November HA OA auction
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6 minutes ago, vodou said:

The market isn't ready for non-superhero to beat superhero, Crumb Felix cover being the exception that just could not be held back ;)

That's how we all know that comic art still isn't fine art. Yet.

$600k isn't cheap but I think it will be in hindsight by the investor-types 5-10 years down the road. There are essentially no nostalgia-types for MR except maybe the first wave UG folks that haven't passed away yet.

I see the opposite happening.   I think at 600k MR is a terrible investment.   Now, I'm sure the collector who bought it is smarter than me but kudos for having 600k to throw at it, but I don't see where demand for that comes from in the future.  As you say, not a nostalgia kind of piece and for the price to advance as 'art'... its just not going to happen.   Comic art isn't fine art and its never going to be.   It is its own animal.   Elevating MR to some gaudy height would require connoisseurship of the medium, appreciating the impact on Miller, appreciating Miller's impact on the industry, etc etc and I see less people caring about history, not more, as we go forward.    It seems to be more about the common denominators... Marvel covers, men in tights.  etc.

The only thing that might save it is if the publicity from this sale, etc, is enough to give the piece attention going forward, etc. 

 

Edited by Bronty

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9 minutes ago, Bronty said:

those were the days hey.   I wasn't buying comic OA then but I can relate with similar stories on the material I was buying starting in 02.

Yahoo! Japan was my best friend 2001-2012 ;) then I backed off as the exchange rate went against me. Getting interested again though as 100:1/under is looking likely.

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7 minutes ago, Bronty said:

...I see less people...

Wrong people. The trend is your friend until it isn't. Everything is cyclical. The long trend (superhero, 30+ years) has been nostalgia, which is dying off (literally and figuratively). The question isn't how high will the current (bull) chart take us in our lifetimes but rather what will disrupt (kill the bull) that chart and what will the new chart represent (non-superhero? why?) Much different people will be attracted soon enough with notably different tastes.

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13 hours ago, batman_fan said:

The Peanuts 1953 Sunday with personalized note was available on Alberts website a few months before this auction for $36k and it was available for quite a while.  Final hammer today was $63k :whatthe:  Guess the buyer doesn't spend much time looking around on the internet, but I guess it was only a $27k premium over what they could have paid.

Actually I just checked, it's still on Albert's site, and it was $55K. 

http://www.albertmoy.com/gallerypiece.asp?Piece=14416

Edited by artcollector9

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59 minutes ago, delekkerste said:

...the (Jeff) "Jones Mafia" only has a few members these days, none of whom are writing big checks either.

So true. We haven't seen wholesale dumping here. Yet. It nearly happened two years ago except reserves (or rather high open bids) were in place. Will we see this soon, some folks are just plain old now, or will the bottom continue to be protected? I'd be very happy to get certain right JJ pieces 1/10th former fmv.

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27 minutes ago, Bronty said:

I see the opposite happening.   I think at 600k MR is a terrible investment.   Now, I'm sure the collector who bought it is smarter than me but kudos for having 600k to throw at it, but I don't see where demand for that comes from in the future.  As you say, not a nostalgia kind of piece and for the price to advance as 'art'... its just not going to happen.   Comic art isn't fine art and its never going to be.   It is its own animal.   Elevating MR to some gaudy height would require connoisseurship of the medium, appreciating the impact on Miller, appreciating Miller's impact on the industry, etc etc and I see less people caring about history, not more, as we go forward.    It seems to be more about the common denominators... Marvel covers, men in tights.  etc.

The only thing that might save it is if the publicity from this sale, etc, is enough to give the piece attention going forward, etc. 

 

If it ended up with Halperin, I guess it'll hit the market again at some point, unless he donates it to a museum later on down the line (which could very well happen).  If it ended up with Lucas, then it's off the market for good most likely.  So, either way, I'd say there's a good chance we won't ever see MR again at auction. 

I totally agree with you on comic art being its own animal.  To the extent that there is crossover, it's the auteurs - Crumb, Clowes, Miller's indie stuff, etc. and maybe a few high profile mainstream projects/creators (e.g., Moore/Gibbons Watchmen, Miller DKR, etc.) that will get recognized.  The mainstream commercial, collaborative efforts...maybe some '60s Kirby and Ditko get recognized, but, most stuff will not be.  What fine art case is to be made for putting John Buscema or John Romita into a museum?  None.  They didn't create the biggest characters they worked on, by and large, and were just part of a group effort to create these books.  Why would anyone with a fine art background care about the first appearance of Wolverine?  Maybe a case could be made for, say, Black Panther given the social/cultural tie-in, but, the first appearance of a popular character beyond perhaps the original early 1960s (for Marvel) and late 1930s/early 1940s (for DC) characters is not going to get any scholarly backing from the Establishment.  Ever.  2c 

Edited by delekkerste

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2 minutes ago, delekkerste said:

...I'd say there's a good chance we won't ever see MR again at auction.

