrum and Bob McLeod X-Men #94 Story Page 5 Original Art (Marvel, 1975) Dave Cockrum and Bob McLeod X-Men #94 Story Page 5 Original Art (Marvel, 1975)....

Auction 7192 | Lot: 91006 | Nov 15, 2018
Sold For:  $21,600.00
 
And now some history (for the new owner and everyone else too) - I bought this from the original owner for $200 (shipped!) in December 1999.

those were the days hey.   I wasn't buying comic OA then but I can relate with similar stories on the material I was buying starting in 02.

Edited by Bronty

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13 hours ago, sfcityduck said:

Damn.  Master Race just missed at $600K compared to $657K for Hulk 180 page.  

The market isn't ready for non-superhero to beat superhero, Crumb Felix cover being the exception that just could not be held back ;)

That's how we all know that comic art still isn't fine art. Yet.

$600k isn't cheap but I think it will be in hindsight by the investor-types 5-10 years down the road. There are essentially no nostalgia-types for MR except maybe the first wave UG folks that haven't passed away yet.

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