Correct. New price: priceless (aka Mona Lisa). And that's how $600k will look to fresh eyes (to the "hobby") in 5-10 years time. Since have Doc's Delorean in my garage I can quote the future: "$600k to Priceless in five years = infinite ROI ;) "

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7 hours ago, tth2 said:

This just confirms what I've thought, that there are no MOKF Gulacy fans out there.  At least none who are big spenders.

The winner is a big spender. Whom I suspect would have bid substantially more if he had to. Apparently, one other big spender was asked to stand down, to lessen the chance of that. But regardless, the pool does not appear to be very deep.

I also believe what happened here is that other potential bidders were scared off/turned off by the seller's asking price (prior to consignment). And perhaps just put it out of their mind. It happened previously with this great DKR page:

https://comics.ha.com/itm/original-comic-art/frank-miller-and-klaus-janson-batman-the-dark-knight-returns-4-superman-vs-batman-page-40-original-art-dc-198/a/7059-92259.s?ic4=ListView-ShortDescription-071515

Owner had shopped it privately for years with a pie-in-the-sky number. No takers. Worse, many were offended. So by the time he consigned it to HA, some big spenders who would have otherwise been engaged, had already written it off.

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3 minutes ago, Nexus said:

...

Owner had shopped it privately for years with a pie-in-the-sky number. No takers. Worse, many were offended. So by the time he consigned it to HA, some big spenders who would have otherwise been engaged, had already written it off.

Felix, interesting phenomenon you describe and one I've experienced myself. There's a high five figure piece that I couldn't pay more than mid/low four figures for because I'm just "off" it due to the original ask being so far out...I'm out. Shame as I should love it but instead, for me to catch it you'd almost have to throw it at me with a bag of cash attached. It's not rational, and that's always fun to explore too.

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7 minutes ago, Nexus said:

The winner is a big spender. Whom I suspect would have bid substantially more if he had to. Apparently, one other big spender was asked to stand down, to lessen the chance of that. But regardless, the pool does not appear to be very deep.

When you phrase it that way, it's obvious who the two collectors were (which I guess speaks to how shallow the pool is).  Not 100% sure who won it and who was asked to stand down, but, zero points for guessing the identities of the two!

Edited by delekkerste

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1 hour ago, NinjaSealed said:

Yeah, I’d like to know as well. 

IMO, his art is reminiscent of an art school student trying to make it. So this is particularly baffling. 

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19 minutes ago, Mr. Machismo said:

Yeah, I’d like to know as well. 

IMO, his art is reminiscent of an art school student trying to make it. So this is particularly baffling. 

I have no idea who he is, but, I think the art is very cool!

I like it better than Greg Capullo's Batman. :fear: 

But, yeah, the price is still baffling. 

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50 minutes ago, delekkerste said:

I have no idea who he is, but, I think the art is very cool!

I like it better than Greg Capullo's Batman.  :fear:

But, yeah, the price is still baffling. 

It makes less sense to me than ASM #328.

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2 hours ago, vodou said:

for me to catch it you'd almost have to throw it at me with a bag of cash attached. It's not rational, and that's always fun to explore too.

 

20181116_113313.jpg

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2 hours ago, Mr. Machismo said:

Yeah, I’d like to know as well. 

IMO, his art is reminiscent of an art school student trying to make it. So this is particularly baffling. 

Marini prices for european art seem to be around 5k euro and up.  here in north america, you might recall his work back in the day featured by heavy metal. Raptors and Gypsy were 2 of his stories. I enjoyed both - but Gypsy -especially was cool for akira fans -as aped the style of that movie with all new characters.  his recent work is Scorpion (an english translation has been released for some of it). included some images below.

 

 

coverimage_2576906.png

gypsy.jpg

scorpion.jpg

ad27205cf89bc465e47feaf3e0153919.jpg

Edited by Panelfan1

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1 hour ago, delekkerste said:

I have no idea who he is, but, I think the art is very cool!

I like it better than Greg Capullo's Batman. :fear: 

But, yeah, the price is still baffling. 

I don't get the price but the artwork is solid. Good command, solid posing, nice eye for color and perspective. 

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